Question regarding the state of Syracuse football

[matcuse]

I know losing to uconn was unacceptable...trust me i actually started swearing at the tv like my old man does... but lets face it...as a fan of syracuse football why are our expectations so high coming off a solid victory over K-State in the Pinstripe Bowl last season? I thought it was great for the program but lets be honest with ourselves...Defense wise we had seniors who were a big part of that team that carried us through most of that season...with new players on defense and limited talent on offense...its about where we probably should be...you can say its coaching anf marrone will never get us to that next level but let me remind you that this is only year 3 for him and he pretty much inherited a division 1AA program when he took over..i was little back in the early 80's but if im not mistakened, didnt it take coach mac 5-6 years to bring the program back to people respecting us again...patience is a virtue and reason why i havent had a meltdown yet because i remember who the coach was before him and thank god coach marrone is here trying to rebuild what once was a fun team to watch...it wont happen over night but take a look at those 4 seasons prior to coach marrone and think to yourselves...why am i upset again? coach marrone has a lot of work to do and we all know it. please dont quit on him and the football team...afterall hes one of us and it could take 2-3 more yrs... patience.

 

[orangenirvana]

I had us going 5-7 this season. I figured it would be a rebuilding year after losing so many valuable seniors and replacing them with (unheralded) freshmen for the most part. Maybe my expectations were too low but that's what I thought.

I was (and still am) expecting 2012 to be the true breakout season. I fully expect 9 or 10 wins if we're still in the Big East. Top 25 regardless of conference affliation.

That was/is my hope and if Marrone is "the man" that's what I expect.

But this season? I knew it would be a let down after last season's success. And I figured fans would freak out about it.

 

[OrangePA]

At this point no loss is "unacceptable."

We are not yet good enough to feel that way.

Hopefully we will be there soon.

 

[OrangeinBoston]

From a "big picture" point of view, of course you're right. I think there are things that need attention to make sure SU gets there. SU really needs a special teams coach because it's clear that there is not enough attention being paid here. SU lost one game in large part to poor special teams play (to the Snookies) and the same contributed significantly to the loss to UCONN. Also, SU needs an offensive coordinator badly. The first half vs UCONN where, once again, they beat their heads agains a stone wall is case in point. But, yes it will take time and I hope Marrone will get SU there.

That being said, the picture, when looked at from the perspective of the last two games, is really troubling. They smoke a then-ranked WVU team and then come out flat against an admittedly rapidly improving Louisville team. OK, chalk that one up to "youth" and not knowing how to "manage success." Then, they come out totally unprepared to play a frankly crummy UCONN team, can't tackle, can't stop a team that ran basically 2 plays in the second half. Now, there's a pattern. And yes, I know it is heresay (but this board often is way ahead of what is reported publically), but there may be something going on internally. I hope Marrone can get this fixed, whatever it is. It's important because if they end the season on a 5 game skid, it will shake the confidence of the coaches in the players and vice versa. Also, it may cause recruits to think hard about SU.

My point is that the "big picture" is clearly important. But, what good is it if you don't survive the next few weeks?

 

[OttoinGrotto]

At this point no loss is "unacceptable."

We are not yet good enough to feel that way.

Hopefully we will be there soon.

This is not a winner's mentality.

 

[Rocco]

After the WVU win, every fan's expectations of this team became extremely elevated. Then you drop 2 straight tough losses, and this is where we are. If we lost to WVU, these losses wouldn't have been as "surprising". They need to come out and play FAST from the start on Friday night in order to have a chance against USF.

 

[rrlbees]

While we did lose a couple of very good defensive players, we returned a lot on offense. Other teams also lost players on either or both sides of the ball. We can't live in the vacuum that says only SU loses players or gets injuries. Once the season started and we saw just how weak the BE was, it further raised my expectations that we could pretty much beat any team on our schedule save USC. We should not be losing every game against teams that are no better than us. No matter where we are today with talent, coaching, etc, we should not have lost to all 3 of rutgers, Lville and UConn. We should have won 2 of the 3 and even 1 could be argues as being OK. Losing all 3 should not meet anyone's expectations. If it did, then those people are just making excuses.

 

[cuseincincy]

Expectations rose due to

1. How obvious is has become that the rest of the conference stinks.
2. The WVU win.
3. Close wins against crappy teams.

 

[kingtidge]

Here's my issue: The loss to Louisville... OK, I can stomach that... Would have been nice to win, but not a terrible loss either.

UCONN: A terrible loss. The way we have played at times this year, one could argue this game should have been easily within hand at halftime.

But that is the issue: Why are we so wildly inconsistent?

We obviously have serviceable talent and we are at the point in the season where consistency should be much improved. But it isn't and unlike last year when we went through this same stretch a mess with key injuries, we are relatively healthy and starting the players that should yield consistency.

The inability for our team to come out a play at a consistent level is a MAJOR problem and the difference in performance (between the team that beat #11 WV and the team that lost to UCONN, Rutgers and almost Tulane is astounding). We look like a borderline top 25 team at times and a D2A poorly coached squad at others.

The swath between our high mark and low mark in performances is baffling and it's on the coaches - no question. Getting players ready to play, playing disciplined with strong fundamentals - that is what you hire a coach to do... Good coaches get players to bring it every week. Now, teams will lose games due to poor performance and execution, but the effort should always be evident. I don't think we can say that the effort has been there in every game this year.

The UCONN game - our team was not ready to play when the whistle blew... and it was clearly obvious. And the specials team play and complete implosion of proper tackling fundamentals on D?? It is maddening.

Also, Special Teams Coaching by Committee = EPIC FAIL. Even with the other warts evident in this game, we still win it if we had some semblance of fair to poor special teams play on kickoffs. Our kickoff packages are an absolute abomination.

I've been a Marrone supporter for sure, but I am beginning to question his abilities at this point - and I think that's a fair criticism and we have ominous evidence to be worried.

I hope he and Shafer pull it together and prove that these concerns are unfounded.

 

[orangenirvana]

While we did lose a couple of very good defensive players, we returned a lot on offense. Other teams also lost players on either or both sides of the ball. We can't live in the vacuum that says only SU loses players or gets injuries. Once the season started and we saw just how weak the BE was, it further raised my expectations that we could pretty much beat any team on our schedule save USC. We should not be losing every game against teams that are no better than us. No matter where we are today with talent, coaching, etc, we should not have lost to all 3 of rutgers, Lville and UConn. We should have won 2 of the 3 and even 1 could be argues as being OK. Losing all 3 should not meet anyone's expectations. If it did, then those people are just making excuses.

Yeah but you can't just ignore the fact that the offense stunk in 2010 when looking at the high number of returning starters. And the glimpses of production we saw came from Carter and Sales for the most part.

And at this point in time, losing NFL-caliber players hurts SU more than most programs. Just the way it is.

 

[OrangePA]

This is not a winner's mentality.

Uh huh.

Sorry, but "unacceptable" is the word of a lay person who has never competed at a high level.

Losing is inevitable - losing teaches and clarifies.

Trying to characterize it as "unacceptable" is mindless bravado.

What happened to children at the Penn State athletic facility is "unacceptable."

The failure to stop it is "unacceptable."

That is how that word should be used.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Uh huh.

Sorry, but "unacceptable" is the word of a lay person who has never competed at a high level.

Losing is inevitable - losing teaches and clarifies.

Trying to characterize it as "unacceptable" is mindless bravado.

What happened to children at the Penn State athletic facility is "unacceptable."

The failure to stop it is "unacceptable."

That is how that word should be used.

Have to agree with PA here...

 

[zibby]

Obviously none of you watched UConn play UB. UConn only gained 293 yards on offense and 113 of those were on two plays. They scored 17 points against a team that's given up at least 31 in each of its succeeding five games.

UConn lost to Vanderbilt. And Iowa State.

There is no spinning this loss.

 

[cuseincincy]

UC had a terrible defense last year. Returned most of that unit. They lost most of their o-line and their top WR & TE. They are much better this year. I firmly believe that UC is not better than SU. They are not more talented. They went 4-8 last year after Kelly left the cupboard bare. They are better coached, and that's disappointing to me.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

At this point no loss is "unacceptable."

We are not yet good enough to feel that way.

Hopefully we will be there soon.

Uh huh.

Sorry, but "unacceptable" is the word of a lay person who has never competed at a high level.

Losing is inevitable - losing teaches and clarifies.

Trying to characterize it as "unacceptable" is mindless bravado.

What happened to children at the Penn State athletic facility is "unacceptable."

The failure to stop it is "unacceptable."

That is how that word should be used.

You're contradicting yourself there, chief.

Previous post you say that at some point it will be acceptable to call a loss "unacceptable." Some day we'll be good enough to call it that, but that day isn't today.

Next post you say calling a loss unacceptable is "mindless bravado" and the only thing that really qualifies as unacceptable is the sort of horrible stuff that happened at Penn State.

If you're going to try to take some sort of moral high ground over me, at least do yourself the favor of not contradicting yourself.

 

[OrangePA]

You're contradicting yourself there, chief.

Previous post you say that at some point it will be acceptable to call a loss "unacceptable." Some day we'll be good enough to call it that, but that day isn't today.

Next post you say calling a loss unacceptable is "mindless bravado" and the only thing that really qualifies as unacceptable is the sort of horrible stuff that happened at Penn State.

If you're going to try to take some sort of moral high ground over me, at least do yourself the favor of not contradicting yourself.

I guess you may be right. Although I didn't say it, my post may suggest it.

So, you're right. To the extent that I suggested that losing can be "unaceptable" I was wrong.

I don't think a loss is ever that traumatic.

Sorry.

 

[cuseguy]

Obviously none of you watched UConn play UB. UConn only gained 293 yards on offense and 113 of those were on two plays. They scored 17 points against a team that's given up at least 31 in each of its succeeding five games.

UConn lost to Vanderbilt. And Iowa State.

There is no spinning this loss.

And Iowa State beat Texas Tech 41-7. And Tech beat Oklahoma on the road. So go figure.

 

[matcuse]

You're contradicting yourself there, chief.

Previous post you say that at some point it will be acceptable to call a loss "unacceptable." Some day we'll be good enough to call it that, but that day isn't today.

Next post you say calling a loss unacceptable is "mindless bravado" and the only thing that really qualifies as unacceptable is the sort of horrible stuff that happened at Penn State.

If you're going to try to take some sort of moral high ground over me, at least do yourself the favor of not contradicting yourself.

compared to the situation at "State Perv"..i hope we never go through this type of bullcrap..it makes the situation at Miami look like an oversight.. i guess what im trying to say is im happy being an SU guy...

 

[rrlbees]

Yeah but you can't just ignore the fact that the offense stunk in 2010 when looking at the high number of returning starters. And the glimpses of production we saw came from Carter and Sales for the most part.

And at this point in time, losing NFL-caliber players hurts SU more than most programs. Just the way it is.

We are better on offense this year. Bailey will finish with near as many yards as Carter averaging 6ypg less. Sales? Until the bowl he was hardly used and we are significantly better this year in the passing game. Don't forget we returned 4 starting OL also. They should have been better. It didn't seem to hurt Lville that they lost 4 starting OL and started several freshman on their offense. My expectation is not that we would lose to all 3 of those teams. There is no way of convincing me that it should have been expected.