Re: James Southerland

[iommi]

Obviously he has been the breakout star of our young season (along with MCW). He looks like he's poised to have a monster senior year and his confidence is through the roof.

There is one specific area of development which tells me he will be hard to defend this year: his ability to take the ball off the dribble and shoot the mid-range jumper or take the ball to the rim. Now I know what you're thinking: iommi, he's coming off a game where that asshat, Jimmy Dykes, just said about 48 times that Arkansas never made James put the ball on the floor. That may well have been true but what about our previous four games? In those games, James showed a newly-honed capacity to fake the three-pointer and then hit the pull-up jumper. This will be huge. Teams will see James lighting it up from three on film. Opposing coaches will instruct their players to fly out to James when he's open for three. He then can use his shot fake (Bobby Knight will have a hard time controlling his excitement) and go to the basket or then use his mid-range game, or even set up his teammates for easy scores.

Here's the other thing: how will teams defend us when our other shooters start draining their outside shots? So far, James has been our only threat from deep. That will change.

LGO!

 

[Flacusian]

Alas! Bobby Knight and the lost art of the "Shot Fake"

 

[bozophobe]

Bobby Knight could do a folding chair shot fake like nobody's business. You never knew when it was coming for your head.

 

[bozophobe]

And yeah, when the others start to hit (like Brandon's 2nd half Friday?), look out. This is such a glass-half-full situation, it isn't funny.

What top teams are hot from outside now? Maybe they should be the ones worrying.

 

[dlegend44]

Southerland is a more athletic version of Preston Shumpert. If James gets enough minutes he can easily average 20+ ppg.

 

[bozophobe]

Definitely - but game-by-game numbers will definitely be wildly varied, given his primary reliance on the 3 pointer. But that could change a bit if he puts back a couple misses around the rim. Be garbage man - like, and all that - like Moten.

 

[billsin01]

Southerland is a more athletic version of Preston Shumpert. If James gets enough minutes he can easily average 20+ ppg.

Southerland is an interesting guy to try and comp, but I'm not sure simply saying he's "a more athletic shumpert" is fair to Shump. Shumpert averaged double-figures for three years, was at 20 ppg each of his last two seasons, shot just under 40% total from 3 for his last three years, and added 6 rpg and 2 steals per game in each of his last two seasons. Those are huge numbers and suggest that while he certainly lacked a bit in terms of athleticism, he was a guy who innately got himself in good positions quite often.

Demetris Nichols might be the better comp -- JS may not be quite as good offensively but he's more imposing on the glass and defensively. Regardless he's a unique player.

 

[dlegend44]

Southerland is an interesting guy to try and comp, but I'm not sure simply saying he's "a more athletic shumpert" is fair to Shump. Shumpert averaged double-figures for three years, was at 20 ppg each of his last two seasons, shot just under 40% total from 3 for his last three years, and added 6 rpg and 2 steals per game in each of his last two seasons. Those are huge numbers and suggest that while he certainly lacked a bit in terms of athleticism, he was a guy who innately got himself in good positions quite often.

Demetris Nichols might be the better comp -- JS may not be quite as good offensively but he's more imposing on the glass and defensively. Regardless he's a unique player.

Nichols was the other comparison that came to mind. I think Southerland is a much better shooter than Nichols was. Nichols was better at getting to the rim than Dirty, but defensively and rebounding wise, Demetris is more like him. Shump was a great shooter and I think Southerland is on his level. Shump lacked effort on the defensive side. Southerland plays good D and rebounds well.

 

[Col. Bleep]

And yeah, when the others start to hit (like Brandon's 2nd half Friday?), look out. This is such a glass-half-full situation, it isn't funny.

What top teams are hot from outside now? Maybe they should be the ones worrying.

Especially if Cooney ever gets untracked.
A second consistent 3-point shooter could pose some real problems for opponents and perhaps leave more room for MCW, Triche or Fair to get to the hoop.

 

[MyMeloMyMan]

Southerland is a more athletic version of Preston Shumpert. If James gets enough minutes he can easily average 20+ ppg.

How many players have averaged over 20 ppg for a season wearing Orange?

 

[MGP]

James athletically reminds me more of Herman Harried - that herky, jerky, quirky athleticism. That's where the comparison in games stops though. Herman could not have made 9 3's in 9 yrs.!:rolling:

 

[Fly Rodder]

So what has James improved on from previous years to the breakout that he could be this season? I'm curious to hear opinions from people that are way better at breaking down basketball players than I am.

He's always been a streaky shooter, but has he improved his defense so that he's now finally playing enough minutes to get into the flow of the offensive game?

 

[OrangeTown]

How many players have averaged over 20 ppg for a season wearing Orange?

Based on my research:

56-57, Vinnie Cohen, 24.2 PPG
60-61, Pete Chudy, 20.8 PPG
63-64, Chuck Richards, 22.0 PPG and Dave Bing, 22.2 PPG
64-65, Dave Bing, 23.2 PPG
65-66, Dave Bing, 28.4 PPG

*** 69-70 Bill Smith, 20.2 PPG *** (Not listed on SUAthletics website, possibly because of his lack of games due to suspension? Perhaps a veteran board member can provide some insight)

70-71, Greg Kohls, 22.1 PPG and Bill Smith, 22.7 PPG
71-72, Greg Kohls, 26.7 PPG
73-74, Dennis DuVal, 22.2 PPG
74-75, Rudy Hackett, 22.2 PPG
90-91, Billy Owens, 23.3 PPG
93-94, Lawrence Moten, 21.5 PPG
95-96, John Wallace, 22.2 PPG
01-02, Preston Shumpert, 20.7 PPG
02-03, Carmelo Anthony, 22.2 PPG
04-05, Hakim Warrick, 21.4 PPG

 

[igor]

he will be carefully charted be the pro scouts from now on. he's the best shooter su has ever had. the pros will be interested when he misses 3 in a row. you can't teach six eight and his length. he will have to demonstrate he can guard some sans taven league. look for su to go man with him on the court when the scouts are present. it will be an audition for james and mcw

 

[longislandcuse]

When James did the running man when we were full court pressing OSU last year, I knew he would beast this year.

 

[Knicks411]

James really is a unique player. He's kind of like one of those NBA stretch 4's, but the thing that makes him different is he is a really strong shot blocker and he might be able to contribute from 2 point range as well. He's a fascinating player.

 

[BlackSquirrels]

So what has James improved on from previous years to the breakout that he could be this season? I'm curious to hear opinions from people that are way better at breaking down basketball players than I am.

He's always been a streaky shooter, but has he improved his defense so that he's now finally playing enough minutes to get into the flow of the offensive game?

In my opinion, the main factor is that Kris Joseph graduated, which opened up more minutes at forward for James.

Last year, his block rates and defensive rebounding rates were higher than those of the Fair and Joseph, who also spent most of their time playing on the wings in the zone. From my perspective, he was usually active and caught out of position, so I don't think he's made a big jump on the defensive end this season.

EDIT: I originally meant to say "rarely caught out of position" above, fitting with the idea that James was already a good defensive player last year so he didn't have much room for improvement going into this year.

 

[longislandcuse]

If Rashard Lewis can be a stud for a period of time in the NBA, so can James. The dude is not just athletic, he's freakishly athletic. One of the best shooting strokes I have ever seen. At the very least he can be a sick stretch 4 on a second unit. If he can expand his game to a dribble drive, or at the very least a consistant pump fake, one-two dribble, pull up jumpshot...watch out.

I have to imagine he is now on alot of teams draft radars.

 

[SBU72]

he will be carefully charted be the pro scouts from now on. he's the best shooter su has ever had. the pros will be interested when he misses 3 in a row. you can't teach six eight and his length. he will have to demonstrate he can guard some sans taven league. look for su to go man with him on the court when the scouts are present. it will be an audition for james and mcw

Look for SU to go man the YEAR after JB retires. And then only for short stints.

 

[MyMeloMyMan]

Man, we always go overboard on our guys NBA potential after a few good games.

 

[longislandcuse]

Man, we always go overboard on our guys NBA potential after a few good games.

Rick Jackson is obviously a first rounder.

 

[MyMeloMyMan]

Rick Jackson is obviously a first rounder.

"I just think Preston Shumpert has all the tools to be a 10 year NBA pro..."

 

[Gabjon]

James really is a unique player. He's kind of like one of those NBA stretch 4's, but the thing that makes him different is he is a really strong shot blocker and he might be able to contribute from 2 point range as well. He's a fascinating player.

He is too thin to play 4 in the NBA sketch 4s still have to be able to defend in the post. (Matt Bonner) I think he is a 2/3 in the NBA so his handle must continue to get better. The more I look at him the more I think Wes is the best comparison. Wes was a better rebounder but James is a better defender at this stage of his career. They are both elite athletes who can shoot. The thing about Jame is most of his 3s are NBA 3s and his release point is so high that are almost indefensible.

Getting back to college basketball who in the country has a player who is long enough to defend James 30ft away from the basket and comfortable doing so? Most taller guys in college are not use to guarding 30ft from the basket and most coaches don't want them out there. The defender is not in rebounding position or shot blocking position the floor is spaced for MCW, Triche and CJ to do their thing with the bigs cleaning the glass.

The amazing thing about James performance is that it was on the road. He was jumping around having a good old time like he was in the Dome extremely comfortable in his own skin! That is the most encouraging thing about that game. He is shooting 54.5% from 3 point and his misses look good. Now I don't think he will keep that percentage up but he is it doesn't matter that performance will ensure that every coach in America has him on the top of the scouting report he will change every defend we face for the rest of the season.

 

[KevMonstah]

I think James clearly has shown he has NBA shooting ability, and NBA athleticism, but if he doesn't show any ballhandling ability, he's not going to amount to much in the NBA, if he even gets there. I'm rooting for him, but he hasn't shown in four years the ability to dribble at all. I don't know who in this thread said he's demonstrated the ability to put the ball on the floor and drive, no, he hasn't. More than half his career shots have come from deep, and he has only 60 career FTAs; he's not a dribble-drive guy. He's not even a pumpfake-dribble-once-shoot guy. I'm a huge fan of his, what a great starting point: athletic ability like you wouldn't believe, combined with that sort of shooting stroke. How often do you see those two go together? Usually it's "he's a great athlete" (code words for, he can't shoot), or "he's a great shooter". Being extraordinary at both is not common. I hope he can show ballhandling skills; he'd be unguardable. Oh, add passing skills to the wishlist too: he's got 35 assists. In his career. He demonstrates those, he's a superstar. Right now, he's just a great shooter/dunker. His biggest advantage is he can just keep backing up to get open, and he can rise over pretty much anyone to shoot. That's not going to be the case in the NBA.

Kev

 

[Quazzum69]

Everyone thought we'd be a top ten team without Southerland's ability to score 20 ppg. If this is can be sustained until April, lookout! If not, we still have 3 others who can contribute fairly consistently. When Coleman figures everything out and Southerland can still hit 5 threes a game, that would be huge.