Reading the tea leaves re: WR recruiting | Page 3 | Syracusefan.com
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Reading the tea leaves re: WR recruiting

GoSU96 said:
The players needed to run the same offense weren't on the team before.

Hay, Tiller on the OL, Bailey all by himself. Who's the third receiver last year?
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That's fine and this is a pointless argument b/c either way DM and Hackett deserve credit for putting together a more or less unstoppable offense. BUT, if you buy into the narrative (I'm not sure I do) that they decided to go up-tempo 3 weeks before the season, then it wasn't a matter of waiting for just the right personnel mix. It seems to me it was a shift in offensive philosophy and the proper personnel.
 
billsin01 said:
BUT, if you buy into the narrative (I'm not sure I do) that they decided to go up-tempo 3 weeks before the season, then it wasn't a matter of waiting for just the right personnel mix. It seems to me it was a shift in offensive philosophy and the proper personnel.
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I buy in to that narrative.
 
billsin01 said:
That's fine and this is a pointless argument b/c either way DM and Hackett deserve credit for putting together a more or less unstoppable offense. BUT, if you buy into the narrative (I'm not sure I do) that they decided to go up-tempo 3 weeks before the season, then it wasn't a matter of waiting for just the right personnel mix. It seems to me it was a shift in offensive philosophy and the proper personnel.
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Going into the year they didn't have much faith in getting production out of the TB's and much of the offense was going to be based on Broyld. I think they realized that wasn't going to be a viable approach.

It's my belief that the first cut at the very pass heavy no huddle spread was based in having no faith in the running game. Desperation is the mother of invention. And even when it was more exciting and it was revelation that they could move the ball as much as they did, they were still struggling scoring and winning.

I think that Smith and Gully really stepped up and proved something to the staff the first third of the year. The staff made statements to that effect. And that led to more balance and more scoring and an adjustment to the play calling mix. Nassib's early year performance also helped lossen things up for the run game.
 
GoSU96 said:
Going into the year they didn't have much faith in getting production out of the TB's and much of the offense was going to be based on Broyld. I think they realized that wasn't going to be a viable approach.

It's my belief that the first cut at the very pass heavy no huddle spread was based in having no faith in the running game. Desperation is the mother of invention. And even when it was more exciting and it was revelation that they could move the ball as much as they did, they were still struggling scoring and winning.

I think that Smith and Gully really stepped up and proved something to the staff the first third of the year. The staff made statements to that effect. And that led to more balance and more scoring and an adjustment to the play calling mix. Nassib's early year performance also helped lossen things up for the run game.
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I could see all that being true and I certainly acknowledge the personnel upgrades. But I think there was also a very significant shift in the way of thinking about offense. It seems to me like the focus went from "don't make any mistakes and try to run 9,000 formations with a bunch of really, really low-risk plays" to "we'll make some mistakes but we're going to play faster and much more aggressively -- our qb will run a bit, we'll run the ball out of the shotgun quite a bit, we'll go vertical in the passing game much more often and, oh yeah, we'll go no huddle."

I say this as a compliment to DM -- I think he realized after Year 3 that they needed to rethink how they were doing things. Nice to see that it all ended the way it did (the season and bowl win, not DM leaving, of course).
 
GoSU96 said:
The players needed to run the same offense weren't on the team before.

Hay, Tiller on the OL, Bailey all by himself. Who's the third receiver last year?
Expand...

I'm convinced that it was Tiller. If you're going to be that heavy, you better bench 225 a couple hundred times. IIRC he wasn't as strong as we thought which probably means he couldn't handle a fast tempo because he was too fat. maybe hay too

when the offense is worse and you're too heavy to reap any offensive benefits from going up tempo, it's stupid to give the other team more plays to amplify their per play advantage.
 
Millhouse said:
I'm convinced that it was Tiller. If you're going to be that heavy, you better bench 225 a couple hundred times. IIRC he wasn't as strong as we thought which probably means he couldn't handle a fast tempo because he was too fat. maybe hay too

when the offense is worse and you're too heavy to reap any offensive benefits from going up tempo, it's stupid to give the other team more plays to amplify their per play advantage.
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Oh man are you going to get it.
 
Hoov50 said:
Could it be he plans to utilize three or four WRs in most sets? You would need more if that's the case.
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Former Miami wide receivers coach George McDonald is the new offensive coordinator at Syracuse and has discussed with Jones the type of scheme he plans on using.

“He’s talking about implementing some of the stuff I ran last year like the pistol, 4-wide, 5-wide, a couple tight ends. It will really be a little of everything,” Jones said.
 
Millhouse said:
I'm convinced that it was Tiller. If you're going to be that heavy, you better bench 225 a couple hundred times. IIRC he wasn't as strong as we thought which probably means he couldn't handle a fast tempo because he was too fat. maybe hay too

when the offense is worse and you're too heavy to reap any offensive benefits from going up tempo, it's stupid to give the other team more plays to amplify their per play advantage.
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I don't think they ever planned to play fast.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2
 
To be quite honest, West and Kobena are the only ones who have shown anything. Funderburke is supposed to be bigtime. The rest either haven't played yet, or have shown very little(mostly in limited time).

I guess my point is, numbers doesn't necessarily mean quality numbers. Maybe some of them are good and just haven't had the opportunity to show it yet, or are just now developing into it...but as it stands, West is the only one who you can call a good college football player.
 
billsin01 said:
I remember at one point being bummed out that ND swung and missed on Gruden. The more I hear him, the more I'm thrilled they never hired him. He may be a nice guy and motivate/relate well to players, but he comes off as one of those guys who can only speak in football cliches and appears to have primarily made a career out of looking like a good football coach.
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He did win a Super Bowl didn't he?
 
PhatOrange said:
just shows how over thought football has become. keep it simple stupid works just fine.
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Crabtree was taught 4 routes at Texas Tech. Every play call they ran, he was told to run one of the four routes.
 
OttoinGrotto said:
See, what's funny is that we actually had better TOP numbers this past season than the previous one.

Being worried about running yourself out of the game is something loser's worry about.
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I'm assuming sarcasm here... If not...SU was 13th in the nation in total plays from scrimmage and the average TOP per game was 1 full minute less than SU's opponents... I'd say that based on the number of close games this year, we damn near ran ourselves out of more games than not.
 
I think Alvin Cornelius is going to be moved to corner this spring. Based on the abundance of WR's and low number of CB's. And he's the only WR underclassman who has the size and HS success to play corner. Had many interceptions in HS.
 
Orangepace said:
I'm assuming sarcasm here... If not...SU was 13th in the nation in total plays from scrimmage and the average TOP per game was 1 full minute less than SU's opponents... I'd say that based on the number of close games this year, we damn near ran ourselves out of more games than not.
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Or, the reason we were in so many close games is because we played so fast.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2
 
OttoinGrotto said:
Or, the reason we were in so many close games is because we played so fast.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2
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We could each pull stats that would support our positions, but I think realistically neither thought is "wrong". Just perception.
 
Orangepace said:
We could each pull stats that would support our positions, but I think realistically neither thought is "wrong". Just perception.
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Totally. This kind of gets back to the thought I've shared though that our program needs some style if it's going to get the fan support it wants. It's not enough to be competitive. We need to be competitive and fun.

Playing fast is a lot of fun to watch. It's inconclusive if it makes us less competitive (I argue it makes us more competitive, but whatever), so let's play fast and give people something to get excited about.
 
OttoinGrotto said:
Totally. This kind of gets back to the thought I've shared though that our program needs some style if it's going to get the fan support it wants. It's not enough to be competitive. We need to be competitive and fun.

Playing fast is a lot of fun to watch. It's inconclusive if it makes us less competitive (I argue it makes us more competitive, but whatever), so let's play fast and give people something to get excited about.
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They played just the way you wanted out of the gate and crowds got smaller.
 
OrangeDW said:
To be quite honest, West and Kobena are the only ones who have shown anything. Funderburke is supposed to be bigtime. The rest either haven't played yet, or have shown very little(mostly in limited time).

I guess my point is, numbers doesn't necessarily mean quality numbers. Maybe some of them are good and just haven't had the opportunity to show it yet, or are just now developing into it...but as it stands, West is the only one who you can call a good college football player.
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I thought Kobena showed some promise. He needs to sure up his hands a bit but I think that mainly stemmed from him not liking the idea of getting hit over the middle. If he gets his mind right, he could make an impact at WR.
 

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