Regardless of what happens the staff can't be faulted for effort.

[Crusty]

Shafer has pulled off a small miracle. I think he was named head coach on January 11th and was left with 26 days until NSD to hire a staff and salvage the 2013 Class. Not only has he hired a great looking staff but he seems to have orchestrated a good recruiting class, maybe better than it was when the crap hit the fan.

I am truly amazed at the effort that the staff has made in trying to salvage this recruiting class. Imagine disengaging from a job, starting a new job in a new environment, evaluating present talent and needs the best you can and then, while explaining the departure of seven staff members. working your recruits to get the best results possible.

This has been fun to observe from a distance and very encouraging for the future.

TGD deserves credit as well for moving quickly to hire a hard nosed coach.

I've been around the block a few times but I am still scratching my head in amazement.

 

[OrangePA]

I think the most important thing is this- the staff knows each other.

There will be no getting to know the views and attitudes of the individual coaches.

This will not be like the Coach Robinson situation where there was never really a consensus at least on the offensive side.

 

[rrlbees]

I think the most important thing is this- the staff knows each other.

There will be no getting to know the views and attitudes of the individual coaches.

This will not be like the Coach Robinson situation where there was never really a consensus at least on the offensive side.

I've thought about this before and on the surface, it seems great but is it really?

Does most of the coaches knowing each other and having coached together before stunt bringing new and different perspectives and ideas? Will they be too single minded?

Also, with many of them being so close, even the families, will that make it harder for Shafer to let someone go that isn't getting it done? We saw that with P and some of his assistants.

Let's hope the positives far outweigh the possible negatives.

Sent using my Commodore 64 on Tapatalk 5.3

 

[retro44]

It's not like they were split up for one season. Heck even Marrone is doing this now with the bills.

They have been not coaching together for what, 5, 6, 7 years

 

[OrangePA]

I've thought about this before and on the surface, it seems great but is it really?

Does most of the coaches knowing each other and having coached together before stunt bringing new and different perspectives and ideas? Will they be too single minded?

Also, with many of them being so close, even the families, will that make it harder for Shafer to let someone go that isn't getting it done? We saw that with P and some of his assistants.

Let's hope the positives far outweigh the possible negatives.

Sent using my Commodore 64 on Tapatalk 5.3

Didnt P bring in guys like Orgeron, Schottenheimer, Stewart, Austin, West, Steve? From WVU, Azzinaro and a lot of others?

Whom should he have fired? DeLeone?

 

[rrlbees]

Didnt P bring in guys like Orgeron, Schottenheimer, Stewart, Austin, West, Steve? From WVU, Azzinaro and a lot of others?

Whom should he have fired? DeLeone?

Sure he brought in many coaches. He coached here so long he had to bring in some guys he wasn't buds with. Many were though. Let's start with Goldman.

Sent using my Commodore 64 on Tapatalk 5.3

 

[kcsu]

I've thought about this before and on the surface, it seems great but is it really?

Does most of the coaches knowing each other and having coached together before stunt bringing new and different perspectives and ideas? Will they be too single minded?

Also, with many of them being so close, even the families, will that make it harder for Shafer to let someone go that isn't getting it done? We saw that with P and some of his assistants.

Let's hope the positives far outweigh the possible negatives.

Sent using my Commodore 64 on Tapatalk 5.3

In running a companies i like going with known talent. If Shafer had selected coaches soley on knowing them it would be one thing but each of these coaches have solid credentials. I do wish that we would have brought on one coach who has great east coast ties

 

[RMH44]

Didnt P bring in guys like Orgeron, Schottenheimer, Stewart, Austin, West, Steve? From WVU, Azzinaro and a lot of others?

Whom should he have fired? DeLeone?

Other than DeLeone, Coach P had a revolving door for assistant coaches. Every coach you listed left for greener pastures with the possible exception of "Steve" (if his last Name is Bush...who cares?) .

I know for a fact that many of the former assistants left because of the P and D attached at the hip thing. They felt that had very little input into game planning.

 

[Crusty]

While great minds do think alike - so do poor ones! I think we have first class ones.
While Shafer knows these guys they aren't sycophants or without diversified experiences. Lester for one brings a different background. What I like is that there are guys on the staff that can probably grow into their bosses jobs. I think we are going to like this group. Yes, there will be some adjustments and bumps along the way but I think, all in all, we are going to have a good run.

 

[OrangePA]

Sure he brought in many coaches. He coached here so long he had to bring in some guys he wasn't buds with. Many were though. Let's start with Goldman.

Sent using my Commodore 64 on Tapatalk 5.3

Ah yes.

Dennis Goldman the WR coach was a problrm except when he had Harrison, Hill and Ismail.

 

[rrlbees]

Ah yes.

Dennis Goldman the WR coach was a problrm except when he had Harrison, Hill and Ismail.

Follow Goldman's career. That will give you a clue as to how bad he was. There are many others like him. Top many Central Connecticut St guys.

Sent using my Commodore 64 on Tapatalk 5.3

 

[All4SU]

I've thought about this before and on the surface, it seems great but is it really?

Does most of the coaches knowing each other and having coached together before stunt bringing new and different perspectives and ideas? Will they be too single minded?

Also, with many of them being so close, even the families, will that make it harder for Shafer to let someone go that isn't getting it done? We saw that with P and some of his assistants.

Let's hope the positives far outweigh the possible negatives.

Sent using my Commodore 64 on Tapatalk 5.3

I guess we will find out. The one thing I will add, however, is that while they have worked together in the past, they have all also worked other places, with other staffs, and for other coaches. So hopefully, they will have absorbed some new ideas too, and will feel comfortable introducing those successful ideas.

 

[OrangePA]

Follow Goldman's career. That will give you a clue as to how bad he was. There are many others like him. Top many Central Connecticut St guys.

Sent using my Commodore 64 on Tapatalk 5.3

Oh please.

What did he lack as a WR coach?

 

[rrlbees]

Oh please.

What did he lack as a WR coach?

Coaching ability.

Sent using my Commodore 64 on Tapatalk 5.3

 

[All4SU]

Other than DeLeone, Coach P had a revolving door for assistant coaches. Every coach you listed left for greener pastures with the possible exception of "Steve" (if his last Name is Bush...who cares?) .

I know for a fact that many of the former assistants left because of the P and D attached at the hip thing. They felt that had very little input into game planning.

I think most of those assistants left for more money.

 

[OrangePA]

Coaching ability.

Sent using my Commodore 64 on Tapatalk 5.3

What about his coaching ability was lacking?

In what way was his technique deficient?

Did he not teach route running properly?

Did he not teach blocking properly?

Did he not break down film properly?

Tell us exactly why he was a poor coach.

 

[OrangePA]

Other than DeLeone, Coach P had a revolving door for assistant coaches. Every coach you listed left for greener pastures with the possible exception of "Steve" (if his last Name is Bush...who cares?) .

I know for a fact that many of the former assistants left because of the P and D attached at the hip thing. They felt that had very little input into game planning.

Steve Bush is not the former WVU DC who came to SU.

It was Steve Dunlop.

Bush has proven to be a fine coach at every level.

And your "fact" I think is wrong.

P took things from every coach including Schottenheimer, Elmassian, Orgeron and many othrrs.

Most of the coaches who left, like Jeff Stoutland did so for more money.

 

[RMH44]

Steve Bush is not the former WVU DC who came to SU.

It was Steve Dunlop.

Bush has proven to be a fine coach at every level.

And your "fact" I think is wrong.

P took things from every coach including Schottenheimer, Elmassian, Orgeron and many othrrs.

Most of the coaches who left, like Jeff Stoutland did so for more money.

I never said that money wasn't a factor but you can't explain away the fact that assistants left in droves under your guy. I can only tell you what a former assistant told me first hand. On many occasions the assistants felt left out. Most staff generated game plans changed after P and D went to dinner. The staff usually didn't find out until the next morning.

While your loyalty is admirable it has obviously clouded your objectivity. Like you, I think that PP is a great man but we disagree when evaluating his coaching abilities.

 

[rrlbees]

I never said that money wasn't a factor but you can't explain away the fact that assistants left in droves under your guy. I can only tell you what a former assistant told me first hand. On many occasions the assistants felt left out. Most staff generated game plans changed after P and D went to dinner. The staff usually didn't find out until the next morning.

While your loyalty is admirable it has obviously clouded your objectivity. Like you, I think that PP is a great man but we disagree when evaluating his coaching abilities.

I'm not going to get back into it all either, but I know for a fact assts left for laterals because they didn't feel like their input was worth anything.

 

[OrangePA]

I never said that money wasn't a factor but you can't explain away the fact that assistants left in droves under your guy. I can only tell you what a former assistant told me first hand. On many occasions the assistants felt left out. Most staff generated game plans changed after P and D went to dinner. The staff usually didn't find out until the next morning.

While your loyalty is admirable it has obviously clouded your objectivity. Like you, I think that PP is a great man but we disagree when evaluating his coaching abilities.

I can assure you that over the years I have known many more assistants than you have. Many more.

And I am confident that your basic premise is very overstated.

Coaches left at the same rate as with other programs.

The premise is just not accurate.

 

[OrangePA]

I'm not going to get back into it all either, but I know for a fact assts left for laterals because they didn't feel like their input was worth anything.

Give an example.

I gave you Orgeron and Schottenheimer whose ideas were adopted early on by P.

 

[TheCusian]

I've thought about this before and on the surface, it seems great but is it really?

Does most of the coaches knowing each other and having coached together before stunt bringing new and different perspectives and ideas? Will they be too single minded?

Also, with many of them being so close, even the families, will that make it harder for Shafer to let someone go that isn't getting it done? We saw that with P and some of his assistants.

Let's hope the positives far outweigh the possible negatives.

Sent using my Commodore 64 on Tapatalk 5.3

Maybe that's something to watch for... But what if SS knows that these guys are great at banging out ideas together? That the family like closeness means that they hold each other accountable and are not afraid to say what they mean?

I've worked with teams of people like that - and it's awesome. It would also seem like if any of that was an issue they wouldn't want to work together.

 

[Chip]

Give an example.

I gave you Orgeron and Schottenheimer whose ideas were adopted early on by P.

I have absolutely no idea of the behind the scenes stuff with his staff, but he definitely adopted Orgeron's thoughts. If I recall, Ed O was one who convinced Pasqualoni to switch from 3-4 to 4-3. Convert some safeties to OLBs, convert some DEs to DTs. Speed over size.

Was Goldman the WR coach all the way back to Ismail? I didn't know that one.

 

[RMH44]

I can assure you that over the years I have known many more assistants than you have. Many more.

And I am confident that your basic premise is very overstated.

Coaches left at the same rate as with other programs.

The premise is just not accurate.

Even if you knew otherwise, this is exactly the response I expected from you.

 

[GoSU96]

Shafer has pulled off a small miracle. I think he was named head coach on January 11th and was left with 26 days until NSD to hire a staff and salvage the 2013 Class. Not only has he hired a great looking staff but he seems to have orchestrated a good recruiting class, maybe better than it was when the crap hit the fan.

I am truly amazed at the effort that the staff has made in trying to salvage this recruiting class. Imagine disengaging from a job, starting a new job in a new environment, evaluating present talent and needs the best you can and then, while explaining the departure of seven staff members. working your recruits to get the best results possible.

This has been fun to observe from a distance and very encouraging for the future.

TGD deserves credit as well for moving quickly to hire a hard nosed coach.

I've been around the block a few times but I am still scratching my head in amazement.

All that is so over the top.

Shafer has done a excellent job, but it's not a miracle of any kind. Multiple schools go through transitions every year. Shafer had a solid foundation and added to it by having his hires keep working prospects they had relationships with at their old jobs, it's SOP.