Remember this game during the February slump

[OrangeFoo]

When we are asking questions like:
- why do we only have one guy who even attempts a three much less make one? (Because the only other two guys with any shot aren't allowed to make mistakes so are glued to the bench)
- why are we getting killed on the boards? (Silent g is going to get slaughtered playing the 3 in the ACC)
- why does our freshman point struggle so much? (His legs are gone from playing 35 minutes a game)
- why has Roberson not realized his obvious talent? (He is too tentative from getting the yank 2 minutes into a half)
- why do Syracuse teams peak in December? (They get worn out by playing too many minutes)
- why do we go through a slump every year towards the end that we very rarely recover from? (our HOF coach doesn't know how to develop a team... he'd rather rely on 5 or 6 players whom he can trust)

This team could have so much potential and have so many answers but we will never know because of one bad game against Cal. It's funny that we as fans are supposedly not allowed to make judgements based on one game but our HOF coach is allowed to determine a season's worth of minutes for a player based on one game.

 

[longtimefan]

When we are asking questions like:
- why do we only have one guy who even attempts a three much less make one? (Because the only other two guys with any shot aren't allowed to make mistakes so are glued to the bench)
- why are we getting killed on the boards? (Silent g is going to get slaughtered playing the 3 in the ACC)
- why does our freshman point struggle so much? (His legs are gone from playing 35 minutes a game)
- why has Roberson not realized his obvious talent? (He is too tentative from getting the yank 2 minutes into a half)
- why do Syracuse teams peak in December? (They get worn out by playing too many minutes)
- why do we go through a slump every year towards the end that we very rarely recover from? (our HOF coach doesn't know how to develop a team... he'd rather rely on 5 or 6 players whom he can trust)

This team could have so much potential and have so many answers but we will never know because of one bad game against Cal. It's funny that we as fans are supposedly not allowed to make judgements based on one game but our HOF coach is allowed to determine a season's worth of minutes for a player based on one game.

Winning tonight was of paramount importance.

 

[dasher]

When we are asking questions like:
- why do we only have one guy who even attempts a three much less make one? (Because the only other two guys with any shot aren't allowed to make mistakes so are glued to the bench)
- why are we getting killed on the boards? (Silent g is going to get slaughtered playing the 3 in the ACC)
- why does our freshman point struggle so much? (His legs are gone from playing 35 minutes a game)
- why has Roberson not realized his obvious talent? (He is too tentative from getting the yank 2 minutes into a half)
- why do Syracuse teams peak in December? (They get worn out by playing too many minutes)
- why do we go through a slump every year towards the end that we very rarely recover from? (our HOF coach doesn't know how to develop a team... he'd rather rely on 5 or 6 players whom he can trust)

This team could have so much potential and have so many answers but we will never know because of one bad game against Cal. It's funny that we as fans are supposedly not allowed to make judgements based on one game but our HOF coach is allowed to determine a season's worth of minutes for a player based on one game.

Remember this game in March when we are sitting by our tv's wondering if we got in the tournament. We needed this win. And the "slump" is because we are usually playing real good teams at the end of Febuary. And we do better than most at that time of the year.

 

[ORANGEsPHK]

When we are asking questions like:
- why do we only have one guy who even attempts a three much less make one? (Because the only other two guys with any shot aren't allowed to make mistakes so are glued to the bench)
- why are we getting killed on the boards? (Silent g is going to get slaughtered playing the 3 in the ACC)
- why does our freshman point struggle so much? (His legs are gone from playing 35 minutes a game)
- why has Roberson not realized his obvious talent? (He is too tentative from getting the yank 2 minutes into a half)
- why do Syracuse teams peak in December? (They get worn out by playing too many minutes)
- why do we go through a slump every year towards the end that we very rarely recover from? (our HOF coach doesn't know how to develop a team... he'd rather rely on 5 or 6 players whom he can trust)

This team could have so much potential and have so many answers but we will never know because of one bad game against Cal. It's funny that we as fans are supposedly not allowed to make judgements based on one game but our HOF coach is allowed to determine a season's worth of minutes for a player based on one game.

Wuh?

I'm not sure our HOF coach is making any calls based on one game.

No idea what this post is about, but I will look back on this post in February, maybe it will make more sense then?

 

[strumpfasaurus]

This is the worst thread of all time.

 

[pearl31]

When we are asking questions like:
- why do we only have one guy who even attempts a three much less make one? (Because the only other two guys with any shot aren't allowed to make mistakes so are glued to the bench)
- why are we getting killed on the boards? (Silent g is going to get slaughtered playing the 3 in the ACC)
- why does our freshman point struggle so much? (His legs are gone from playing 35 minutes a game)
- why has Roberson not realized his obvious talent? (He is too tentative from getting the yank 2 minutes into a half)
- why do Syracuse teams peak in December? (They get worn out by playing too many minutes)
- why do we go through a slump every year towards the end that we very rarely recover from? (our HOF coach doesn't know how to develop a team... he'd rather rely on 5 or 6 players whom he can trust)

This team could have so much potential and have so many answers but we will never know because of one bad game against Cal. It's funny that we as fans are supposedly not allowed to make judgements based on one game but our HOF coach is allowed to determine a season's worth of minutes for a player based on one game.

 

[anomander]

When we are asking questions like:
- why do we only have one guy who even attempts a three much less make one? (Because the only other two guys with any shot aren't allowed to make mistakes so are glued to the bench)
- why are we getting killed on the boards? (Silent g is going to get slaughtered playing the 3 in the ACC)
- why does our freshman point struggle so much? (His legs are gone from playing 35 minutes a game)
- why has Roberson not realized his obvious talent? (He is too tentative from getting the yank 2 minutes into a half)
- why do Syracuse teams peak in December? (They get worn out by playing too many minutes)
- why do we go through a slump every year towards the end that we very rarely recover from? (our HOF coach doesn't know how to develop a team... he'd rather rely on 5 or 6 players whom he can trust)

This team could have so much potential and have so many answers but we will never know because of one bad game against Cal. It's funny that we as fans are supposedly not allowed to make judgements based on one game but our HOF coach is allowed to determine a season's worth of minutes for a player based on one game.

I do agree that there is no reason BJ shouldn't get in the game. Cooney is the furthest thing from irreplaceable that we've got. It's pretty amazing that he needs to play 40 minutes a game. I would like for someone to explain to me how him playing 10 minutes would have equated to a loss? I mean this isn't CJ Fair, or Tyler Ennis who can't come out of the game. This is Trevor Cooney, and Kaleb Joseph.

 

[wadegarrett]

When we are asking questions like:
- why do we only have one guy who even attempts a three much less make one? (Because the only other two guys with any shot aren't allowed to make mistakes so are glued to the bench)
- why are we getting killed on the boards? (Silent g is going to get slaughtered playing the 3 in the ACC)
- why does our freshman point struggle so much? (His legs are gone from playing 35 minutes a game)
- why has Roberson not realized his obvious talent? (He is too tentative from getting the yank 2 minutes into a half)
- why do Syracuse teams peak in December? (They get worn out by playing too many minutes)
- why do we go through a slump every year towards the end that we very rarely recover from? (our HOF coach doesn't know how to develop a team... he'd rather rely on 5 or 6 players whom he can trust)

This team could have so much potential and have so many answers but we will never know because of one bad game against Cal. It's funny that we as fans are supposedly not allowed to make judgements based on one game but our HOF coach is allowed to determine a season's worth of minutes for a player based on one game.

I get the pessimism on this board lately but this is just a stupid post. Gbinje will be much more at home this year playing the 3. He won't be much smaller in size than the 3s from other teams and he can handle the ball and rebound. He is the least player I'm worried about. The strength of this team will be rebounding this year.

Why does our freshman point struggle so much? Because he's a freshman. Not every freshman is a Tyler Ennis. He's struggling now. what excuse do you have for him now? Legs are gone already?

Why do our teams peak in December? You must have a real short memory. Yes, our team last year fizzled out but how about the previous teams? We had great teams from 09-13 that peaked on March. Take away a couple injuries and suspensions and we would have another banner or two.

You can complain about the BJs and patterson of the world not getting minutes but boeheim always plays to win the game. If BJ and patterson got their minutes this game we probably would have lost. I'm all for developing players but it doesn't mean squat when you are playing in the NIT in March. We need wins. Rant over.

 

[SWC75]

 

[jordoo]

We sure seemed to stink Thursday playing 8 guys. No one played more than 30min and we got toasted. I'd of been OK with 5 guys to win last night.

 

[RF2044]

These next couple of games will be big for the three sons. They need PT, and they need to make positive contributions to gain back a little of JBs trust. We need them for this team to actualize its potential. And we badly need the depth--even if it is only used situationally.

 

[jordoo]

These next couple of games will be big for my three sons. They need PT, and they need to make positive contributions to gain back a little of JBs trust. We need them for this team to actualize its potential. And we badly need the depth--even if it is only used situationally.

And the coaches will have time to go over things with them before that which they didn't for last nights game. They will break down everything these kids did good and bad before they play again. We need them for sure.

 

[wallacecuse]

These next couple of games will be big for the three sons. They need PT, and they need to make positive contributions to gain back a little of JBs trust. We need them for this team to actualize its potential. And we badly need the depth--even if it is only used situationally.

Its a two-sided coin - we often chide JB for a short bench, but that occurs because the fringe guys don't give him any reason to play them. One of those 3 needs to actually take advantage of that initial short run, and flash...not jack up airballs, and get murdered in transition. Force your way into the rotation.

 

[TheCusian]

These next couple of games will be big for the three sons. They need PT, and they need to make positive contributions to gain back a little of JBs trust. We need them for this team to actualize its potential. And we badly need the depth--even if it is only used situationally.

And I think that it starts on the defensive side. They need to be where they are supposed to.

Seems like JB will let offensive mistakes ride a bit longer - so long as you play your a$$ off on D (Cooney, cough)

 

[Cusefan0307]

I do agree that there is no reason BJ shouldn't get in the game. Cooney is the furthest thing from irreplaceable that we've got. It's pretty amazing that he needs to play 40 minutes a game. I would like for someone to explain to me how him playing 10 minutes would have equated to a loss? I mean this isn't CJ Fair, or Tyler Ennis who can't come out of the game. This is Trevor Cooney, and Kaleb Joseph.

Johnson is 9-26 on the season. Patterson is 2-12. Trevor has been far from perfect at 16-38 with a few stupid turnovers, but he's our best option at the two. If you think he is making a lot of mistakes out there, they guys behind him are making just as many in less minutes. JB played to win last night. If they came in and fired an air ball, and we lost everyone in here would of had their second meltdown of the year.

Trevor needs to play better, and he was a little better last night than Thursday. Baby steps. My three sons need to show us something next week if they want to see meaningful minutes this year. If not,we are going to see a lineup of Joseph, Cooney, g, cmac, and rock 35 minutes a night.

 

[Ghost]

I do agree that there is no reason BJ shouldn't get in the game. Cooney is the furthest thing from irreplaceable that we've got. It's pretty amazing that he needs to play 40 minutes a game. I would like for someone to explain to me how him playing 10 minutes would have equated to a loss? I mean this isn't CJ Fair, or Tyler Ennis who can't come out of the game. This is Trevor Cooney, and Kaleb Joseph.

I'm all in favor of Cooney not being a 40 minute guy, but I was pretty comfortable with his playing time last night. This was MSG, and BJ looked god-awful the night before.

If BJ rebounds like that (8 boards on Thursday) and shows a bit more control over his shot selection, I might be slightly more convinced he deserved minutes last night. Under the situation, against a power conference team with all that happened the night before, go with Cooney. Who, for the most part, looked solid to me - I thought his shot looked on (still missing wide open looks though), and he got to the rim a few times. Overall, good game for him imo. I will say his passing was suspect at times, but G's was as well, and Joseph looked very shaky at best to me. He needed to help alleviate some of that pressure they were putting on, so I think you have to go with him.

Overall, in this game, I think 10 minutes may very well have equated to a loss. With Cooney you know what you're getting, with BJ, no idea. Not sure we were in a position to roll the dice. And we needed this game for multiple reasons.

Joseph - eh, since he wasn't helping much with the ball-handling anyway, and with some iffy shot selection thrown in, probably could have sat at times. He did have a huge drive and dish late though.

 

[cliftonparksufan]

 

[Marsh01]

When we are asking questions like: - why do we only have one guy who even attempts a three much less make one? (Because the only other two guys with any shot aren't allowed to make mistakes so are glued to the bench) - why are we getting killed on the boards? (Silent g is going to get slaughtered playing the 3 in the ACC) - why does our freshman point struggle so much? (His legs are gone from playing 35 minutes a game) - why has Roberson not realized his obvious talent? (He is too tentative from getting the yank 2 minutes into a half) - why do Syracuse teams peak in December? (They get worn out by playing too many minutes) - why do we go through a slump every year towards the end that we very rarely recover from? (our HOF coach doesn't know how to develop a team... he'd rather rely on 5 or 6 players whom he can trust) This team could have so much potential and have so many answers but we will never know because of one bad game against Cal. It's funny that we as fans are supposedly not allowed to make judgements based on one game but our HOF coach is allowed to determine a season's worth of minutes for a player based on one game.

Because losing last night meant we were in the NiT. Had to win that game for any resemblence of a good ooc win. I had no problem with it

 

[Orangeman]

The issue here is no one is "wrong" on this thread.

This was a critical game to win in terms of the season/resume after the loss to Cal (who then got smoked by Texas). So they had to win, and they coached to do that and they did a good enough job to get the win against a quality, mid-tier Big Ten team. Nice job

But it's also possibly true, and recent history would suggest accurate, that Syracuse has done a poor job of building up players 7-9 or 7-8 on the roster…and that's come home to roost in recent seasons with fatigue setting in just as we're facing the toughest part of our schedule.

This is a Syracuse Basketball forum, but for some reason it's not allowed to suggest that the coaching staff is not perfect. The biggest comeback is that we have a Hall of Fame coach, which of course is accurate, but it's also true that the Hall of Fame designation is a reflection of 40 years of performance -- and the game changes over 40 years.

Look nowhere further than the increase in the number of games per season…Wasn't the champion something like 33-0 just 15 years ago? Now it's not uncommon to be 39-1. That's 20% more games. If you employed the same strategies with personnel over that evolution (6-7 man bench vs. developing a 7-8-9 man bench, I'd argue you'd be wrong in doing so…you have to adapt). I haven't done the research on this point but it does feel that way, anyone with the time to refute my argument please do so.

At one point there were 14 Conference Games and 3 Conference Tournament games and the NCAA tournament was 4 games long if you went all the way…now it's 18-4/5-6.

Of course, player development has changed too and they're fitter, but so is everyone else. The demands are up throughout the system.

Ultimately I think it depends on your goal -- do you want to be consistently "top-tier" with consistently strong/great seasons, or do you want to build the depth required to run through the entire season and win the whole thing? UConn has won titles playing through a roster, using slots 8-9, with guys that were arguably less-talented then the guys we've had at 8-9 who can't find their way onto the floor. By saying this, it doesn't mean that I or whatever poster don't like Boeheim (quite the opposite) or wish we'd had a different coach (no way), but it should be OK to point out an obvious one here -- you can't have an elite season with 6-7 guys because injuries, fouls and in our case lately suspensions happen and you'll need that depth…and those guys won't get that experience beating up on friendlies like Cornell in the Dome, they need the burn to learn against good teams in the Garden.

All that said, that was a great win last night, coming off such a loss the night before, against a good team. But it should be OK, and not get attacked, for suggesting that the SU coaches need to find a way to nurture/enhance the guys we'll need to provide a spark/depth later in the season.

 

[SBU72]

Remember this game as a win in Feb. A loss (especially if they had a 15pt lead) would have resulted in a complete meltdown here. (How can SU lose 2 in a row in their home away form home? Why insist on playing a zone? Why play a guy who can't shoot? etc, etc.) And as pointed out, playing the Buss & BJ now does NOT guarantee winning in Feb or getting in the NCAA. A loss to a team that may be only in the middle of the Big 10 would go on the side of "bad loses" come March.

 

[omniorange]

I do agree that there is no reason BJ shouldn't get in the game. Cooney is the furthest thing from irreplaceable that we've got. It's pretty amazing that he needs to play 40 minutes a game. I would like for someone to explain to me how him playing 10 minutes would have equated to a loss? I mean this isn't CJ Fair, or Tyler Ennis who can't come out of the game. This is Trevor Cooney, and Kaleb Joseph.

BJ's minutes have little to do with Cooney. BJ's minutes will go up and down based way more upon how well Tyler is playing, foul trouble for Rak and/or Chris, and how many minutes SilentG gets at guard. Right now, the bulk of Mike's minutes have been at forward, not at guard, which leaves very few minutes for BJ up front.

Now Buss's minutes are indeed dependent upon TC (and KJ as well).

As I said in another thread, assuming we play well early in our next two games, BJ (and Buss) will get some minutes in the next two games. It will be interesting to see what they have learned from the MSG games.

Cheers,
Neil

 

[rstone7727]

When we are asking questions like:
- why do we only have one guy who even attempts a three much less make one? (Because the only other two guys with any shot aren't allowed to make mistakes so are glued to the bench)
- why are we getting killed on the boards? (Silent g is going to get slaughtered playing the 3 in the ACC)
- why does our freshman point struggle so much? (His legs are gone from playing 35 minutes a game)
- why has Roberson not realized his obvious talent? (He is too tentative from getting the yank 2 minutes into a half)
- why do Syracuse teams peak in December? (They get worn out by playing too many minutes)
- why do we go through a slump every year towards the end that we very rarely recover from? (our HOF coach doesn't know how to develop a team... he'd rather rely on 5 or 6 players whom he can trust)

This team could have so much potential and have so many answers but we will never know because of one bad game against Cal. It's funny that we as fans are supposedly not allowed to make judgements based on one game but our HOF coach is allowed to determine a season's worth of minutes for a player based on one game.

Yes, it's pretty obvious that we should fire Jim Boeheim and hire Cal away from UK...

 

[tbonezone]

i'd say it's a pretty safe bet that if we can't somehow portion out the minutes better it will be another early exit.

 

[KaiserUEO]

i'd say it's a pretty safe bet that if we can't somehow portion out the minutes better it will be another early exit.

It's a pretty safe bet that giving lesser players more minutes , it will be another early exit.

If they get there...

 

[jekelish]

"Two other guys who can make shots."

Says who? We have zero evidence that Patterson or Johnson can consistently make three pointers in actual game situations, against even decent competition. I love the whole "the guys on the bench are being wasted!" argument, it's like how the backup QB is always the most popular player on a football team.

Look - I think that BJ is going to be a solid player, and Buss will be fine as well...but they've looked pretty mediocre against actual competition. And BJ couldn't get in yesterday because he's simply lost on the back line of the zone right now.

There's ZERO EVIDENCE that anyone else can make threes in a game, yet people are going on and on about how good BJ and Buss are as three point shooters despite all signs pointing, right now at least, to the contrary.