Remember when you guys wanted more offense...

[pfister1]

Yup. And I've enjoyed watching these games that we've been winning more than any stretch of regular season games I can remember in quite awhile. Much more enjoyable than watching rock fights.

Hopefully the defense will improve. It's getting late, but the way things have gone I'm done doubting the team or counting anything out.

Can I like this post 20x. I like winning most, but watching enjoyable basketball and that means competent offense is a very very close second.

 

[pfister1]

Yeah, and Battle for some reason was absolutely dreadful on D. That probably won't happen again to that degree. Man, even sweeter the fact that he drilled that shot.

I imagine that is why Frankie got so much run in the first half yesterday.

There was one play in the first half where the ball rotated around the top of the key and stopped with an open three point shooter. Neither Battle or Gillon were on him, Battle was closest and you could see him look at him and then mentally make the decision not to bother going after him. He immediately drained the three and I think JB pulled him at the next opportunity.

 

[MSOrange]

I imagine that is why Frankie got so much run in the first half yesterday.

There was one play in the first half where the ball rotated around the top of the key and stopped with an open three point shooter. Neither Battle or Gillon were on him, Battle was closest and you could see him look at him and then mentally make the decision not to bother going after him. He immediately drained the three and I think JB pulled him at the next opportunity.

I noticed the exact same thing and almost blew my stack. I know our defense is bad but at least make an effort.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I love Gillon and Battle. Probably our two best offensive guards we have had since Flynn and Devo, but they don't recognize shooters at all. The metrics back it up as well. That's where most of the defensive inefficiences are coming from according to the stats.

 

[Ghost]

Yeah, and Battle for some reason was absolutely dreadful on D. That probably won't happen again to that degree. Man, even sweeter the fact that he drilled that shot.

I gotta say, that was somewhat surprising last night. He'd been pretty good on D of late and last night it felt like they were a handful of times where he was off in la-la land with an open shooter on his side

 

[iommi]

I love Gillon and Battle. Probably our two best offensive guards we have had since Flynn and Devo, but they don't recognize shooters at all. The metrics back it up as well. That's where most of the defensive inefficiences are coming from according to the stats.

It's so odd with Battle and his defense. I will say that sometimes he plays absolutely terrific defense up there. The odd thing is he was an absolute terror on defense in high school- one of the best on-ball defenders I've seen in person.

When guys dribble in his zone area, he still harasses then well and shows what he's capable of but he's not great at closing out at shooters. I don't know if it's not being good in the zone with his positioning or what. It's like he doesn't want to close because he doesn't want to foul 3-pt shooters.

 

[OttoMets]

Lydon seems to skate by on the board but his defense is terrible to. He's a shade better than Thompson

Good call, someone had to say it. Terrible. Thompson has his moments, but Lydon is such a consistent matador out there. On that "Eurostep" play in the first couple minutes he went rushing past the ballhandler like Chukwu.

The Boeheim comments a week ago were so funny; of course he was just trying to motivate, but some people took it seriously. I'm guessing only one person's still parroting that after the last couple games.

 

[OttoMets]

It's so odd with Battle and his defense. I will say that sometimes he plays absolutely terrific defense up there. The odd thing is he was an absolute terror on defense in high school- one of the best on-ball defenders I've seen in person.

When guys dribble in his zone area, he still harasses then well and shows what he's capable of but he's not great at closing out at shooters. I don't know if it's not being good in the zone with his positioning or what. It's like he doesn't want to close because he doesn't want to foul 3-pt shooters.

He gets drawn into the middle a little too much and for some reason doesn't recover instinctively at all. He's got the skills, though. One more reason to root for a sophomore year for Battle: he could be an all-time great defender here. It'd also help if he played along even one teammate who's above-average. Or even average. It's a negative feedback loop for bad players surrounded by bad players in a zone. Everyone suffers.

 

[PhatOrange]

The Hall of fame coach says otherwise. He says Lydon is great on defense.

And he's being disingenuous about it.

 

[SoBeCuse]

Yep. And Howard hit that 3, but wow he is still a mess. Committed another awful turnover and the charge (which is another turnover). If only Howard was as good as he thinks he is. He tries to do too much because in his head, he's a superstar. Love the confidence, but you have to know who you are and what you're capable of.

Yeah, I don't like his game at ALL. On that charge he had somebody for an easy dump off dunk. Lydon or Robey. He was true to form by committing the jump in the air-pass backward turnover shortly after checking in. But, he did make that 3 and gave us some decent minutes I guess. I suppose Howard wouldn't have been in there if Battle was playing better D.

 

[dasher]

And he's being disingenuous about it.

hmmm He is saying that Lydon is great, not good. What would be his motivation for saying he is great? We are talking about jb here. He isn't afraid to say a guy isn't good on defense or anything else. Could it possible be that he sees things that you don't?

 

[SoBeCuse]

hmmm He is saying that Lydon is great, not good. What would be his motivation for saying he is great? We are talking about jb here. He isn't afraid to say a guy isn't good on defense or anything else. Could it possible be that he sees things that you don't?

I imagine it's similar to his usage of "tremendous."

 

[BlackSquirrels]

Lydon is a very good defender.

It's possible for very good defenders to have bad defensive games. Clemson has been a good offensive team over the course of the entire season and they had a good game plan last night.

Also, considering Lydon is probably aware he needs to be on the court 38+ minutes per game, I expect some lapses.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I think the penetration issues are worse than what the back line is doing. I've seen Roberson, Lydon and White even be good defenders. I haven't seen Gillon or Battle get the positioning yet. I think if that shores up the back line will look a lot better. It's the 3 pt defense that is the most worrisome. Giving up 41% in conference play is unheard of.

 

[NineOneSeven]

And he's being disingenuous about it.

Much better at C than the wing. Yesterday worst game all year from that spot though imo.

 

[SoBeCuse]

Battle and Gillon are quick enough to move their feet and at least anticipate where some of these drives are going. Someone else pointed out that Battle is getting sucked in for some reason too much into the paint and leaving his area/side of the top of the zone. He would have so many steals if he stayed out there. Ugh.

 

[OttoMets]

Lydon is a very good defender.

It's possible for very good defenders to have bad defensive games. Clemson has been a good offensive team over the course of the entire season and they had a good game plan last night.

Also, considering Lydon is probably aware he needs to be on the court 38+ minutes per game, I expect some lapses.

This is something that should be noted. Like Christmas two years ago. Good observation.

Don't agree with the general assessment, though. Lydon's not very aware and doesn't move well laterally (still nursing a bad Achilles?). His positioning leaves a lot to be desired. He is adept at getting a block when he gets beat, though.

 

[upperdeck]

I think most people dont really understand the rotations that well and always assume the guy closest is the one making the mistake. same for the center, just because i guy gets in the middle and makes a shot doesnt always mean that the center is supposed to be the one covering him.

our biggest issue with the guards is not always hustling to the shooter but even then most shooters it doesnt bother them when guys attack them on the shot, you have to be there before the shot

 

[SoBeCuse]

It's possible that Clemson had an easy deuce under the basket as well on their last possession. Lydon was late getting to the guy who made the shot and White was late rotating over to cover Blossomgame under the basket. It's possible White gets there in time to block or foul Blossomgame from behind. Who knows.

Also, Battle goes under the screen on that last Holmes 3. NO!! Just breakdowns galore. Still can't believe Battle made that shot. So awesome!

 

[RF2044]

This is something that should be noted. Like Christmas two years ago. Good observation.

Don't agree with the general assessment, though. Lydon's not very aware and doesn't move well laterally (still nursing a bad Achilles?). His positioning leaves a lot to be desired. He is adept at getting a block when he gets beat, though.

I don't know if I agree. I think Lydon might be playing a bit further out than is ideal, due to having to compensate for the lapses of his teammates. Being a step out of position makes all the difference in the world in terms of being able to recover and make a play [or not].

If we were stouter up top and on the wings, I think Lydon would be free to focus on his own area, and would appear to be a much better defender. Zone defense is the ultimate "you're only as strong as the weakest link" situation.

 

[sugrad68]

The Hall of fame coach says otherwise. He says Lydon is great on defense.

I thought Lydon had an off night defensively against Clemson. No blocks. Clemson players shooting over him constantly, even on the last Clemson possession when they went up by 2. He is usually our best defender. Now that may not be saying much.

 

[OttoMets]

I don't know if I agree. I think Lydon might be playing a bit further out than is ideal, due to having to compensate for the lapses of his teammates. Being a step out of position makes all the difference in the world in terms of being able to make a play or not.

If we were stouter up top and on the wings, I think Lydon would be free to focus on his own area, and would appear to be a much better defender. Zone defense is the ultimate "you're only as strong as the weakest link" situation.

Exactly, without really breaking down the film it's tough to pin this on any individual. Nobody's doing a great job. I think part of the reason Battle sinks into the lane is because Lydon's slow to challenge the high post. That's probably because Lydon's paying too much attention to the baseline, which is because Thompson and White don't seem to notice the baseline, which is because...

And around and around it goes...

 

[PhatOrange]

hmmm He is saying that Lydon is great, not good. What would be his motivation for saying he is great? We are talking about jb here. He isn't afraid to say a guy isn't good on defense or anything else. Could it possible be that he sees things that you don't?

He supports Lydon because he is one of his best players on the team, he's not gonna throw the kid under the buss. Just open your eyes and watch him the rest of the season. He's a better defender at the center spot than he is on the wing though. He's a terrible wing defender, has as many o-lays as anyone else.

I'm not even talking about last nights game I'm talking about all season long. This will be the last I mention it because I'm not gonna bang on Lydon the rest of the season just to prove my point. Open your eyes and watch it for yourself.

 

[dasher]

He supports Lydon because he is one of his best players on the team, he's not gonna throw the kid under the buss. Just open your eyes and watch him the rest of the season. He's a better defender at the center spot than he is on the wing though. He's a terrible winger defender, has as many o-lays as anyone else.

I'm not even talking about last nights game I'm talking about all season long. This will be the last I mention it because I'm not gonna bang on Lydon the rest of the season just to prove my point. Open your eyes and watch it for yourself.

I don't think he is a good wing defender. I do think he is pretty solid in the middle.

 

[Trueblue25]

Orange is the new fast

They didn't know