Seriously, what's with our fast break? | Page 2 | Syracusefan.com

Seriously, what's with our fast break?

We will have to agree to disagree here. A goaltend is a positive result not a bailout. This type of break happens all the time. Perfect from Mintz

It's not. We can dissect this 100 different ways but it's an elementary level 2v1 fast break and Mintz completely butchered it. There are two ways to execute this. Pass upcourt to Bell who draws the defender and dishes back to Mintz for the slam or Mintz keeps, draws the defender himself and dishes back to Bell for the slam. It should be a simple 2v1 draw and dump break. Mintz is a ball hog.
 
It's not. We can dissect this 100 different ways but it's an elementary level 2v1 fast break and Mintz completely butchered it. There are two ways to execute this. Pass upcourt to Bell who draws the defender and dishes back to Mintz for the slam or Mintz keeps, draws the defender himself and dishes back to Bell for the slam. It should be a simple 2v1 draw and dump break. Mintz is a ball hog.
All that would be true...if there was no guy on Mintz tail. In those two ways to execute it that you mention that other guy behind Mintz 100% gets involved. It ain't a 2 on 1 drill in a gym. It is a game scenario at high speeds and it is a play where every millisecond counts. If you are able to take it in strong yourself you should do that every time. There are less moving parts and less that could go wrong. The defender did not fully commit to guarding Mintz so he took it in strong. He was not a ball hog on this play.
 
But if they took any more time the guy behind Mintz catches up to the play. It is not always the right move to pass. If the defender thought he truly had no intentions to pass he would have face-guarded Mintz completely. Instead he sees Mintz head is up and gets caught in no mans land between him and Bell. Mintz finishes strong and the guy behind still nearly blocks it. 100% perfect play from Mintz here. A pass to Bell there and that guy behind the play almost definitely gets involved contesting the shot.
Why would passing the ball take more time? Good passing on the break makes it faster. If Mintz passes it up he can run faster without dribbling. Then if the defender is drawn to the ball, it's an easy lob for an alley-oop. All of that can happen faster than him dribbling up on his own.
 
Why would passing the ball take more time? Good passing on the break makes it faster. If Mintz passes it up he can run faster without dribbling. Then if the defender is drawn to the ball, it's an easy lob for an alley-oop. All of that can happen faster than him dribbling up on his own.
The defender did not fully commit to guarding Mintz so Mintz took it in himself. It was a virtually uncontested lay up. Why complicate the fast break when you do not have to? That is all I am really saying. And again, this type of scenario plays out this way all the time. It is not just some AAU selfish ball hog move. It is a typical fast break scenario. Oh yeah, and we scored!
 
I have never seen a team more inept at running a break with numbers advantage. Are our guys selfish point counters? Has AAU ruined the concept? Does Red not care? We operate on razor thin margins and constantly give away points because we don't have any understanding on how to run a fast break. It's insane.

A friend pointed this out, there are a few things:

1) Judah does NOT want to run. Red has to implore him to run. He should be our Ty Lawson but he slows it down a lot so we should have even more breaks.

2) I was mad that no one was passing, but I'm not sure if we're even filling the right lanes.

We need work on it, but first and foremost, we need guys that WANT TO RUN and run hard.
 
I have never seen a team more inept at running a break with numbers advantage. Are our guys selfish point counters? Has AAU ruined the concept? Does Red not care? We operate on razor thin margins and constantly give away points because we don't have any understanding on how to run a fast break. It's insane.

My son's 2nd-4th grade team has the same problem. :cool: I figure by college kids start to get the hang of it, or so I thought!
 
The defender did not fully commit to guarding Mintz so Mintz took it in himself. It was a virtually uncontested lay up. Why complicate the fast break when you do not have to? That is all I am really saying. And again, this type of scenario plays out this way all the time. It is not just some AAU selfish ball hog move. It is a typical fast break scenario. Oh yeah, and we scored!
You can say that in retrospect, but at the time the right move is advance it as fast as possible. It's not complicating it. It's fundamentals. It's basic basketball for every player on the D1 level. We're not talking about behind the back passes or no looks.

That specific play worked out. But there was at least one other where the fail to pass (not Judah) resulted in a missed shot, and it's happened a bunch of other times previously.
 
You can say that in retrospect, but at the time the right move is advance it as fast as possible. It's not complicating it. It's fundamentals. It's basic basketball for every player on the D1 level. We're not talking about behind the back passes or no looks.

That specific play worked out. But there was at least one other where the fail to pass (not Judah) resulted in a missed shot, and it's happened a bunch of other times previously.
I am sure there are other instances where I would agree with you. In this one though, the defender did not fully commit to playing defense on Judah so taking it in strong himself was the right play. If he fully set up to defend Judah 1v1, and he took a heavily contested layup or borderline charge instead of passing it off to Bell, then I would agree with you. It is not always an error when the ball carrier does not pass in this situation. It depends on the choices of the defender. Only thing I wish Judah did differently was dribble a little faster at the start of the break.
 
A friend pointed this out, there are a few things:

1) Judah does NOT want to run. Red has to implore him to run. He should be our Ty Lawson but he slows it down a lot so we should have even more breaks.

We need work on it, but first and foremost, we need guys that WANT TO RUN and run hard.
The curse of Tyler Ennis. The year our fast break died.
 
All that would be true...if there was no guy on Mintz tail. In those two ways to execute it that you mention that other guy behind Mintz 100% gets involved. It ain't a 2 on 1 drill in a gym. It is a game scenario at high speeds and it is a play where every millisecond counts. If you are able to take it in strong yourself you should do that every time. There are less moving parts and less that could go wrong. The defender did not fully commit to guarding Mintz so he took it in strong. He was not a ball hog on this play.
Mintz can run faster without the ball. He passes and that guy isn’t as close anymore. Mintz is definitely a ball hog on breaks.
 
A friend pointed this out, there are a few things:

1) Judah does NOT want to run. Red has to implore him to run. He should be our Ty Lawson but he slows it down a lot so we should have even more breaks.

2) I was mad that no one was passing, but I'm not sure if we're even filling the right lanes.

We need work on it, but first and foremost, we need guys that WANT TO RUN and run hard.
Benny loping at 3/4 speed drives me insane. He’s exactly the physical style player we used to have that blew the dome roof off on fast break dunks. But he just doesn’t have that gear.
 
Mintz can run faster without the ball. He passes and that guy isn’t as close anymore. Mintz is definitely a ball hog on breaks.
And then the ball is in the hands of ol' reliable Chris Bell. Known for his elite distribution and finishing around the rim. I am sure the alley oop from Bell to Mintz would have gone way more smoothy than the Mintz virtually uncontested layup did.
 
And then the ball is in the hands of ol' reliable Chris Bell. Known for his elite distribution and finishing around the rim. I am sure the alley oop from Bell to Mintz would have gone way more smoothy than the Mintz virtually uncontested layup did.
Are you joking? Chris actually dunks better on breaks than most on this team. His limitations are many, but finishing a break ain’t one.
 
Are you joking? Chris actually dunks better on breaks than most on this team. His limitations are many, but finishing a break ain’t one.
Idk man. Can't believe people think we should have acted differently on a play that ended in an uncontested layup.
 
Idk man. Can't believe people think we should have acted differently on a play that ended in an uncontested layup.
It’s the trend that bothers me. He did it earlier this year when he had an easy pass to Brown for a rim rocking dunk that he kept for himself. I like team basketball. Just who I am despite being a chucker myself.
 
It’s absolutely AAU. They teach the kid to hunt contact, prioritizing getting the foul over the made basket. It’s absolutely infuriating. I can’t tell you how often it happened when my kid would be all alone on the wing ready to pop a three and the best player on the team would go 1 on 3 on the break. And he almost never got the call because he initiated all the contact.

As was said elsewhere in the thread, it’s everywhere in college hoops now. Tough to watch, because a well executed break is a thing of beauty.
Disagree, our opponents and most of college basketball seem to run fast breaks just fine. It’s our players or coaching.
 
i think they lost some games with a lot of turnovers so now red has them gunshy on the fastbreak and overthinking it
 
We have not been able to run a break for 5+ years. Our inability to make layups on breaks is staggering. I long for the days of Sherman Douglas running point and distributing.
Sherm had finishers, like DC, Stevie, Rony, Billy, and Dave Johnson.
 
1) Judah does NOT want to run. Red has to implore him to run. He should be our Ty Lawson but he slows it down a lot so we should have even more breaks.
pretty sure red doesnt want them to run after a few games with a lot of turnovers lately

i think it is all coming from the top to slow it down
 
Passing, spacing, everything. I cannot fathom why and or how we are so awful at it.

We used to start every single practice with fast break drills.
 
We have not been able to run a break for 5+ years. Our inability to make layups on breaks is staggering. I long for the days of Sherman Douglas running point and distributing.

Tyler Ennis broke our fast break. We haven't had one since he was our PG.
 

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