Class of 2022 SG Chance Westry (PA / AZ Compass Prep) TRANSFERRING TO SYRACUSE (4/17/23)

[Sbucketball]

I think of Judah comes back his shooting is going to be much improved. He's got a good looking shot, and in a small sample size, he shot the ball very well at the end of the year.

I’m sure he will be improved, but they still will give him jumpers.

I think Judah and JJ will shoot well enough from 3 to demand respect from the defense. Both look fine shooting.

 

[Sbucketball]

i think it was a strategy purposefully chosen by boeheim, on principle

i dont think it was necessarily laziness...i think he had his reasons and wanted to try to prove a point and also set the team up for next year...

doesnt mean that was the best choice but i get why he did it.

My understanding was JB wanted to leave a full cupboard for Red, so he brought in a core of players who would be there when he retired. Of course that's not nearly as important in the portal era, since teams can be torn down and rebuilt each Spring. Either way, despite the growing pains of last year, it was helpful for Red as he has a core of role players going into his first year. Grab a star or two from the portal and he'll be good to go.

 

[Cuse181]

We got 6 freshman because we were lazy in the portal

How could they have been lazy in the portal when the portal wasn't even open when 5/6 (the 6th being Judah) committed?

 

[cliftonparksufan]

We got 6 freshman because we were lazy in the portal

We take 6 freshman and don't make the NCAAT. Yukon took 4 portal guys and are about to win the NCAAT. Although it was nice bringing in all the freshmen, it was extremely lazy on JAB's behalf. Portalling has to be the new recruiting.

 

[721Comstock]

We take 6 freshman and don't make the NCAAT. Yukon took 4 portal guys and are about to win the NCAAT. Although it was nice bringing in all the freshmen, it was extremely lazy on JAB's behalf. Portalling has to be the new recruiting.

UConn took 4 portal guys AND also recruited like 4 Top 50 guys over the past few years.

You really need to be doing BOTH to maximize a team’s potential.


The only hint of a pass I’ll give JAB about not landing a Portal forward (or begging/bribing Swider to return) was -
Doing so likely causes Benny to bolt, which then means we (likely) don’t get Judah.

He maybe was overconfident in Benny “making the Soph leap”, but I can see how he knew how badly we needed Judah, and made his choices based on that.

Or - he just got lazy.

 

[Cuse181]

We take 6 freshman and don't make the NCAAT. Yukon took 4 portal guys and are about to win the NCAAT. Although it was nice bringing in all the freshmen, it was extremely lazy on JAB's behalf. Portalling has to be the new recruiting.

Texas tech took 5 portal guys and finished .500. Illinois took 3 portal guys and had a worse season then their last 2. It’s not the secret formula, it’s just another ingredient.

 

[pwong]

How could they have been lazy in the portal when the portal wasn't even open when 5/6 (the 6th being Judah) committed?

Because the transfer portal was already up and running for 2 years straight. Other teams had already adapted to the portal and we chose to get 6 freshman.

 

[Cuse181]

Because the transfer portal was already up and running for 2 years straight. Other teams had already adapted to the portal and we chose to get 6 freshman.

Then claim they didn’t utilize it. A conscious choice is very different than a weak effort.

 

[Cuse1055]

So any actual news on Chance? Have to assume a visit will occur in the next couple of weeks (probably not this weekend with Donnie visiting though).

 

[PhatOrange]

the whole idea behind having 6 freshman was to build season on season

it's true sometimes you need to know when to let go and that letting go can be hard

theres possibly a bit of sunk cost that people want to hold on to there...letting go of them now would be letting go of the sacrifices made last year

thing is: were the freshman simply not good or are they good but too young?

i think all of the freshman will be good at some point in their ncaa careers

but the idea is how will they be next season...thats all that really matters...so yeah

if they are willing to hang around without any guarantee of playing time - i think they are - then keep em

but take a player like girard - he scores a lot - but imo is a net negative at the p6 level becuase of shortness, defense and poor decision making - so scoring isnt the only thing to look at

but youre right...the idea should be to bring in talent

i do think a defensive stopper or two will be very important to have around

Spot on

 

[PhatOrange]

We take 6 freshman and don't make the NCAAT. Yukon took 4 portal guys and are about to win the NCAAT. Although it was nice bringing in all the freshmen, it was extremely lazy on JAB's behalf. Portalling has to be the new recruiting.

They also have a good coach, good systems and a defense that gets after it. It’s not because they got some portal kids. Portal kids aren’t always plug and play and can bring their own chemistry issues as well.

 

[Cusefan0307]

They also have a good coach, good systems and a defense that gets after it. It’s not because they got some portal kids. Portal kids aren’t always plug and play and can bring their own chemistry issues as well.

They brought in 4 transfers with just 2 freshmen. One transfer is their 3rd leading scorer and another shoots 44% from 3. So out of their 9 man rotation four played for other schools last year.

 

[DilemaCuse]

Texas tech took 5 portal guys and finished .500. Illinois took 3 portal guys and had a worse season then their last 2. It’s not the secret formula, it’s just another ingredient.

What you posted is true but it looks bad after having a losing season to do a freshman rebuild instead of a portal movement to get an immediate improvement in record

 

[Cuse181]

What you posted is true but it looks bad after having a losing season to do a freshman rebuild instead of a portal movement to get an immediate improvement in record

Well, we could've seen a Texas tech scenario, a 3 seed in '21-'22 falls to .500 in '22-'23. There's no cure-all formula, there were many issues with this team that went beyond the talent on the court

 

[pwong]

Then claim they didn’t utilize it. A conscious choice is very different than a weak effort.

Choosing to not adapt to the transfer portal/not using it effectively would be considered poor recruiting aka a weak effort.

 

[CardiacCuse]

Your right, there's a difference between a guy that has played 4 years, has maxed out in ability and been given opportunity and weve seen the results vs a guy who has only played 1 year and isn't yet the player he could become.

nowadays ncaa teams are really between a rock and a hard place...thats why the final four was no blue bloods basically, imo

you cant build slow anymore, really...not without suffering a lot...plus even if you try that...the players could just blow it up for you by leaving early- you basically can only plan for next month! but a good team takes years to put together, historically...i think thats why the big name coaches all left recently

you cant build quickly very easily, either...i think kentucky hasnt made a final four in like 9 or 10 years or something...and they get every player they want basically. duke has had more success with the one and dones...but not really as much as they should given their priviledge, imo

cant build quick if you are not a top tier blueblood...cant build quick unless you are heavy in NIL and the portal

the landscape has shifted tectonically

even teams like villanova and uva that have been able to build slow and do it with 4 year players are a bit down from where they were

its like threading a needle now

thats why i think - all things considered - bringing in a huge class of freshman that are program players - 4 year guys makes a lot of sense...even though its not the overnight success plan --- that face it doesnt exist unless you can get anyone you want

looking back should still use a lot of portal - but its a very fine line in putting all that together

seems the portal is really the way to go in this era, though

but even if you kill it with that ...you are looking a whole new team the following season...its a hamster wheel for coaches - especailly if you play a gimmick defense that takes multiple seasons to learn **cough cough ** 23 zone

JBs and good coaches advantage over the field was how they accumulated program familiarity from year to year...the new rules eliminate that possibility form even happening...thats why the sport is collapsing imo

 

[Consigliere]

We got 6 freshman because we were lazy in the portal

Except all of the freshmen except Mintz were committed before anyone was in the portal. At the time of their commitment who would you have turned away? Maliq was the lowest rated. Do you tell him ”No thanks. We’re going to wait to see who we can get from the portal.”

 

[AlaskaSU]

i think it was a strategy purposefully chosen by boeheim, on principle

i dont think it was necessarily laziness...i think he had his reasons and wanted to try to prove a point and also set the team up for next year...

doesnt mean that was the best choice but i get why he did it.

We got who we got because our first choices turned us down. Back in the day other coaches lamented that they could not compete against us for recruits. My have times changed.

 

[Cuse181]

Choosing to not adapt to the transfer portal/not using it effectively would be considered poor recruiting aka a weak effort.

Or, in the event that the effort fails, it could've been time better spent on building a long term base versus a one year band aid. The transfer experience worked for some (UConn, Mizzou, Pitt) and failed miserably for others (Georgetown, Texas Tech, Louisville, Florida, Georgia)

 

[AlaskaSU]

UConn took 4 portal guys AND also recruited like 4 Top 50 guys over the past few years.

You really need to be doing BOTH to maximize a team’s potential.


The only hint of a pass I’ll give JAB about not landing a Portal forward (or begging/bribing Swider to return) was -
Doing so likely causes Benny to bolt, which then means we (likely) don’t get Judah.

He maybe was overconfident in Benny “making the Soph leap”, but I can see how he knew how badly we needed Judah, and made his choices based on that.

Or - he just got lazy.

A trusted coach does not beg players to return. He gives honest advice.

 

[Fly Rodder]

I really wish posters would learn how to spell the names of our players.

 

[NYCCuse826]

Not sure if this should be viewed as a good thing. I know it's good to be older in CBB, but if a guy didn't produce at that age in college then there deserves to be some skepticism. It was not like Auburn was a great team themselves.

It's not a good thing. Brandon Miller is a 20 year old freshman FYI. Certain guys are going to dominate at the high school level because they're men playing against boys in the most literal manner.

 

[Sherman20]

We take 6 freshman and don't make the NCAAT. Yukon took 4 portal guys and are about to win the NCAAT. Although it was nice bringing in all the freshmen, it was extremely lazy on JAB's behalf. Portalling has to be the new recruiting.

Exactly. But we had already signed the six freshman. They’d already signed their LOIs. There was no reason at all that we couldn’t also have pounded the portal last spring for an experienced small forward.

 

[Sherman20]

UConn took 4 portal guys AND also recruited like 4 Top 50 guys over the past few years.

You really need to be doing BOTH to maximize a team’s potential.


The only hint of a pass I’ll give JAB about not landing a Portal forward (or begging/bribing Swider to return) was -
Doing so likely causes Benny to bolt, which then means we (likely) don’t get Judah.

He maybe was overconfident in Benny “making the Soph leap”, but I can see how he knew how badly we needed Judah, and made his choices based on that.

Or - he just got lazy.

Benny was the PF. And yes we needed him to return to land Judah. But Grabbing an experienced small forward out of the portal would have been fine and not scared off Benny. It was crazy to go into the season expecting Bell or Taylor to be the starting SF.

 

[Sherman20]

Or, in the event that the effort fails, it could've been time better spent on building a long term base versus a one year band aid. The transfer experience worked for some (UConn, Mizzou, Pitt) and failed miserably for others (Georgetown, Texas Tech, Louisville, Florida, Georgia)

The point is that we didn’t use the portal at all, except to find a backup center. You have to do both (build the roster with both high school recruiting and the portal) and JB didn’t bother with the latter (except for a backup center). Recruiting a base of six freshman is great. But there was a need to find a starting level small forward last spring and JB didn’t do it and we paid the price. He also could have lobbied Cole to return and he didn’t bother with that either. All the assistants were telling him that we needed to get an experienced, proven forward from the portal. JB became very stubborn at the end. There’s no denying that.