So Far We Have the #9 Portal Class...

[Scooch]

I think it’s fair to say a lot of people are still feeling pretty sour we didn’t get BH or JS. It’s probably not going to be a productive conversation until November at this point. I do think there are some here much more excited about the PC roster and I think that would be misguided given its propped up more by the portal rankings sites than the actual quality and fit of the players.

I was never high on Hodgson and I really don't care that he went to PC.

I'm not sour about anything, honestly. I'm simply noting that folks who repeatedly bring up the Siena-Duke game as "proof" of something are being intellectually dishonest. Or at least intellectually lazy.

The list of mediocre-to-bad coaches who managed to pull off a highly unlikely upset is unfathomably long. We could start the list with our very own Red Autry who beat a #7 UNC team.

Way back in 2001 a coach by the name of Steve Merfeld led his #15 Hampton Pirates to the second-ever upset of a #2 seed. Merfeld then went to coach at Evansville, where he was under .500 in each of his 5 seasons, and was fired. That one amazing game wasn't predictive of anything.

There's plenty of valid reasons to claim Gerry may be a successful coach at SU. I sure as hell am rooting for him to be great.

 

[longtimefan]

He is the head coach. EVERYTHING is on his shoulders. That's what being the head coach means.

Sounds like you're referring to Harry Truman--"The buck stops here".The person at the top is ultimately responsible. What a refreshing concept.

 

[Orangezoo]

I was never high on Hodgson and I really don't care that he went to PC.

I'm not sour about anything, honestly. I'm simply noting that folks who repeatedly bring up the Siena-Duke game as "proof" of something are being intellectually dishonest. Or at least intellectually lazy.

The list of mediocre-to-bad coaches who managed to pull off a highly unlikely upset is unfathomably long. We could start the list with our very own Red Autry who beat a #7 UNC team.

Way back in 2001 a coach by the name of Steve Merfeld led his #15 Hampton Pirates to the second-ever win over a #2 seed. Merfeld then went to coach at Evansville, where he was under .500 in each of his 5 seasons, and fired.

There's plenty of valid reasons to claim Gerry may be a successful coach at SU. I sure as hell am rooting for him to be great.

It wasn’t directed at you specifically or meant to discount a valid question. That’s why I threw out the handicap question. I wonder how say the top 15 coaches out there that have taken or will soon be a highly sought after P5 coach would have handled the injuries and absences. Was it a fluke because it’s the MAAC and having Doty or was it a feather in the cap where it might sink others?

 

[SuFTW]

Seriously? They were down TWENTY SIX at the half. You think Indiana was playing balls out in the 2nd half? Or were they simply managing their enormous lead?

Seriously? Your rational is that Indiana was “managing” their lead in the second half? They shouldn’t have to play “balls out” to still score more than Siena in a half.

 

[Cappy3]

Seriously? Your rational is that Indiana was “managing” their lead in the second half? They shouldn’t have to play “balls out” to still score more than Siena in a half.

You do know that Indiana was a mediocre at best team that didn’t make the NCAAs right. Outscoring them in one half after being down 26 isn’t some great accomplishment.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I don't think anyone is sour about Hodgson or Schertz. I think it's more people pushing back against the Gerry hyperbole, as the curtain is already slipping when it comes to NIL, while others talk him up like he can't do anything wrong.

We are concerned fans that want to see our program winning again.

Yes, but, I mean, I am sour about Hodgson. I think we tripped all over ourselves on that one.

Siena finished 3rd in a low major conference.

The focus on Duke versus any other game or the overall picture is crazy.

Doesn't mean he won't be successful, but the cherry picking is crazy for GMac and our roster (especially the Siena guys).

There are people talking about having upwards of 3-4 guys in our usual rotation from a LOW MAJOR team.

I don't think people are grasping the level of winning-the-lottery type luck that would take.

Yes, exactly. I keep referencing "playing the odds." I don't think we're playing the odds. I'll be thrilled if I'm wrong.

But there's already, at least on this board, been a change in the discourse around the expectations for Gerry's coaching tenure. And maybe some of that is justified due to new information or changes in the landscape of men's college basketball coaching. But also... none of it is justified because it only comes down to the results.

 

[SuFTW]

You do know that Indiana was a mediocre at best team that didn’t make the NCAAs right. Outscoring them in one half after being down 26 isn’t some great accomplishment.

Sure I know that, but they were still a big 10 team playing at home. They would be expected to dominate over Siena and they didn’t for the complete game. I made no claim that it was a great accomplishment, I was making the point it showed a coaching ability to make an in game adjustment and looking at just one half is an incomplete picture.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I also think my question about injuries and associated handicap are a valid question. Take out a starter and 3 expected key contributors and then losing a couple others for multiple games. How would other coaches in our search radius for the job have faired in a similar circumstance this past year which is the year being most leaned on in debate?

Because he got the job. That's the credit for successfully managing a roster with enough durability to win his conference tournament.

We already feel the need to throw out all kinds of caveats. For example, any expression of concern over our ability to get talent has had to be couched in an acknowledgement that the roster isn't finished so it's difficult to evaluate.

Again, Gerry got the job. Why do I have to provide caveats about the positive reasons he got it alongside discussion over concerns about how we'll perform as a team because of my evaluation of things as a whole?

 

[Scooch]

Seriously? Your rational is that Indiana was “managing” their lead in the second half? They shouldn’t have to play “balls out” to still score more than Siena in a half.

I mean, yes.

When a team builds a massive lead on an overmatched opponent they, frequently, then play a style designed to manage said lead.

We both watch basketball, right? That happens constantly.

You're suggesting that Siena cutting a 26 point halftime lead to 21 by game's end was indicative of Gerry's phenomenal coaching?

 

[sufan59]

Yes, but, I mean, I am sour about Hodgson. I think we tripped all over ourselves on that one.

Yes, exactly. I keep referencing "playing the odds." I don't think we're playing the odds. I'll be thrilled if I'm wrong.

But there's already, at least on this board, been a change in the discourse around the expectations for Gerry's coaching tenure. And maybe some of that is justified due to new information or changes in the landscape of men's college basketball coaching. But also... none of it is justified because it only comes down to the results.

I want GMAC to build the program to be back in contending for conference and national championships by year 4. That's what Syracuse should be building towards. They are on track in the first month building towards that. If it happens sooner, great! But they are not cutting corners on building the foundation to this program and that is very important. There a million other ways to build this roster with the budget they had, but it's about finding the best value and path that can create a program versus a lightning in a bottle moment year one where if you fall short it isn't sustainable.

 

[SuFTW]

I mean, yes.

When a team builds a massive lead on an overmatched opponent they, frequently, then play a style designed to manage said lead.

We both watch basketball, right? That happens constantly.

You're suggesting that Siena cutting a 26 point halftime lead to 21 by game's end was indicative of Gerry's phenomenal coaching?

I am saying making adjustments and outscoring them in the second half on the road indicates good coaching. You are the one using “phenomenal” as the standard, which is moving the goalposts.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I want GMAC to build the program to be back in contending for conference and national championships by year 4. That's what Syracuse should be building towards. They are on track in the first month building towards that. If it happens sooner, great! But they are not cutting corners on building the foundation to this program and that is very important.

My hypothesis is he will not be able to get to where you're talking about in year 4 if he fails to make the tournament next season.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I am saying making adjustments and outscoring them in the second half on the road indicates good coaching. You are the one using “phenomenal” as the standard, which is moving the goalposts.

So... we're giving Gerry credit for losing a game.

 

[Nicknack]

I don't think anyone is sour about Hodgson or Schertz. I think it's more people pushing back against the Gerry hyperbole, as the curtain is already slipping when it comes to NIL, while others talk him up like he can't do anything wrong.

We are concerned fans that want to see our program winning again.

This is precisely how I feel. I like Gerry and respect the hell out of what he did as a player. I just don't think he was ready to take over for Cuse at a time in which our program is struggling mightily and desperately needs to get back to relevance. At this point, I'm certainly hoping he will succeed but I am still concerned and my confidence is luke-warm.

 

[SuFTW]

So... we're giving Gerry credit for losing a game.

How do you get that?

 

[DoctahLexus]

Kind of wish Duke crushed Siena so people had a more realistic view of the gap between the MAC and the highest level and a more rational view of GMac's results as a coach. Strange to think about the freak out there would be here if we hired GMac after a Duke blowout, but I assume the higher ups would choose him no matter what happened with the Duke game.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

Seriously? Your rational is that Indiana was “managing” their lead in the second half? They shouldn’t have to play “balls out” to still score more than Siena in a half.

Missing the forest for the trees

 

[OttoinGrotto]

How do you get that?

I don't even know anymore.