So will we finally NOT hear the schedule ragging?

[DNABB5]

Since Syracuse will have traveled over 4000 miles before December?

 

[Townie72]

It'll never go completely away. It's too good of a talking point for lazy talking heads to give up on.

When we started to play good competition in games in NYC, the press raised the bar from "SU never plays away from the Carrier Dome" to "SU never plays outside of New York State" ignoring the 300 miles between Syracuse, NY and NYC.

The best we'll hear is a change from "Syracuse never plays outside of New York" to "Syracuse almost never plays outside of New York State"

 

['72 Orange]

There will certainly be "left-handed" compliments - "Syracuse finally breaks with their long-standing tradition of playing Nov & Dec games in the friendly confines of the Carrier Dome and MSG" :bang:

 

[realorange]

Syracuse forced by Big East scheduling to travel to Arkansas.

 

[HOFCeluck]

Since Syracuse will have traveled over 4000 miles before December?

Yes. This year.

 

[Knicks411]

When we go on the road, we don't hear about not going on the road. Amazing how it works.

 

[armory]

When we go on the road, we don't hear about not going on the road. Amazing how it works.

You're naive if you think we wont still be hearing about it.

 

[Knicks411]

You're naive if you think we wont still be hearing about it.

I don't think many people will be complaining about the schedule this year. I don't remember a lot of complaints in 2009.

I'm sure there will be a few lazy people who fall back on it though. So I will amend to say there won't be any legitimate criticism of our schedule this year. (Definitely not from me, and I'm one of the guys who is more vocal about it on this board)

 

[Sgt Cuse]

This coming year you will not hear from the announcers about SU not leaving the dome, or the State, or not playing a true road game. That will be nice.

What you will still hear though, are people on this site saying:
"I don't care about the RPI, or the SOS, I group all teams below the top ___(this will be a level right above the top SU opponent) to be the same. Why can't we play a team in the top ____".

 

[BleedsOrange44]

It'll still be there. Guaranteed Gottlieb and others discuss it Here's th problem. They play at Arkansas which is not a big time opponent. Similar to NC State last season, it's a lose/lose. If Syracuse wins, they were expected to. If they lose, they lost to a lesser opponent. When everyone was discussing how Syracuse never went on the road last year, they said "yeah but NC State doesn't count because they aren't that good." That's how Arkansas will be viewed.

When Syracuse plays against San Diego St on a boat, even though it's across the country, they will say "neutral court game." When Syracuse plays Temple at MSG, they will say "it's in NY, so it's a home game for SU."

Outside of playing UCLA, Arizona, Kentucky, Michigan St, Ohio St, Michigan, Texas, and Kansas on the road non-conference all in the same season, Syracuse will unfairly be ripped for their non-conference schedule. For whatever reason, the media has decided to hold Syracuse to a different standard than the other schools.

They will cling to the "yes but they didn't test themselves against a big time opponent on the road."

 

[OrangeMojo]

nope - you'll still hear it - probably even more

 

[Knicks411]

I really am not sure about this. I don't remember a ton of people killing us for playing State last year. It was more that it was our first non conference road game in 3 years.

There will be some people because some people are lazy. But Gottleib, for instance, is a real sharp guy. I doubt he's going to disparage the schedule next year.

But this touches on what i said a few days ago; there are some people who are lazy and that makes it easier for us as fans to hand wave away any criticism of our OOC schedule. But I don't remember a lot of complaints in 2009, when we challenged ourselves. This year probably won't be as tough as 2009, but Temple is a consistent tournament team, as is SD State, and Arkansas is a team that seems to be on the rise to at least an NCAA tournament contender with Mike Anderson and I believe they had a solid recruiting class last year.

For whatever reason, the media has decided to hold Syracuse to a different standard than the other schools.

Well, the media isn't a single entity, but it might have something to do with going nearly 3 years without playing a non conference game on the road. How many other teams can say that? I've looked at the schedules before; I think we play fewer non conference road games than anyone in the country.

 

[longtimefan]

Well, the media isn't a single entity, but it might have something to do with going nearly 3 years without playing a non conference game on the road. How many other teams can say that? I've looked at the schedules before; I think we play fewer non conference road games than anyone in the country.

There is very little qualitative difference in the non-home schedule played by SU and many of the other top 10 regulars. Over the past few years, the template for most of the elite has been a pre-season tournament, and a neutral site game. Sometimes a single road game. (The exception has been Mich St).

 

[Knicks411]

There is very little qualitative difference in the non-home schedule played by SU and many of the other top 10 regulars. Over the past few years, the template for most of the elite has been a pre-season tournament, and a neutral site game. Sometimes a single road game. (The exception has been Mich St).

Last year Carolina played at Kentucky and UNLV. (I can't recall if that was a road game or a neutral site game in Vegas; Ken Pom has it classified as a road game). They also played at UNC Asheville, but I'll throw that one out. The year before they played at Illinois. The year before they were at Kentucky and College of Charleston. (Who beat them), plus Texas in Austin.


Duke played at Ohio State last year, and at Temple. Year before @ St Johns, and @ Greensboro. (We can throw them out as well). In 2010 they played @ Wisconsin.

Kentucky played @ Indiana last year, the year before @ Louisville and UNC, the year before @ Indiana. (Indiana sucked that year).

Kansas played @ USC last year, the year prior at Michigan and Cal. In 2010 they played at UCLA and Temple.

Ohio State was at Kansas and South Carolina last year, at Florida and Florida State the year before, and at Butler the year prior.

Those teams play road games every single year, sometimes more than 1.

 

[Antiprodigy]

And yet, they managed to be #1 seeds how many times in the last 3 yrs?

Just win, baby!

 

[HoustonCuse]

The angle that we tried to weasel out of the Arkansas game will be played up as fear of going on the road, because we never go on the road. Knicks, your stat (no non-conference road games in 3 years) was harped on last year and is also foolishly misleading. That three year period included games vs Kansas in Kansas City (where they hadn't lost since like 1980 or something) and vs Florida in Tampa. Both wins.

Additionally, how important would a non-conference road game be if everyone was in your conference? Just about every legitimate basketball power on the east coast and midwest is in our conference. Maybe UNC, Duke, and Florida are missing and we've played two out of three of them outside the dome in recent years (and more than once), all wins. In the midwest you have Ohio State and Michigan State - who we've both played on neutral courts more than once in recent years.

Does UNC or Duke or Kentucky have a recent schedule that multiple road and neutral games with UConn, Louisville, Pitt, ND, Georgetown, Cinci, Marquette, Villanova, plus one-offs road/neutrals vs Florida, Kansas, Michigan State, UNC, NC State, etc in the last 2-3 years? Add to that out winning percentage in those games is about 85-90%. Hell, even our cupcake road games have been killers for big teams. We beat St. John's twice at home last year while they were beating Top 10 team after Top 10 team at MSG, including a complete blowout over Duke. When is the last time we lost at the RAC? They beat ranked Florida there last year.

 

[HoustonCuse]

Here's a stat to look up, when was our last non-conference road/neutral loss before Ohio State in the NCAA Tourney this year?

Butler. 2010. What is our overall road/neutral record (including road/neutral games in conference) since 2010?

 

[Knicks411]

Here's a stat to look up, when was our last non-conference road/neutral loss before Ohio State in the NCAA Tourney this year?

Butler. 2010. What is our overall road/neutral record (including road/neutral games in conference) since 2010?

I think that's the argument; it hasn't seemed to hurt the team. But not that other teams play as few road games as us out of the conference.

When is the last time we lost at the RAC?

If you consider when the last time we lost at the RAC was, maybe we should do it more often.

That three year period included games vs Kansas in Kansas City (where they hadn't lost since like 1980 or something) and vs Florida in Tampa. Both wins.

I actually don't think it included the Kansas game, since I was weaseled out and said 3 years instead of 3 seasons. I think the Kansas game was in November of 2008 and the Nc STate game was December of 2011. (See, I'm tricky).

I wanna see more tough road games (and neutral site games too) because I like when we play good teams. The BE schedule is almost always incredibly challenging, and our overall SOS numbers are int he top 15 or so nearly every year. No beef with that, but to me it still kinda sucks when we basically play nothing but home games until January, and it often makes it harder to evaluate the team until conference play starts. I don't believe that it really hurts us in the NCAA tournament. Wonder if the OOC schedule changes with the move to the ACC.

 

[longtimefan]

Last year Carolina played at Kentucky and UNLV. (I can't recall if that was a road game or a neutral site game in Vegas; Ken Pom has it classified as a road game). They also played at UNC Asheville, but I'll throw that one out. The year before they played at Illinois. The year before they were at Kentucky and College of Charleston. (Who beat them), plus Texas in Austin.


Duke played at Ohio State last year, and at Temple. Year before @ St Johns, and @ Greensboro. (We can throw them out as well). In 2010 they played @ Wisconsin.

Kentucky played @ Indiana last year, the year before @ Louisville and UNC, the year before @ Indiana. (Indiana sucked that year).

Kansas played @ USC last year, the year prior at Michigan and Cal. In 2010 they played at UCLA and Temple.

Ohio State was at Kansas and South Carolina last year, at Florida and Florida State the year before, and at Butler the year prior.

Those teams play road games every single year, sometimes more than 1.

The Duke roadies were required by the ACC/Big 10 challenge. St John's is all about showing the Duke flag in NYC. Playing at MSG is no more a road game for Duke than it is for SU.

UK wants to change the IU series to a neutral site game. No game played in the Commonwealth of Kentucky is a road game for the Wildcats (e.g @ LVille).

Two of the Ohio St citations had to do with ACC/Big 10.

The UK/UNC series is an exception, which gives each of them a good roadie every other year.

The rule is one NC game per year, sometimes less.

 

[Knicks411]

You can put all the caveats in there you want (maybe Duke plays a road game anyway if they know there isnt one coming with the challenge, ditto Ohio State) but those teams do play road games every year. We don't. That's all I'm saying. Does that mean the road game we are playing this year doesn't count as one?

Btw, feels like the season has started if we're having this debate again. Should we talk man v Zone next?

 

[pfister1]

I fail to understand why so many of our fans allow the media critics to get under their skin on this point. Our schedule is engineered annually to make our NCAA tournament metrics very competitive, or it least it has been since the year it cost us a bid.

I understand the desire to see better opponents in the Dome, that at least makes sense in that season tickets holders would like a better product for their season ticket dollar.

The NYC games cater to a great number of our fans by making attendance at games an easier possibility for the large number of fans living in the tri-state area. So I can understand the large group that wants to see us leave the Dome for an annual November/December appearance in NYC, which we have been doing pretty regularly now.

But who cares whether we travel to play other teams, so long as the team is prepared and our metrics aren't sacrificed by staying at home and playing the SUNY challenge in the Dome. Other than the handful or so fans that may by chance live in Fayetteville or San Diego, why does having the team play away games in either of those locations really satisfy so many people? Do people really believe that playing a road game in November accomplishes something that isn't accomplished by the conference road contests we play in Jan. Feb and early March, or would you rather satisfy media critics than see JB do what he feels is best to get the team prepared for the conference season and subsequent tournament seasons??

 

[CorduroyG]

poppy will find something wrong with it

 

[jekelish]

I think the only reason we will really hear much is the mess made by Gross pretty publicly protesting the Arkansas game. Now it looks like we are afraid to go on the road, and you KNOW that someone like Seth Davis or Gottlieb will bring that up throughout the year.

 

[CusefanATL]

I fail to understand why so many of our fans allow the media critics to get under their skin on this point.

i stopped reading at this point.

and you still earned a like from me.

 

[kuethstheman]

I think the only reason we will really hear much is the mess made by Gross pretty publicly protesting the Arkansas game. Now it looks like we are afraid to go on the road, and you KNOW that someone like Seth Davis or Gottlieb will bring that up throughout the year.

Yes. It will now be that SU was "dragged, kicking and screaming" to finally play an OOC road game.