Stepping into a 3 vs Coming off a screen...

[Forza Azzurri]

Ok so somebody correct me on this if I am wrong but I believe that all of Cooney's 3s (the 4 makes) on Tuesday were all situations were the ball was thrown out to him and he stepped into the shot as opposed to curling off the screen, catching the ball and shooting.

Historically, with no post-up game to speak of and Cooney being face guarded , the only way to get him a shot was to curl him off a screen where he would catch and shoot.

At the Iowa game, there was that exact play where it just so happened that, as Cooney came off the scrreen, caught the ball and rose up to shoot there was a straight line from our seats through Cooney to the rim.

It was clear as day that he was going to miss. As he rose up with the ball his body kept moving left and I could tell from the second the ball was released it was off target. Sure enough, the ball caroomed off the front-left side of the rim.

Here is my question: Is it possible that Cooney is just not a very good shooter curling off a screen and that Xmas' post-up game may actually allow him to catch and step into some threes and that that fact alone may help him become a better shooter?

General?

 

[sufandu]

I didn't get to see the game, but I've said all along we need to find ways to get him looks without him always having to curl off screens. Maybe having a better interior presence this year will let us do that. I still think we need another shooter so teams can't just focus on him.

 

[jekelish]

Well, it's always easier to shoot a jumper when you're stepping into it as opposed to running off a screen. When you come off a screen, your momentum is gonna carry you in the direction you're moving, which is going to throw off your accuracy. When you step into a three, it's more like a spot up, set shot, and you can go straight up and down and stay square.

I'm not sure there's ever been a shooter who wasn't better stepping into a shot than sprinting around a screen, turning, and firing.

 

[jordoo]

Cooney isn't very good when he is drifting sideways on his shot. Almost no one is though. Andy did maybe the best job of any of our shooters at coming off the screen, catching, turning and righting himself so he was going straight up. Cooney is not very good at this. He does better on the baseline run where he has to stop hard and turn all the way around than he does on the sideline run where he curls around the high screen. On those he just keep fading in the direction he was running which makes the shot almost impossible.

 

[JoeSU]

Ok so somebody correct me on this if I am wrong but I believe that all of Cooney's 3s (the 4 makes) on Tuesday were all situations were the ball was thrown out to him and he stepped into the shot as opposed to curling off the screen, catching the ball and shooting.

Historically, with no post-up game to speak of and Cooney being face guarded , the only way to get him a shot was to curl him off a screen where he would catch and shoot.

At the Iowa game, there was that exact play where it just so happened that, as Cooney came off the scrreen, caught the ball and rose up to shoot there was a straight line from our seats through Cooney to the rim.

It was clear as day that he was going to miss. As he rose up with the ball his body kept moving left and I could tell from the second the ball was released it was off target. Sure enough, the ball caroomed off the front-left side of the rim.

Here is my question: Is it possible that Cooney is just not a very good shooter curling off a screen and that Xmas' post-up game may actually allow him to catch and step into some threes and that that fact alone may help him become a better shooter?

General?

I noticed the exact same thing, going back to last season. And it seems that the more Cooney presses to get off a 3, the more he resorts to taking unbalanced shots coming off screens.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Cooney isn't very good when he is drifting sideways on his shot. Almost no one is though. Andy did maybe the best job of any of our shooters at coming off the screen, catching, turning and righting himself so he was going straight up. Cooney is not very good at this. He does better on the baseline run where he has to stop hard and turn all the way around than he does on the sideline run where he curls around the high screen. On those he just keep fading in the direction he was running which makes the shot almost impossible.

At the beginning of last year, he certainly did not struggle coming off screens. Against Indiana and Nova at home he hit a number of shots curling. Maybe he needs to get spot up looks first.

Brent Axe said something that I think I might agree with. Maybe Trevor is best suited for taking shots near the top of the key. A number of the shots he hit against Michigan were from the backcourt area, I only think one was from the wing. Maybe he's just not a wing shooter.

I do agree with you his shot selection has been spotty. Theres about 8-10 shots he's taken so far this year that literally had no shot of going in because he was either fading away or leaning one way or another.

 

[Toga]

Cooney needs looks coming from a secondary break and from a penetration and kick out. Period. Other than that he should be driving to the basket.

 

[jordoo]

At the beginning of last year, he certainly did not struggle coming off screens. Against Indiana and Nova at home he hit a number of shots curling. Maybe he needs to get spot up looks first.

Brent Axe said something that I think I might agree with. Maybe Trevor is best suited for taking shots near the top of the key. A number of the shots he hit against Michigan were from the backcourt area, I only think one was from the wing. Maybe he's just not a wing shooter.

I do agree with you his shot selection has been spotty. Theres about 8-10 shots he's taken so far this year that literally had no shot of going in because he was either fading away or leaning one way or another.

I bet if you watched he had more time and jumped straight up. This year he is always drifting coming off the curl. Andy would make them once in a while with some minimal drift but I've never seen Trevor make one while drifting. In my memory last year he was coming to a stop off the curl and jumping straight up into the shot when he made them.

There is no doubt that certain shooters are better from certain area's.

 

[Knicks411]

Well, it's always easier to shoot a jumper when you're stepping into it as opposed to running off a screen. When you come off a screen, your momentum is gonna carry you in the direction you're moving, which is going to throw off your accuracy. When you step into a three, it's more like a spot up, set shot, and you can go straight up and down and stay square.

I'm not sure there's ever been a shooter who wasn't better stepping into a shot than sprinting around a screen, turning, and firing.

Which to totally change the subject, is why Steph Curry is so amazing; the guy is one of the best 3 point shooters we've ever seen from a % standpoint and he does so much of it off the dribble as opposed to spotting up.

We were talking Steph Curry, right?

 

[stuckinbig11]

It's all a matter of squaring up before rising up to shoot--can't be going sideways.

 

[General20]

I agree, basically, with what is being said. Every shooter in history is better when he can step into the shot rather than needing to curl off a screen.

I still maintain that Cooney's shooting percentage will ultimately have little to do with how Cooney himself plays and more to do with how the rest of the team plays.

Cooney is a role player and not a star. That much should be clear. I still think he's a very good role player, but right now teams are treating him like a star and making a point to shut him down.

If opposing coaches are going to make a point to stop Cooney all year they will mostly succeed and he's not going to shoot very well. If McCullough, Joseph, Christmas, etc. make it impossible to focus on Cooney then his percentage will be high enough toale everyone happy when it's all said and done.

 

[007]

Well, it's always easier to shoot a jumper when you're stepping into it as opposed to running off a screen. When you come off a screen, your momentum is gonna carry you in the direction you're moving, which is going to throw off your accuracy. When you step into a three, it's more like a spot up, set shot, and you can go straight up and down and stay square.

I'm not sure there's ever been a shooter who wasn't better stepping into a shot than sprinting around a screen, turning, and firing.

Rautins, in his Sr year, might have been one of the best shooters we have ever had coming off screens.

 

[sufandu]

I agree, basically, with what is being said. Every shooter in history is better when he can step into the shot rather than needing to curl off a screen.

I still maintain that Cooney's shooting percentage will ultimately have little to do with how Cooney himself plays and more to do with how the rest of the team plays.

Cooney is a role player and not a star. That much should be clear. I still think he's a very good role player, but right now teams are treating him like a star and making a point to shut him down.

If opposing coaches are going to make a point to stop Cooney all year they will mostly succeed and he's not going to shoot very well. If McCullough, Joseph, Christmas, etc. make it impossible to focus on Cooney then his percentage will be high enough toale everyone happy when it's all said and done.

Spot on. I think most of the Cooney criticism is a result of him not being Gerry McNamara. Everyone wanted him to be a taller more althetic version of him and that's just who he is. We need to dial back the expectation and recognize him for what he is, the role player that you described.

 

[rrlbees]

Rautins, in his Sr year, might have been one of the best shooters we have ever had coming off screens.

I was going to post the exact same thing so I won't.

 

[jekelish]

Rautins, in his Sr year, might have been one of the best shooters we have ever had coming off screens.

Agreed. I actually wrote this very thing last May: http://.com/in-defense-of-trevor-cooney/

 

[Oakland]

I don't think teams are still treating Cooney like a star. Michigan didn't pay special attention to him. He was open several times. It may have been true last season, but not now.

I agree, basically, with what is being said. Every shooter in history is better when he can step into the shot rather than needing to curl off a screen.

I still maintain that Cooney's shooting percentage will ultimately have little to do with how Cooney himself plays and more to do with how the rest of the team plays.

Cooney is a role player and not a star. That much should be clear. I still think he's a very good role player, but right now teams are treating him like a star and making a point to shut him down.

If opposing coaches are going to make a point to stop Cooney all year they will mostly succeed and he's not going to shoot very well. If McCullough, Joseph, Christmas, etc. make it impossible to focus on Cooney then his percentage will be high enough toale everyone happy when it's all said and done.

 

[rrlbees]

I don't think teams are still treating Cooney like a star. Michigan didn't pay special attention to him. He was open several times. It may have been true last season, but not now.

Maybe that's why he made 4 of them.

 

[Dave85]

Ok so somebody correct me on this if I am wrong but I believe that all of Cooney's 3s (the 4 makes) on Tuesday were all situations were the ball was thrown out to him and he stepped into the shot as opposed to curling off the screen, catching the ball and shooting.

Historically, with no post-up game to speak of and Cooney being face guarded , the only way to get him a shot was to curl him off a screen where he would catch and shoot.

At the Iowa game, there was that exact play where it just so happened that, as Cooney came off the scrreen, caught the ball and rose up to shoot there was a straight line from our seats through Cooney to the rim.

It was clear as day that he was going to miss. As he rose up with the ball his body kept moving left and I could tell from the second the ball was released it was off target. Sure enough, the ball caroomed off the front-left side of the rim.

Here is my question: Is it possible that Cooney is just not a very good shooter curling off a screen and that Xmas' post-up game may actually allow him to catch and step into some threes and that that fact alone may help him become a better shooter?

General?

Step 1: Figure out what works.

Step 2: Repeat Step 1

 

[Dave85]

I still think he's a very good role player, but right now teams are treating him like a star and making a point to shut him down.

If G, KJ2, or CMac can draw attention away from TC then maybe he will not get so much attention and do better.

I thought I saw during the MI game a couple of plays where our big guys kicked the ball out to a shooter. I think our team needs to do more kick outs and less sprinting around to get open off screens. I have trouble breathing just watching TC racing around.

 

[Orangezoo]

Something else i noticed was cooney shot with less lift against UM especially in the 2nd half. Its almost like he gets too much lift and overpowers the shot off screens. Even when spotting up he seemed to be lifting off on his shot too strong. When he steps into it with a more natural jumpshot form it looks much better both off his hands and at his base.

 

[General20]

I don't think teams are still treating Cooney like a star. Michigan didn't pay special attention to him. He was open several times. It may have been true last season, but not now.

Why do you think he lead Syracuse in scoring? As I said, the less attention teams pay to him the better he will perform. Michigan did not pay him any special attention and he lead the team in scoring, if they wanted to stop him they could have. That makes him what I've always said he is, a good role player. Not a star.

 

[kcsu]

Maybe that's why he made 4 of them.

The more we get out of our inside players the more they will be forced to collapse. At that point our G's have to step up

 

[Oakland]

What you said is, "right now teams are treating him like a star and making a point to shut him down."

I don't think that has been true for quite a few games.

Why do you think he lead Syracuse in scoring? As I said, the less attention teams pay to him the better he will perform. Michigan did not pay him any special attention and he lead the team in scoring, if they wanted to stop him they could have. That makes him what I've always said he is, a good role player. Not a star.

 

[Forza Azzurri]

I don't think teams are still treating Cooney like a star. Michigan didn't pay special attention to him. He was open several times. It may have been true last season, but not now.

One, I disagree with this statement. I thought Michigan was the first team not to face guard him the entire game.

Two, I think that the Michigan game is starting to show that the General was absolutely spot-on with at least one of his bold predictions (big surprise there, right?):

Christmas was absolutely killing Michigan so Beilein was forced to double Xmas every time he touched the ball. You cannot key on everyone so Cooney became the beneificiary with some open looks.

General has been adamant in saying that Cooney's shooting percentage will be determined, in large part, by the play of the rest of the team.

In the Michigan game, that certainly proved to be the case.

Bravo General.