SU FB History Lesson - Reason to Relax

[OrangePA]

After five seasons Coach Mac, in 1985, finally made it to a bowl game - the Cherry Bowl. Although the team lost to a decent Maryland squad, things looked very positive with a young QB - Donnie McPherson - and a dynamic offense.

But, the following year was a step backward. The team started the season very badly and finished I believe with a 5-6 record - while getting absolutely hammered at Penn State.

So, after six years, there were many who wanted Mac out - the so-called "Sac Mac Pac" was very vocal.

And then the following year we went undefeated and went to the Sugar Bowl.

It turned out that 1986 was simply a necessary moment in the growth of the program.

Lets hope that 2011 was the same kind of growth moment.

 

[Rocco]

I had a dream we beat USC by 21 last night. And Barkley got into a fight with Kiffin. It was great.

 

[RF2044]

I had a dream we beat USC by 21 last night. And Barkley got into a fight with Kiffin. It was great.

Do you have a gut feeling? And is it never wrong? Sorry?

 

[Rocco]

Do you have a gut feeling? And is it never wrong? Sorry?

It's always wrong. :noidea:

 

[MCuse44]

so tired of comparing everything to coach mac era. so many things have changed in the last 30 years...

 

[Eric15]

I had a dream we beat USC by 21 last night. And Barkley got into a fight with Kiffin. It was great.

Was it reminiscent of Zack and Slater's fight on Saved by the Bell?

 

[OrangePA]

so tired of comparing everything to coach mac era. so many things have changed in the last 30 years...

Well yes, things have changed, but the pattern of development in a college program is not necessarily one of those things.

As the talent level increases, the won-loss record does not necessarily follow the same path on the graph.

That's the point.

 

[Millhouse]

Well yes, things have changed, but the pattern of development in a college program is not necessarily one of those things.

As the talent level increases, the won-loss record does not necessarily follow the same path on the graph.

That's the point.

i think this post would be right if it was written in august 2014. that's the year where i am hopeful. this year is a throwaway, next year i'll look for glimpses and expect growing pains, and 2014 will be where i have high expectations

doesn't neccessarily follow mac's path. but i know you're just hoping.

 

[Chip]

After five seasons Coach Mac, in 1985, finally made it to a bowl game - the Cherry Bowl. Although the team lost to a decent Maryland squad, things looked very positive with a young QB - Donnie McPherson - and a dynamic offense.

But, the following year was a step backward. The team started the season very badly and finished I believe with a 5-6 record - while getting absolutely hammered at Penn State.

So, after six years, there were many who wanted Mac out - the so-called "Sac Mac Pac" was very vocal.

And then the following year we went undefeated and went to the Sugar Bowl.

It turned out that 1986 was simply a necessary moment in the growth of the program.

Lets hope that 2011 was the same kind of growth moment.

Was it a necessary moment of growth or just something we overcame? If we went 7-4 in 1986, would we still go undefeated in 1987? I would think so.

There's still a good lesson here though, every football season is unique. One season's failures do not necessarily lead to the following season's failures. To me, 2011 is in the rear view mirror and has no impact on how we'll do in 2012.

 

[rrlbees]

After five seasons Coach Mac, in 1985, finally made it to a bowl game - the Cherry Bowl. Although the team lost to a decent Maryland squad, things looked very positive with a young QB - Donnie McPherson - and a dynamic offense.

But, the following year was a step backward. The team started the season very badly and finished I believe with a 5-6 record - while getting absolutely hammered at Penn State.

So, after six years, there were many who wanted Mac out - the so-called "Sac Mac Pac" was very vocal.

And then the following year we went undefeated and went to the Sugar Bowl.

It turned out that 1986 was simply a necessary moment in the growth of the program.

Lets hope that 2011 was the same kind of growth moment.

So what you are saying is that in 2015 we are going undefeated? Yahoo!! BCS here we come!

 

[MCuse44]

Sure it could be a million different factors: bad coaching, injuries, tough scheduling, learning curve, bad luck...and history does repeat itself, but this is a classic 'appeal to nature' logical fallacy. Just because its natural does not mean its valid, inevitable or ideal.

Well yes, things have changed, but the pattern of development in a college program is not necessarily one of those things.

As the talent level increases, the won-loss record does not necessarily follow the same path on the graph.

That's the point.

 

[orange03]

After five seasons Coach Mac, in 1985, finally made it to a bowl game - the Cherry Bowl. Although the team lost to a decent Maryland squad, things looked very positive with a young QB - Donnie McPherson - and a dynamic offense.

But, the following year was a step backward. The team started the season very badly and finished I believe with a 5-6 record - while getting absolutely hammered at Penn State.

So, after six years, there were many who wanted Mac out - the so-called "Sac Mac Pac" was very vocal.

And then the following year we went undefeated and went to the Sugar Bowl.

It turned out that 1986 was simply a necessary moment in the growth of the program.

Lets hope that 2011 was the same kind of growth moment.

Here's hoping, but the landscape of college football is nothing like it was in 1985. To say we have an uphill battle to become relevant again would be an understatement.

 

[All4SU]

There's still a good lesson here though, every football season is unique. One season's failures do not necessarily lead to the following season's failures. To me, 2011 is in the rear view mirror and has no impact on how we'll do in 2012.

Agree with this statement 100%.

Sometimes you can only see the patterns years later.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

So what you are saying is that in 2015 we are going undefeated? Yahoo!! BCS here we come!

1959 - 1987 - 2015.

It's a 28 year cycle.

 

[rrlbees]

1959 - 1987 - 2015.

It's a 28 year cycle.

That's 2 data points. Yours and OPa's 7 years. I know what record I am predicting for 2015.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

 

[OregonOrange]

That's 2 data points. Yours and OPa's 7 years. I know what record I am predicting for 2015.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

1931 - 1959 - 1987 - 2015

In 1931, we were 7-1-1 and beat Florida, Penn State and Michigan State, three in a row.
So make it three data points and therefore a pattern!

 

[rrlbees]

1931 - 1959 - 1987 - 2015

In 1931, we were 7-1-1 and beat Florida, Penn State and Michigan State, three in a row.
So make it three data points and therefore a pattern!

works for me

 

[PeteCalvin]

1931 - 1959 - 1987 - 2015

In 1931, we were 7-1-1 and beat Florida, Penn State and Michigan State, three in a row.
So make it three data points and therefore a pattern!

So Pat Dye went for the tie in 1931 too? That bastard!

 

[OttoMets]

Was it a necessary moment of growth or just something we overcame? If we went 7-4 in 1986, would we still go undefeated in 1987? I would think so.

There's still a good lesson here though, every football season is unique. One season's failures do not necessarily lead to the following season's failures. To me, 2011 is in the rear view mirror and has no impact on how we'll do in 2012.

Very good distinction to make. The bad years aren't necessarily necessary to the growth of a group or of the program.

 

[Ozcuse]

The interesting and sometimes frustrating thing is that our development and results do not occur in a vacuum. I don't think that we will take a step back next year in team development, but the schedule and overall strength of the teams we play will have a large impact on our record. We tend to look at things in black and white while disregarding that the teams we face are also developing, taking steps forward, backwards, etc. Yes I will be disappointed if our record in 2012 is the same or worse than 2011 but if we show marked improvement in offense and defense and there is hope for 2013, I will be happy.

I was a lot more excited about going 4-8 in 2009 than going 5-7 last year. A lot of that had to do with our development and our strength of schedule. I thought last year we had a very weak schedule and we were lucky to even get to 5-7 with some questionable outcomes (Toledo ref error, Tulane 2nd half collapse, 7 point win over URI). Maybe it's just me being nostalgic but we seemed to earn every win in 2009 and 2010. Last year it seemed we did everything we could to give games away.

 

[OrangePA]

works for me

Me too!

 

[SWC75]

As I posted several times last season:

Ben: 4-5, 5-5, 5-4, 7-3, 5-3-1, 4-4, 5-3, then the real breakthrough at 7-2

Mac: 4-6-1, 2-9, 6-5, 6-5, 7-5, 5-6, and 11-0-1

No reason at all to think it will be any easier- or shorter- now.

 

[rrlbees]

As I posted several times last season:

Ben: 4-5, 5-5, 5-4, 7-3, 5-3-1, 4-4, 5-3, then the real breakthrough at 7-2

Mac: 4-6-1, 2-9, 6-5, 6-5, 7-5, 5-6, and 11-0-1

No reason at all to think it will be any easier- or shorter- now.

so all coaches should get 7-8 years?

it doesnt work that way in todays world where winning is more important to the bottom line than it was yesteryear.

 

[Millhouse]

so all coaches should get 7-8 years?

it doesnt work that way in todays world where winning is more important to the bottom line than it was yesteryear.

BS was 4 games over .500 after 4 years.

Marrone would have to be 7 games over 500 this year to match that 4 year record

so BS isn't a great comparison.

if marrone goes 4-8 this year (that's my guess) , he'll be 7 games under .500 through 4 years just like Mac

marrone is following right in mac's footsteps. hopefully he follows the same blueprint with a great QB. then who knows maybe he makes a mistake goes to the NFL just like Mac.

 

[RoysRunts]

Well yes, things have changed, but the pattern of development in a college program is not necessarily one of those things.

As the talent level increases, the won-loss record does not necessarily follow the same path on the graph.

That's the point.

Difference: Mac had a Head Coach Job and a lot more Pro experience.