SU- Free Throw Shooting- National Rank by Year

[Eric]

Does anyone have information re: SU national rank in free throw shooting by year under JB? Thank you in advance, 44

 

[EastCoast2]

#260, 217, 295, 249 (2010-2011, 2009-2010, 2008-2009, 2007-2008 respectively)

source: http://www.teamrankings.com/ncaa-basketball/stat/free-throw-pct?date=2008-04-08

 

[NKR1978]

#260, 217, 295, 249 (2010-2011, 2009-2010, 2008-2009, 2007-2008 respectively)

source: http://www.teamrankings.com/ncaa-basketball/stat/free-throw-pct?date=2008-04-08

That 2010 team was great.

 

[orangefan13]

A all freshmen team in 07-08.
AO, Kristof, Rick, Harris 08-10 None of those guys even had a face up jumper.

10-11 we had freshmen Keita, Fab, Dion, Fair playing big minutes.

Point is if your going to list the stats you got to list why also.

 

[EastCoast2]

A all freshmen team in 07-08.
AO, Kristof, Rick, Harris 08-10 None of those guys even had a face up jumper.

10-11 we had freshmen Keita, Fab, Dion, Fair playing big minutes.

Point is if your going to list the stats you got to list why also.

But, Harris was $$$$$ from the line in the 6OT game

 

[NKR1978]

But, Harris was $$$$$ from the line in the 6OT game

He just couldn't hit a layup. But if he did it wouldn't have been a 6OT game.

 

[tbonezone]

i can distinctly remember during the tournament some network putting up a graphic (circa stevie thompson era) of bricks flying at a backboard

 

[suthrills]

A all freshmen team in 07-08.
AO, Kristof, Rick, Harris 08-10 None of those guys even had a face up jumper.

10-11 we had freshmen Keita, Fab, Dion, Fair playing big minutes.

Point is if your going to list the stats you got to list why also.

So freshman aren't allowed to make FT's? That's a justification I haven't heard yet.

 

[AlaskaSU]

The Derek Brower, Herman Harried combo would have been happy with 40%.

 

[pfister1]

Point is if your going to list the stats you got to list why also.

Ok - We are consistently ranked in the 200s in free throw percentage, because we miss a lot more free throws than most other teams.

 

[SmilinBob]

Just looking at the form of this 2011/12 version plus not having Rick Jackson shooting the bulk of the free throws will pump up the SU numbers percentage wise.

 

[Knicks411]

Ken Pom has the numbers going back to 2003. We've never ranked better than 150th in the nation over that period.

We're a BAD ft shooting team. Pretty much always have been.

 

[OttoMets]

Just looking at the form of this 2011/12 version plus not having Rick Jackson shooting the bulk of the free throws will pump up the SU numbers percentage wise.

But we're already shooting worse this year than last. By a large margin.

 

[OttoMets]

A all freshmen team in 07-08.
AO, Kristof, Rick, Harris 08-10 None of those guys even had a face up jumper.

10-11 we had freshmen Keita, Fab, Dion, Fair playing big minutes.

Point is if your going to list the stats you got to list why also.

Regardless of whether or not Harris had a face-up jumper (he did), he was a 72% career free throw shooter. Take him away and that team's numbers would have been even worse. Same deal for Dion last year.

Syracuse is a horrible free throw shooting team every year; we see the stats and we know the why.

 

[AZOrange]

Does anyone have information re: SU national rank in free throw shooting by year under JB? Thank you in advance, 44

While it would always be nice to make more free throws, I think the numbers need some perspective here...in 2008-09 when we were 295 (which is pretty bad) we shot roughly 64% from the line. I think a reasonable estimate of "success" should be about 75% (which would make you a top 10-20 FT shooting team). In 2008-09 we shot 884 FTs, making 570. If we had shot 75% we would have had 663 makes. In 38 Games played that makes 2.4 ppg that we lost. Our rank that year for makes was 94. So how much does the bad percentage really affect us?

 

[All4SU]

Regardless of whether or not Harris had a face-up jumper (he did), he was a 72% career free throw shooter. Take him away and that team's numbers would have been even worse. Same deal for Dion last year.

Syracuse is a horrible free throw shooting team every year; we see the stats and we know the why.

Well, I for one don't "know the why." So, Why?

 

[Knicks411]

While it would always be nice to make more free throws, I think the numbers need some perspective here...in 2008-09 when we were 295 (which is pretty bad) we shot roughly 64% from the line. I think a reasonable estimate of "success" should be about 75% (which would make you a top 10-20 FT shooting team). In 2008-09 we shot 884 FTs, making 570. If we had shot 75% we would have had 663 makes. In 38 Games played that makes 2.4 ppg that we lost. Our rank that year for makes was 94. So how much does the bad percentage really affect us?

It still affects us, I think, and really, I'd settle for 70% instead of 75%, which makes the points missed even less of an issue. Part of the FT thing is just that as fans, its the one thing we can do. So when we see a team throwing up bricks, it's frustrating.

Also, one other thing that will change the total, but not by a lot. Missed front ends of 1 and 1's, if you miss those, you never get the chance at the second FT.

But just as an example, we lost the UConn game last year at the garden, and shot 5-11 from the line, and missed at least one front end. Or take a look at the other side, where we won the title in 03 in part because Kansas went 12-30 at the line.

Funny, I looked at our 2 season ending losses the last 2 years, and in both games we shot the same % from the line, 71.4. (5-7 and 10-14, respectively).

So I can see what you're saying, but to me, doesn't make it any less frustrating.

 

[pfister1]

While it would always be nice to make more free throws, I think the numbers need some perspective here...in 2008-09 when we were 295 (which is pretty bad) we shot roughly 64% from the line. I think a reasonable estimate of "success" should be about 75% (which would make you a top 10-20 FT shooting team). In 2008-09 we shot 884 FTs, making 570. If we had shot 75% we would have had 663 makes. In 38 Games played that makes 2.4 ppg that we lost. Our rank that year for makes was 94. So how much does the bad percentage really affect us?

Its really hard to say. You can look at whether having shot a higher percentage effected the outcome of games based on the assumption that nothing else about the game would have changed (obviously that isn't a valid assumption).

In 2008-09 our record was 28-10 (11-7)

Close Losses:
Lost to Cleveland State by 3 at home. We shot 9-18 from the line (50%). 5 additional makes puts us at 77% and gives us the win.
Lost to Providence by 6 down there. We shot 16-20 from the line (80%).
Lost to Villanova by 3 at home. We shot 10-14 from line (71%) - one additional make to get us over 75% would not have been enough to make a difference.

Others:
Lost to Gtown by 14. We shot 10-23 from the line (43%). An additional 7 makes would have put us at about 75% but would not have made up the deficit.
Lost to Pitt by 18 on 7-16 shooting from the line (43%). Hitting 100% would not have made up the 18 point final margin.
Lost to Louisville by 10 on 17-24 shooting (70%). One additional make gets us to 75% but doesn't make up the 10 point margin.
Lost to Villanova by 17 on 27-42 free throw shooting (64%). 4 additional makes gets us to 75%, but does not make up the final deficit.
Lost to UConn by 14 on 6 of 12 shooting (50%). Had we hit 3 more and gotten to 75% it would not have made the difference.
Lost to Louisville by 10 in the BET Championship on 7-14 (50%) shooting. 4 additional makes puts us over 75% but doesn't overcome the margin of defeat.
Lost to Oklahoma by 13 in the Sweet 16. We shot 10-14 (71%) from the line.

Bottom line is that it is hard to know how making a higher percentage of free throws might have impacted those games. At this point I can't tell how many of those misses might have been the front end of one and ones and could be said to have cost us two points. Beyond that if we score more points maybe the game is tighter than the final margin and we actually come out ahead. Its hard to think that getting additional points each game wouldn't yield a tangible benefit in terms of more wins and fewer losses. But the impact might not be as big as we like to think it would be when we look at the percentages and our rank.

 

[EastCoast2]

I think this team has a chance to be the best SU FT shooting team in a while. We don't have AO or Rick taking many shots down low getting fouled. This is a heavily guard-wing oriented offense this season, and we have some very good potential FT shooters in BT, Dion, KJo, CJ, and Dirty, who will be taking the bulk of shots.

 

[OttoMets]

Well, I for one don't "know the why." So, Why?

The short of it is that Boeheim feels that practice time is too valuable to focus on free throw shooting and that our tendency to attempt more free throws that our opponents cancels out our poor percentage.

 

[OttoMets]

I think this team has a chance to be the best SU FT shooting team in a while. We don't have AO or Rick taking many shots down low getting fouled. This is a heavily guard-wing oriented offense this season, and we have some very good potential FT shooters in BT, Dion, KJo, CJ, and Dirty, who will be taking the bulk of shots.

They're all good potential free throw shooters, but the proof is in the pudding - we've got two guys who are good, one guy who is decent, and a handful of guys who are poor but should be good. (I didn't count Southerland; Tuesday was the first time I can remember seeing him shoot a free throw and he looked very good.)

 

[SmilinBob]

But we're already shooting worse this year than last. By a large margin.

It'll get better by a large margin.

 

[OttoMets]

While it would always be nice to make more free throws, I think the numbers need some perspective here...in 2008-09 when we were 295 (which is pretty bad) we shot roughly 64% from the line. I think a reasonable estimate of "success" should be about 75% (which would make you a top 10-20 FT shooting team). In 2008-09 we shot 884 FTs, making 570. If we had shot 75% we would have had 663 makes. In 38 Games played that makes 2.4 ppg that we lost. Our rank that year for makes was 94. So how much does the bad percentage really affect us?

Here's one instance of how it affected us severely:

http://www.orangehoops.org/GameResults/G1988-1989.htm

Our starters shot 62.6% from the line this year; the team as a whole shot 61.1%. Our most talented team ever lost eight times, by 5, 2, 2, 6, 7, 3, 9, and 3.

If we even had mediocre (instead of horrible) free throw shooting that year, we'd have won at least four more games and (given the make-up of that Final Four) had a very good chance at a national champsionship.

A couple free points given away here and there can add up to a very different season.

 

[OttoMets]

It'll get better by a large margin.

I imagine Scoop will improve by a large margin. I bet Fair and Keita will settle back toward their mean. And everyone else seems to be shooting as expected. So while I won't completely write off improvement, I'll not pin any high hopes on it.

 

[AZOrange]

Here's one instance of how it affecting us severely:

http://www.orangehoops.org/GameResults/G1988-1989.htm

Our starters shot 62.6% from the line this year; the team as a whole shot 61.1%. Our most talented team ever lost eight times, by 5, 2, 2, 6, 7, 3, 9, and 3.

If we even had mediocre (instead of horrible) free throw shooting that year, we'd have won at least four more games and (given the make-up of that Final Four) had a very good chance at a national champsionship.

A couple free points given away here and there can add up to a very different season.

That was 20+ years ago! For the most part we are usually 65-68% which at the clip we shoot FTs doesnt mean a whole lot pointwise.