SU GT

[kcsu]

Syracuse is becoming GTish. Two completely different schemes that require opposing teams to prepare differently than other opponents.

Dino like GT is creating a situation that is unique and provides an edge. George Deleone did this as well. Back in the day the unbalanced line was unique.

Today because of our scheme pace and conditioning we are competitive against superior talent. As we continue to shrink the talent gap, and as our players become ingrained in our system we are going to be in position to be a perennial contender. A team that is able to compete with any opponent.

To me this is the only way that SU can achieve sustainable greatness.

Dino is the perfect fit for Syracuse. I hope that our administration realize and do everything within reason to solidify this opportunity as i dont believe that lightning will strike twice.

 

[FAL]

I really like the lightning striking twice analogy. Odds of getting lucky with another hire even close to what Dino brings to the table are slim to none. Wake up admin! It's a new era--don't screw it up!

 

[SoBristol]

Dino provides an edge with his personality. Focus on conditioning and fast pace also provide an edge.

Playing a spread, no huddle, lots of empty backfield, screens to both sides, QB who can run -- not so unusual.

 

[orangefog]

The funny thing is, that the return on investment should outweigh whatever they pay he and his staff.

 

[Chip]

I really like the lightning striking twice analogy. Odds of getting lucky with another hire even close to what Dino brings to the table are slim to none. Wake up admin! It's a new era--don't screw it up!

How do you know they're sleeping?

 

[reedny]

I see the point of the OP. But instead of comparing us to G-Tech, I'd just say we finally have an identity. And not only that, the Head Coach is as exhilarating as the offense.

 

[upperdeck]

All we need is to slightly elevate the athleticism of the talent pool for it to take off.. Instead of plays that are tightly congested with small throwing windows and little YAC, you start to make chunk plays. I think Phillips is great but Johnson is a better burst player and I think we see Butler while not nearly as consistent yet, has more burst than ISH.

we may have more big plays and more drops next year, but then again the system creates lots of easy throws so who knows.. If you are a bit more open maybe you dont need to make the tough catches that ISH is forced to make all the time.. We wont know until next year if anyone can deal with the #1 DB like he has too every game.

 

[Crusty]

Interesting point. The two systems obviously have nothing in common except that they are different from all the others. The fact that ours works best in the dome is an advantage over GT.

 

[Deuga]

I really like the lightning striking twice analogy. Odds of getting lucky with another hire even close to what Dino brings to the table are slim to none. Wake up admin! It's a new era--don't screw it up!

To back up that point... Scott Frost declined as did Chris Ash. I think they're both fine coaches for different reasons, but am glad they both declined. I like the guy we've already got.

 

[kcsu]

I see the point of the OP. But instead of comparing us to G-Tech, I'd just say we finally have an identity. And not only that, the Head Coach is as exhilarating as the offense.

Just pointing out that like GT being different provides an edge a bit of an equalizer.

 

[reedny]

Just pointing out that like GT being different provides an edge a bit of an equalizer.

It's a legit. OP. I don't think we play like G-T (old school spread option), but both schools have a unique identity. Great to have a personality finally, and some excitement surrounding the program. Can't tell you how long it's been (30 years?) since I actually thought we had a chance to beat UM on the road.

 

[FAL]

How do you know they're sleeping?

I don't. And I hope they're not. Just expressing my strong feelings as how I wish the powers that be on the hill should approach their dealings with Dino.

 

[Chip]

I don't. And I hope they're not. Just expressing my strong feelings as how I wish the powers that be on the hill should approach their dealings with Dino.

My opinion with this administration is that if he goes, there wasn’t anything we could do to keep him. Because they’re certainly going to try. This is their guy.

 

[Cusester]

This must be the opinion all you worrywarts have of ADJW's intellect. Relax, he knows what he's doing.

 

[SWC75]

Dino provides an edge with his personality. Focus on conditioning and fast pace also provide an edge.

Playing a spread, no huddle, lots of empty backfield, screens to both sides, QB who can run -- not so unusual.

What we've seen is not really Dino's offesne. This is Dino's offesne:
Eastern Illinois - Cumulative Season Statistics

I don't expect those numbers playing in the ACC Atlantic but I expect that at our best we will approach those numbers. What we have now is a jigsaw puzzle without all the pieces. This year's improvement is not on offense. It's been on defense.

 

[supp]

What we've seen is not really Dino's offesne. This is Dino's offesne:
Eastern Illinois - Cumulative Season Statistics

I don't expect those numbers playing in the ACC Atlantic but I expect that at our best we will approach those numbers. What we have now is a jigsaw puzzle without all the pieces. This year's improvement is not on offense. It's been on defense.

Yep. Still waiting for the scoring to catch up to the yards. Not a complaint as I believe it eventually will. But, like you said, the real improvement this year is on the defense.

 

[Deuga]

Go back two years ago. Babers had just been hired as our new coach. Shortly after the announcement was the MAC Championship game. I made a point of watching the first half so I could see how an experienced Bowling Green team ran the new offense we would inherit. This was the fully operational version being run exactly how it was meant to be run. Watching BG run the offense was like watching poetry in motion. Watching a drive down the field was at times almost like watching a single continuous offensive movement because they moved from play to play in such fluid motion. One big key difference, the QB wasn't constantly running for his life. We see glimpses of that offense. Like our the first drive against Clemson, but I agree we're not quite their yet

 

[anomander]

All we need is to slightly elevate the athleticism of the talent pool for it to take off.. Instead of plays that are tightly congested with small throwing windows and little YAC, you start to make chunk plays. I think Phillips is great but Johnson is a better burst player and I think we see Butler while not nearly as consistent yet, has more burst than ISH.

we may have more big plays and more drops next year, but then again the system creates lots of easy throws so who knows.. If you are a bit more open maybe you dont need to make the tough catches that ISH is forced to make all the time.. We wont know until next year if anyone can deal with the #1 DB like he has too every game.

Absolutely agree with the Johnson and Butler analysis. I will even go a step further and say a pure pocket passer (perhaps Devito) will be a much better fit for this offense than ED. I have said it in several threads, but this offense is meant for a pure pocket passer that has accuracy to consistently make these throws. ED has been great, and I absolutely believe HE is what this offense needs right here and now, but there has been several misses of guys running wide open. A pure pocket passer knocks those down more times than not.

Yep. Still waiting for the scoring to catch up to the yards. Not a complaint as I believe it eventually will. But, like you said, the real improvement this year is on the defense.

We haven't even begun to see what this offense is capable of. I'm sure Dino will be the first to tell you that he is frustrated with how effective the offense has been. Eventually (probably when our run game improves), the points will match the yards, and when they do we will have a top 10 offense in the country.

Go back two years ago. Babers had just been hired as our new coach. Shortly after the announcement was the MAC Championship game. I made a point of watching the first half so I could see how an experienced Bowling Green team ran the new offense we would inherit. This was the fully operational version being run exactly how it was meant to be run. Watching BG run the offense was like watching poetry in motion. Watching a drive down the field was at times almost like watching a single continuous offensive movement because they moved from play to play in such fluid motion. One big key difference, the QB wasn't constantly running for his life. We see glimpses of that offense. Like our the first drive against Clemson, but I agree we're not quite their yet

I just happened to watch that Bowling Green team on several occasions that year since, admittedly, DFS had college tournaments. Bowling Green was one of my favorite teams to stack with Johnson, Roger Lewis, Dehiter, and Greene. They were a well oil machine. I wanted Dino to be our HC half way through that season in fact. Watching that offense was a thing of beauty. The crazy thing is, most people perceive it to be an air raid offense that rarely ran the ball, when in fact I would label the offense as a wanting to run downhill more than anything. Like they do now, they would line up Green and the back up (forgot the name, but also highly productive) and run the same up the middle run play every single time at an extremely high tempo. When things eventually get humming it's not going to be because of an improvement passing the ball, but because we can line up letting you know we are running right up the gut, and doing it play after play, for 5 yards a pop.

 

[SoBristol]

What we've seen is not really Dino's offesne. This is Dino's offesne:
Eastern Illinois - Cumulative Season Statistics

I don't expect those numbers playing in the ACC Atlantic but I expect that at our best we will approach those numbers. What we have now is a jigsaw puzzle without all the pieces. This year's improvement is not on offense. It's been on defense.

Yes -- the improvement has been on defense, largely because Dino brought in juco DEs, added some fiber to the secondary, and has adapted by using more blitzing. The core 5 in the front seven is better in their 4th year than they were in 2016. We aren't relying on true frosh DEs, and we have a coach concentrating on DE play.

On offense, what you see is Dino's offense with our best QB in many seasons, good pieces in the skill positions, and an OL that is not yet where it needs to be. It is good enough to post points on top 10 teams, and should be good enough to win some this November.

No doubt that Dino's offense is better (same as any offense) when he has premier pieces in all spots. Wouldn't hurt to have an elite WR with 4.4 speed.

 

[Nick44]

Excellent post. Especially the comparison to Deleone in the early 90’s.

We HAVE to be unique from the competition. We will never be able to out recruit an OSU, PSU or Clemson.

However, a formula that consists of Dino’s offense, a packed Dome and consistent recruiting classes that rank in the top 25-30 will be a lethal combination.

That is the sweet spot for this program.

 

[RMH44]

Yes -- the improvement has been on defense, largely because Dino brought in juco DEs, added some fiber to the secondary, and has adapted by using more blitzing. The core 5 in the front seven is better in their 4th year than they were in 2016. We aren't relying on true frosh DEs, and we have a coach concentrating on DE play.

On offense, what you see is Dino's offense with our best QB in many seasons, good pieces in the skill positions, and an OL that is not yet where it needs to be. It is good enough to post points on top 10 teams, and should be good enough to win some this November.

No doubt that Dino's offense is better (same as any offense) when he has premier pieces in all spots. Wouldn't hurt to have an elite WR with 4.4 speed.

I completely agree with your last sentence but would rather have an solid, experienced OL.

The offense has been successful largely because Dungey has the ability to improvise. I'd love to see what he could do with a consistently clean pocket where the only time he leaves it is either by design or a result of great coverage by the opponents. Heck, the Miami DL was in his lap almost as soon as he received the snap.

 

[Finwad32]

My opinion with this administration is that if he goes, there wasn’t anything we could do to keep him. Because they’re certainly going to try. This is their guy.

As you know and just pointed out, they are certainly not sleeping on this.

 

[bigmike]

Contrarian pholosophies in sports are always difficult to game plan for. That's why Jim B's zone is so difficult to defeat if you have not seen it on a regular basis - (of relatively recent vintage, see Gonzaga).

While both Dino and GT's offenses are different and hard to plan for, I think if I were a high school kid, there is no doubt that I would prefer to play in Dino's. Three yards and a cloud of dust may be effective, but it's boring.

Comparing the Orange offense to GT is like comparing the old Princeton hoops offense to Grinnell College.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Yep. Still waiting for the scoring to catch up to the yards. Not a complaint as I believe it eventually will. But, like you said, the real improvement this year is on the defense.

The defense has been growing since about the third or fourth game.

The offensive line has been showing improvements the last 2 games, against our 2 toughtest opponents.

No more major injuries, get a couple guys back, and this team is going to go to a bowl game.