The staff and recruiting PGs

[MadNY3]

Since landing Jonny Flynn and Scoop a decade ago, we've only had one successful PG recruit coming out of HS: Tyler Ennis.

One, double check that...is that right?

Two, for an all-Syracuse guard alum coaching staff, that is astounding. And while the program has been pretty good over that time, that's pretty damn bad.

 

[OrangeFoo]

MCW and Brandon Triche say hi. We are on an 2 guard losing streak since Tyler Ennis. What's interesting is Flynn, Triche, Ennis, MCW, Flynn were all relatively elite recruits... Joseph and Howard are borderline elite with Joseph at 50 and Howard at 80-something. Wonder why we have not been getting the truly elite guys the last three years:

It will be curious to see how Joseph does at Creighton. He seems like a victim of being thrown in the deep end way too early.

 

[Zepharus]

Not a PG but just look at Johnson, BJ this year. Kid might be A-10 POY and we pushed him out. Something isn't right on the hill.

 

[NKR1978]

MCW and Brandon Triche say hi. We are on an 2 guard losing streak since Tyler Ennis. What's interesting is Flynn, Triche, Ennis, MCW, Flynn were all relatively elite recruits... Joseph and Howard are borderline elite with Joseph at 50 and Howard at 80-something. Wonder why we have not been getting the truly elite guys the last three years:

It will be curious to see how Joseph does at Creighton. He seems like a victim of being thrown in the deep end way too early.

Wasn't Triche a 3*? He had injury issues that may have dropped him, but might not be remembering it right.

 

[tbonezone]

the same staff that landed fab ,christmas, keita , and dajuan ain't brought us squat underneath in 5 years. where's the beef ?

 

[Brooky03]

Not a PG but just look at Johnson, BJ this year. Kid might be A-10 POY and we pushed him out. Something isn't right on the hill.

He couldn't play defense. We all knew his offense was stellar, but he didn't do well in the zone and wasn't improving as quickly as he should have. Regardless, SF and PF are our two strongest positions this year, so that's not where the problem is.

 

[MadNY3]

MCW and Brandon Triche say hi. We are on an 2 guard losing streak since Tyler Ennis. What's interesting is Flynn, Triche, Ennis, MCW, Flynn were all relatively elite recruits... Joseph and Howard are borderline elite with Joseph at 50 and Howard at 80-something. Wonder why we have not been getting the truly elite guys the last three years:

It will be curious to see how Joseph does at Creighton. He seems like a victim of being thrown in the deep end way too early.

MCW...GOOD CALL. I forgot him. Are two great finds contributed a grand total two years (MCW not much as a FR.)

Regardless of recruiting rankings, just evaluating based on real, meaningful and positive contributions. KJ played a lot at first, but didn't do a ton. Howard...is not doing much against top 300 competition.

 

[tbonezone]

we cut some good players loose to make room for schollies. true. was it in fact a plus sum gain . jury is out.

 

[bevosu]

Personally if I were the coach I never would have let BJ go. A redshirt would have been good for him.

The kid showed that he could rebound, despite his weight. He looked to have potential on the offensive side. Lord knows we can use that.

But in the long run it'll probably work out best for BJ.

 

[FrancoPizza]

Frank Howard was rated in the 70s or 80s... nothing close to elite. We all pinned our hopes that JB finally found an off-guard who could make the transition to point guard. Good guard play has been so desperately hard to come by that we all have been reading too much into a nice play here and a flashy pass there. Overall he's playing like a marginal top 100 combo guard. We shouldn't be ripping him - he is what he is. Same for gillon. The staff couldn't find someone better and here we are in this predicament.

 

[orangecuse]

Not a PG but just look at Johnson, BJ this year. Kid might be A-10 POY and we pushed him out. Something isn't right on the hill.

I don't believe we pushed him out, but I'm not certain. One thing that is clear, is that BJ was in no way physically ready to play as a true frosh and absolutely should've been red shirted. I think the staff mismanaged him for sure in that capacity. I've seen a couple of LaSalle games this year and BJ does look pretty good.

The year off transfer rule certainly benefited him as he has matured somewhat physically, however, he's still quite thin and at 6'6"/7" still doesn't appear strong enough to do any damage inside, certainly not against the big boys. From what I've seen (very short sample size) he's best hanging out on the perimeter and taking threes...something we really don't need more of this year as that is not really our issue.

 

[doc05]

Frank Howard was rated in the 70s or 80s... nothing close to elite.

I think he barely ended up in the top 100, 90 something.

 

[doc05]

What's interesting is Flynn, Triche, Ennis, MCW, Flynn were all relatively elite recruits... Joseph and Howard are borderline elite with Joseph at 50 and Howard at 80-something. Wonder why we have not been getting the truly elite guys the last three years

Triche was a 3 star guy outside the top 100. He was just someone we were on from the beginning before he got injured. Joseph and Howard were ranked higher than him.

 

[pearl31]

this thread is sorely needed because there have only been about 13 other threads in the past 24 hours rehashing this topic over and over

 

[FrancoPizza]

this thread is sorely needed because there have only been about 13 other threads in the past 24 hours rehashing this topic over and over

Sonny, the rehashing is the only thing you've got. The forum is a ghost town. Everyone has packed their suitcases and left, except for some looters. You're spending your remaining days trying to police a bunch of looters. How's that working out for you?

 

[cuseinseattle]

Wasn't Triche a 3*? He had injury issues that may have dropped him, but might not be remembering it right.

You are not remembering right. Perhaps you are mixing up Brandon and Howard.

 

[doc05]

You are not remembering right. Perhaps you are mixing up Brandon and Howard.

He is remembering right. Triche was not highly rated. He basically missed his sophomore year in HS and his star rating never really recovered.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I don't believe we pushed him out, but I'm not certain. One thing that is clear, is that BJ was in no way physically ready to play as a true frosh and absolutely should've been red shirted. I think the staff mismanaged him for sure in that capacity. I've seen a couple of LaSalle games this year and BJ does look pretty good.

The year off transfer rule certainly benefited him as he has matured somewhat physically, however, he's still quite thin and at 6'6"/7" still doesn't appear strong enough to do any damage inside, certainly not against the big boys. From what I've seen (very short sample size) he's best hanging out on the perimeter and taking threes...something we really don't need more of this year as that is not really our issue.

His dad still posts here. I am very sure that BJ wanted to play that first year. He's a good kid with skills, and I think he will do very well at La Salle. Best of luck to him.

 

[IthacaMatt]

He is remembering right. Triche was not highly rated. He basically missed his sophomore year in HS and his star rating never really recovered.

Triche may not have been a 4 star, but he went up against Jonny Flynn in the NYS playoffs and had an epic game against him. Flynn was a 4+ star who blew up. They each went for something like 40 points in a semifinal or final.

 

[doc05]

Triche may not have been a 4 star, but he went up against Jonny Flynn in the NYS playoffs and had an epic game against him. Flynn was a 4+ star who blew up. They each went for something like 40 points in a semifinal or final.

Yeah Triche was still the NY player of the year his senior year so you can probably take the star rating somewhat with a grain of salt. But every point guard we recruited mentioned in this thread was ranked higher than him.

 

[jdubs30]

Personally if I were the coach I never would have let BJ go. A redshirt would have been good for him.

The kid showed that he could rebound, despite his weight. He looked to have potential on the offensive side. Lord knows we can use that.

But in the long run it'll probably work out best for BJ.

I believe BJ didn't want to redshirt? Not sure though.
The poster earlier in this thread is right though - our record would be the same with BJ. Our backcourt is the issue. Could BJ maybe have played the 2? Possibly - but we'd be lackluster at the PG spot

 

[Cusefan0307]

Triche may not have been a 4 star, but he went up against Jonny Flynn in the NYS playoffs and had an epic game against him. Flynn was a 4+ star who blew up. They each went for something like 40 points in a semifinal or final.

That game was at Manley I believe and was a Holiday tournament. Triche was a SO and Flynn was a SR. It was right before Triche blew out his knee.

 

[Melancer46]

It's fun to think we pushed an elite player out of the program for no good reason, but the simple fact of the matter is that BJ didn't look like an ACC caliber player during his time here. Kudos to him for killing it at LaSalle so far, but he was a liability defensively that didn't do anything besides shoot on offense, and he couldn't actually shoot while he was here.

 

[br801]

It's fun to think we pushed an elite player out of the program for no good reason, but the simple fact of the matter is that BJ didn't look like an ACC caliber player during his time here. Kudos to him for killing it at LaSalle so far, but he was a liability defensively that didn't do anything besides shoot on offense, and he couldn't actually shoot while he was here.

He actually was a pretty effective rebounder here, and obviously showed flashes offensively, but you're essentially right. I believe he was only 17 as a freshman (in an era when many are 19), so taking a redshirt likely would have made a tremendous difference in his development. I'm happy he is doing well now at LaSalle, but he's two years removed from SU and much more developed physically. Anyone who believes the BJ we're seeing now was somehow available to JB in the two seasons he spent here is crazy.

 

[OrangeFoo]

He actually was a pretty effective rebounder here, and obviously showed flashes offensively, but you're essentially right. I believe he was only 17 as a freshman (in an era when many are 19), so taking a redshirt likely would have made a tremendous difference in his development. I'm happy he is doing well now at LaSalle, but he's two years removed from SU and much more developed physically. Anyone who believes the BJ we're seeing now was somehow available to JB in the two seasons he spent here is crazy.

But isn't it JB's job to see the player he would become and nurture him and help him get there? Oh wait... he doesn't have the patience to develop players any more.