the wisc non flagrant call

[upperdeck]

why was there no foul called on the wisc guy flailing around with multiple elbows? i thought the rule didnt even require contact when you throw elbows just like a punch doesnt? did they think the arizona guy faked it?

 

[jdubs30]

The Wisconsin guy (I think it was Gasser) didn't raise his elbows above his shoulder, so they weren't gonna call it. If his elbows were above his shoulder, they would have called it.

 

[upperdeck]

that has nothing to do with the call. you still cant flail elbows around and clock people.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

why was there no foul called on the wisc guy flailing around with multiple elbows? i thought the rule didnt even require contact when you throw elbows just like a punch doesnt? did they think the arizona guy faked it?

I'm guessing they knew he faked it.

the rule is excessive contact. Hard to say there was excessive contact, especially when he was being fouled.

 

[samspann1]

The Wisconsin guy (I think it was Gasser) didn't raise his elbows above his shoulder, so they weren't gonna call it. If his elbows were above his shoulder, they would have called it.

Is that part of the rule?

 

[CuseFaninVT]

The Wisconsin guy (I think it was Gasser) didn't raise his elbows above his shoulder, so they weren't gonna call it. If his elbows were above his shoulder, they would have called it.

He was also bending over practically to his knees.

 

[Jasoncuse]

I mean, what else is he supposed to do? He's trying to protect the ball while getting grabbed/fouled by two defenders. Maybe if these buffoon refs would call the foul initially, they wouldn't have to wait for these elbows to start moving.

 

[jdubs30]

that has nothing to do with the call. you still cant flail elbows around and clock people.

Yes, it does. If you raise your elbows above your shoulders they will call a flagrant 1.

Gasser's elbows were low and Johnson was practically on his knees.

It was the right call.

 

[orangehomer]

are people still thinking that these is some sort of rhyme or reason to college reffing? no two games are called alike and hell no 5 minutes of the same game are called alike.

 

[jdubs30]

Is that part of the rule?

Yes. Think of everytime you've seen that called this year. How many times was the dude who got called for it swinging his elbows that low?

 

[thebigeast44]

Johnson did his best to win a nighttime emmy with his performance on that play - looked like someone shot him. Reminded me of the bogus dives in soccer.

 

[samspann1]

Yes. Think of everytime you've seen that called this year. How many times was the dude who got called for it swinging his elbows that low?

I checked the rule. That's not a factor.

Not that I expect these idiots to adhere to the rule book, or anything.

 

[jdubs30]

I checked the rule. That's not a factor.

Not that I expect these idiots to adhere to the rule book, or anything.

I was under the assumption was the offending player's elbows had to be above his shoulders, but rereading it, it appears if you strike an opponent above his shoulders, the foul comes into play. But I mean, what was Gasser supposed to do? Johnson had his head at Gasser's number. I agree with the non call there; that's different to me than raising your arms above your shoulders and swinging.

 

[pearl31]

Replay showed there wasn't contact actually made. Johnson did his best actress routine and (thank god) didn't get away with it.
kudos to the refs on that one

 

[CuseFaninVT]

Replay showed there wasn't contact actually made. Johnson did his best actress routine and (thank god) didn't get away with it.
kudos to the refs on that one

I think the elbow did brush his cheek, but about 2 seconds earlier than his acting routine.

 

[pearl31]

I think the elbow did brush his cheek, but about 2 seconds earlier than his acting routine.

key word: brush

 

[CuseFaninVT]

key word: brush

Exactly. I nearly went with caress it was so light.

 

[kuethstheman]

I was under the assumption was the offending player's elbows had to be above his shoulders, but rereading it, it appears if you strike an opponent above his shoulders, the foul comes into play. But I mean, what was Gasser supposed to do? Johnson had his head at Gasser's number. I agree with the non call there; that's different to me than raising your arms above your shoulders and swinging.

It doesn't matter that is unfair. That's the rule. What was Cooney supposed to do?

 

[jncuse]

A few differences in the play to note:

1) Cooney swung up a bit from a crouch, and Gasser swung flat while Johnson was in a crouch position.

2) Johnson did one of the worst fake dives ever.

That being said, I'm not sure if flat motion/upwards motion or position of opponent matters under the new interpretation. Maybe it does, I just dont know if the new interpreation separates this type of contact in theat way.

 

[jncuse]

Johnson did his best to win a nighttime emmy with his performance on that play - looked like someone shot him. Reminded me of the bogus dives in soccer.

Is there an emmy for worst performance by an actor?

The fact that there was such a long delay before his reaction really made him look bad.

 

[samspann1]

That being said, I'm not sure if flat motion/upwards motion or position of opponent matters under the new interpretation. Maybe it does, I just dont know if the new interpreation separates this type of contact in theat way.

Motion or opponent's position do not matter under the rules

 

[Ghost]

Not that I thought it should be called, but you don't always react right away.

A few games ago we had a play that highlighted that fairly well. I think it maybe Ennis or Fair going to the rim and the defender swiped their face and got them pretty good in the eye. They still finished the lay-up before reacting to the hit. It's not that abnormal to have a delayed reaction to minor contact. I was watching in a bar though, replays may have shown that ZERO contact occurred on that play. Not sure.

 

[SmilinBob]

If this rule stays I'd have two guys cover the rebounder (if I saw on tape they did on occasion fly the elbows) and try to draw a T.

 

[upperdeck]

there are two different rules.. the one being enforced this year is for accidental/incedental type contact. swinging elbows intentionally like the wisc kid is the same as throwing a punch.. no contact is required to get called for it.

 

[Scotch]

The elbow rule is the worst rule in any level of basketball.

Rather than enforcing the elbows, referees have to enforce the non-stop defensive "reaching in" that occurs when a player secures a ball. Reaching in used to be an automatic foul, even with minor contact, and it prevented the need to aggressively defend possession by swinging arms/elbows.

In today's game, what the is a player with the ball supposed to do? Just give in to the three guys surrounding him and fouling him and settle for a jump ball? It's insanity. Call the reaches early and often, and all of this goes away. The reaching in isn't a basketball play - the game needs to respect possession.