This year's Kentucky team is not an all time team
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realorange
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Kentucky's bigs are going to destroy most teams. They are not just big, they are talented and athletic as well.
Jake
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Meh. I watched that game yesterday, anyone who doesn't see how great Kentucky is fooling themselves. Their defense makes the Ewing teams look like sieves.
Offensively their just average, because of that silly platoon system. Late in the year Calipari will abandon that and put Ulis in the drivers seat. When that happens, they'll be much better offensively...and unbeatable.
Offensively their just average, because of that silly platoon system. Late in the year Calipari will abandon that and put Ulis in the drivers seat. When that happens, they'll be much better offensively...and unbeatable.
Gotothehole
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Good team yes. Great team no. We all know how this team was built. The real question is will us cotinine to sit on the sidelines or sub into the game. We have a deep fan base alumni with deep pockets as well.
I didnt think UK played great defense I thought UL played awful on offense. neither team ran any offense for most of the game and tried to see who could make the dumbest mistake. too many forced shots and UL missed the open ones when they got them. Uk has size though that will make most teams struggle. UL still being in the game late shooting 20% tells you that if you can play D you can beat Kentucky, but if you cant you have no shot, too many bodies.
orangefog
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If he takes the wheel from whichever Harrison is the "point guard", he will severely damage his draft status. That will destroy his entire BS image of "getting guys to the league". He will have taken a few can't miss NBA guys and gotten them nowhere. Of course, it won't matter, they will still get tons of talent. Cal will spin it somehow and people will eat it up.
Knicks411
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For whatever it's worth, UK right now is 5th in the nation in offensive efficiency. If anything, I think maybe you could turn the bolded statement around on 09 UNC; they were first in the country in offensive efficiency (by a mile), but only 21st defensively. 2008 Kansas, for instance, was 2nd in offense, first in defense. 2012 UK, 2nd in offensive, 8th in defense.
I mean, I get that the SEC is weak and 40-0 is always tough, but UK has already played 4 teams in the Ken Pom top 20 and beaten all of them by at least 8. Providence is top 50 (barely) and UK beat them by 20, and UCLA is just on the other side of the top 50, and UK emasculated them.
They are the prohibitive favorite but the hype they get is because of their 40-0 potential which in my opinion comes from the fact the SEC depth at basketball is not good.
UK is unbeatable at home because their crowd intimidates the refs and all the breaks go UK's way. They played at UL yesterday and finally had a game where their opponent didn't killed with foul trouble and UL hacks a lot.
The inconsistency of the Harrison twins offensive game makes their offense not that great. Ulis is their best guard and for their sake Calipari needs to give him more minutes.
Calipari has learned from K how to game the schedule. UK plays home games, neutral site games and every two years at UL. Calipari dumped long time rival Indiana from the UK schedule Because Indiana wanted a home/home on campus rather than Calipari's neutral site perferance. Calipari is smart and knows how much HCA is and with UK's fanbase neutral site games lean UK.
UK destroyed UCLA and Kansas on neutral courts but that game at Texas was horribly officiated at Rupp. They are the best defensive team probably since the 1984 Ewing Georgetown teams but they lack a James Young SG from being scary offensively.
SWC75
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Here's a question: factoring in style of play, guys who used to stay for 4 years, the growth over taime of players and the coahcing of the game, modern training methods and anything else that seems relevant, how far back can you go in searching for teams that woudl beat Kentucky or teams that you'd consider "greatest ever"?
Jim Boeheim tlaks about the Indian teams of the mid 70's that lost one game in two years, (when Scott May was out with a broken arm and thyey lost by 2 to the Kentucky team that beat SU in their next game). He recalls one game vs., a good Virginia Tech team where Indian had 20 ppints beofre Tech could even get off a shot. (And to think that that team could have had Larry Bird on on it if he didn't get homesick for French Lick).
i recall the '67-68 UCLA team that lost by two to Houston and Elvin Hayes when Lew Alcindor, (Kareem Abdul- Jabbar before his conversion), had a scratched eye, then played the Cougars again when they were 31-0 and ranked #1 in the national semi-finals and crushed them 101-69. At one point they had a 78-34 lead in that game. I remember thinking that there never has been or ever will be a better team than that UCLA team.
That UCLA team had a 7-1 center and forwards who were 6-8 and 6-7, so they had decent size. Their backcourt was small by modern standards, 5-11, 6-2. But they would have looked scrawny next to modern players. Indian's front line in 74-76 was 6-7, 6-11, 6-7 and probably physically stronger than the UCLA guys but not this year's Kentucky team. The Hoosiers had a big backcourt at 6-3, 6-7.
Yet I'd favor the SU teams of the late 80's onver the SU teams of the early 2010's, even though both had great runs and a generation ahd passed. We've had no one I'd compare to Coleman or Ownes or even Washington or Douglas. And Seikaly is better than any center we've had in this era.
So how far back can you reasonably go, looking for the best team ever? When do you stop comparing players and just compare accomplishments?
Jim Boeheim tlaks about the Indian teams of the mid 70's that lost one game in two years, (when Scott May was out with a broken arm and thyey lost by 2 to the Kentucky team that beat SU in their next game). He recalls one game vs., a good Virginia Tech team where Indian had 20 ppints beofre Tech could even get off a shot. (And to think that that team could have had Larry Bird on on it if he didn't get homesick for French Lick).
i recall the '67-68 UCLA team that lost by two to Houston and Elvin Hayes when Lew Alcindor, (Kareem Abdul- Jabbar before his conversion), had a scratched eye, then played the Cougars again when they were 31-0 and ranked #1 in the national semi-finals and crushed them 101-69. At one point they had a 78-34 lead in that game. I remember thinking that there never has been or ever will be a better team than that UCLA team.
That UCLA team had a 7-1 center and forwards who were 6-8 and 6-7, so they had decent size. Their backcourt was small by modern standards, 5-11, 6-2. But they would have looked scrawny next to modern players. Indian's front line in 74-76 was 6-7, 6-11, 6-7 and probably physically stronger than the UCLA guys but not this year's Kentucky team. The Hoosiers had a big backcourt at 6-3, 6-7.
Yet I'd favor the SU teams of the late 80's onver the SU teams of the early 2010's, even though both had great runs and a generation ahd passed. We've had no one I'd compare to Coleman or Ownes or even Washington or Douglas. And Seikaly is better than any center we've had in this era.
So how far back can you reasonably go, looking for the best team ever? When do you stop comparing players and just compare accomplishments?
Eric15
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As it is, it might be in the first weekend.
I'd sign up for an 8/9 seed in the tournament in a second. That means we had a very solid ACC campaign.
007
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I have a feeling that on Selection Sunday all the talk will about whether it would have been good for Kentucky to have 1 loss going in. They will platoon/sleep walk their way through the rest of the season and then Calipari will play his "best" players in the tournament in a "us against the World run to make history."
Kentucky is loaded with NBA talent across the front line, Ulis will be an NBA PG soon, Lyles is an elite scorer, and even if they can't score a ton, this might be the BEST defensive team in HISTORY (listen to Pitino's post game presser). This Knetucky team is not just about media hype. The only thing that will derail them is if they implode from within, IMO.
ssbriefcase
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The Harrison's struggle with small scrappy guards. I think we're mostly all in agreement Ulis should start and take the bulk of the minutes. But while their inside d is very dominant, their perimeter d is suspect.
There isn't a doubt they can be beat. My pick to beat them would be Zona, but I don't know if they shoot it from the perimeter good enough. But dam, Louisville wouldn't have even had to shoot an all time great game to win. They chose dumb contested shots, I put that more on them than the d. And how many kick out wide open 3's did they miss? They shot 26% from the field and 21% from 3 and lost by 8.
There isn't a doubt they can be beat. My pick to beat them would be Zona, but I don't know if they shoot it from the perimeter good enough. But dam, Louisville wouldn't have even had to shoot an all time great game to win. They chose dumb contested shots, I put that more on them than the d. And how many kick out wide open 3's did they miss? They shot 26% from the field and 21% from 3 and lost by 8.
Shark58
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Give us Tyler, Jerami and a healthy DaJuan...and we'd probably still lose because you can't beat them inside and we still wouldn't have the outside game needed to do so.
But I wish we had those guys though. If we played Kentucky it would be in the Final Four. As it is, it might be in the first weekend.
if you want to play the "what if" didn't jump/healthy game pencil in Marquis Teague and Archie Goodwin as their starting guards and add Anthony Davis, Noel, Kidd-Gilchrist, James Young, Poythress and Julius Randle to the front court. Don't think we win that hypothetical matchup too often.
SWC75
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But would Kentucky have all those guys if all those guys had stayed? I think we'd still have all our guys if Ennis and Grant were here. And for Coleman, it's all about his being healthy. And I did say I thought we'd lose anyway, just later.
longtimefan
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If they have all those guys, they don't have a bunch of those who are on their roster this season.
if you want to play the "what if" didn't jump/healthy game pencil in Marquis Teague and Archie Goodwin as their starting guards and add Anthony Davis, Noel, Kidd-Gilchrist, James Young, Poythress and Julius Randle to the front court. Don't think we win that hypothetical matchup too often.
Shark58
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its a bs hypothetical anyhow so cut 4 and choose your roster:
PG: Teague, Andrew Harrison, Ullis
SG: Goodwin, Aaron the twin, Booker
SF: Kid-Gilchrist, Young, Poythress
PF: Unibrow Monsterman, Randle, Lee, Lyles
C: Noel, Cauley-Stein, Dakari, Towns
if we could put together a roster of Cuse guys from the past 5-6 years, we could field a team that could run with those guys. probably not win often, but could take a few out of 10 from those guys.
longtimefan
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Interesting.
Notice there is one spot that is not covered by their current (healthy) roster--SF. And wing scoring is where they're weakest.
But they have 3 C's. Hard to get near the rim.
Shark58
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and they still look kinda beastly without Poythess (who probably wouldn't make my cut)
CaptainJ
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That's better than being so far below the radar that you're not flying, like certain teams.
Cusefan0307
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Kentucky is a Great defensive team. Offensively they are ok. Louisville was a great defensive team. Offensively, I like Syracuse's talent better than Louisvilles. Kentucky may sleep walk through the regular season, but they will be tested come tournament time.
jordoo
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MCW and DION would be better than their starting backcourt and we would have steady Ennis to back them up. BUT good god putting together and SU team out of guys that would be eligible still this season makes it easy to see where we have fallen short. Where are our shooters? We absolutely still need t0 play Cooney at times and probably more than Ennis. I think they would play Noel, Davis and Gilchrist up front which would deadly even against Rak, CJ, Jerami.