Thoughts

[Francis03]

Killed it. I completely agree with all 10 points.

 

[SoBeCuse]

View attachment 9674

Haha. He's back on FX with some new show. Nothing topped that original HBO 'Da Ali G Show' back around 2004 before the cat was let out of the bag. All those interviews were priceless.

 

[Francis03]

Francis I would be interested in getting your thoughts on next years rotation if Ennis and Grant do come back?

Forget about rotations. If those two come back then anything less than a final four would be a major disappointment.

Since you asked though here goes what I think JB will role with and what I would do.

JB
PG-Ennis, KJ2
SG-Cooney, Mike G, Buss
SF-Roberson, Mike G, BJ
PF-Grant, CMac
C-Rak, DC2, Chino

KJ, G, CMac, and depending on how DC2 knees check out will complete the bench. I think Buss, BJ, and Chino will get squeezed out unless they become too good to keep on the bench.

Me
PG-Ennis, KJ
SG-Mike G, Cooney, Buss
SF-Roberson, Mike G, BJ
PF-Grant, CMac
C-Rak, DC2, Chino

I think KJ, Cooney, BJ, CMac, and DC2 could become JB's best 2nd team lineup ever. You'll have two guys that can create off the bounce, a couple of shooters, an athletic freak, and a low post space eater. What's not to love but unfortunately that's a pipedream most likely.

 

[longislandcuse]

I think we would have won a couple more games this season with Triche. Specifically, Dayton.

That's not the point though. You can win with role players like Triche and CJ but you can't win making them go-to players when they are not. That's why we have to bring in those dreaded Dion types

 

[Francis03]

Haha. He's back on FX with some new show. Nothing topped that original HBO 'Da Ali G Show' back around 2004 before the cat was let out of the bag. All those interviews were priceless.

Lol yeah I saw one of the new episodes. Like you said nothing will match the original though.

 

[Francis03]

That's not the point though. You can win with role players like Triche and CJ but you can't win making them go-to players when they are not. That's why we have to bring in those dreaded Dion types

You gotta role the dice on a wild card like Dion/MCW once in a while. Might not work out all the time but I rather take that risk if it's worthwhile. Imagine if JB would've turned down Melo because there was a possibility that he wouldn't have qualified. Speaking of that, it still feels like yesterday when this whole board was sweating bullets worrying if Melo had gotten the qualifying ACT score during his last attempt lol.

 

[SUFan44]

That's not the point though. You can win with role players like Triche and CJ but you can't win making them go-to players when they are not. That's why we have to bring in those dreaded Dion types

Exactly my point.

 

[Whitey23]

Cooney is going to be the starter next year, and he is going to be great. His biggest problem was being forced into action too soon. Most shooters take a few years to round into form. This was true of Shumpert, Nichols, Rautins, Southerland, even Wes Johnson (though his growth came at Iowa St. and not SU). Unfortunately the difference between Cooney and most of those guys is we had no other options. We had to play him as a freshman when he should have been sitting the bench and improving his game as Patterson did this year.

You lost me here. This was his 3rd year in college and 2nd year playing. He averaged 11.2 mpg last year. How was he forced into action too soon?

 

[longtimefan]

That's not the point though. You can win with role players like Triche and CJ but you can't win making them go-to players when they are not. That's why we have to bring in those dreaded Dion types

Let me sharpen my point. While you can't win with 5 Triche-like role players, you also can't win with none of them.

 

[SUFan44]

Let me sharpen my point. While you can't win with 5 Triche-like role players, you also can't win with none of them.

Agree, but we had way too many this year, including four of five starters (I actually think Grant has some potential to be an alpha player, but never got the ball to prove it or wasn't ready to be that guy).

 

[Cusefan0307]

Let me sharpen my point. While you can't win with 5 Triche-like role players, you also can't win with none of them.

I think triche got screwed not playing the point extensively, we have hardly had any jump shooting since rautins and JB wanted him playing off the ball and that wasn't the strength of his skill set. Scoop definitely wasn't a two. Triche was much better when he initiated the offense. In our losses in the tournament against Ohio state and michigan the the last two years he was one of the main reasons we were even in those games when dion/scoop/mcw struggled on the ball.

 

[phil77]

Forget about rotations. If those two come back then anything less than a final four would be a major disappointment.

Since you asked though here goes what I think JB will role with and what I would do.

JB
PG-Ennis, KJ2
SG-Cooney, Mike G, Buss
SF-Roberson, Mike G, BJ
PF-Grant, CMac
C-Rak, DC2, Chino

KJ, G, CMac, and depending on how DC2 knees check out will complete the bench. I think Buss, BJ, and Chino will get squeezed out unless they become too good to keep on the bench.

Me
PG-Ennis, KJ
SG-Mike G, Cooney, Buss
SF-Roberson, Mike G, BJ
PF-Grant, CMac
C-Rak, DC2, Chino

I think KJ, Cooney, BJ, CMac, and DC2 could become JB's best 2nd team lineup ever. You'll have two guys that can create off the bounce, a couple of shooters, an athletic freak, and a low post space eater. What's not to love but unfortunately that's a pipedream most likely.

I am wondering if JB will start Mike G at the 3 instead? And have KJ play minutes at both guard spots?

Do you think too much depth with JB's short rotations could start to have a negative impact on recruiting? What I mean if JB is playing Ennis 38 minutes a night again abd KJ is forced to a bench spot basically do you think that kind of stuff will start to make the bigger ticket recruits shy away from coming to Cuse or has it already?

 

[Francis03]

Agree, but we had way too many this year, including four of five starters (I actually think Grant has some potential to be an alpha player, but never got the ball to prove it or wasn't ready to be that guy).

I think Grant has some alpha in him as well, which is why I would love for him to come back and lead the charge. So many holes and flaws in his game that I think he can work on and become a top 10 pick in the 2015 draft instead of going in the 20's if he was to leave now.

 

[General20]

You lost me here. This was his 3rd year in college and 2nd year playing. He averaged 11.2 mpg last year. How was he forced into action too soon?

He should have played zero minutes last year. Like Patterson (who did not red shirt, but did go to prep school) he was just not ready. He got those minutes because he was literally the only option as back up guard.

If you compare Cooney's stats this year to any other sophomore he comes out looking pretty good, not because his year was so excellent, but because sophomores don't usually shoot all that well from deep. Which is why I have a rule, never judge a shooter or a big man until their junior year.

My point is people are down on Cooney because they saw more of him in his freshman and sophomore years than they did of other shooters, but if you compare him to other shooters at that stage of development he actually comes out looking pretty good. Nobody knows the future, but history gives us every reason to believe that Cooney makes a significant leap as both a player and a shooter next year.

 

[Whitey23]

He should have played zero minutes last year. Like Patterson (who did not red shirt, but did go to prep school) he was just not ready. He got those minutes because he was literally the only option as back up guard.

If you compare Cooney's stats this year to any other sophomore he comes out looking pretty good, not because his year was so excellent, but because sophomores don't usually shoot all that well from deep. Which is why I have a rule, never judge a shooter or a big man until their junior year.

My point is people are down on Cooney because they saw more of him in his freshman and sophomore years than they did of other shooters, but if you compare him to other shooters at that stage of development he actually comes out looking pretty good. Nobody knows the future, but history gives us every reason to believe that Cooney makes a significant leap as both a player and a shooter next year.

So Cooney shouldn't be judged on his performance this year because he was put into games last year (as a 20 year old RS Freshman)?

 

[RF2044]

He should have played zero minutes last year. Like Patterson (who did not red shirt, but did go to prep school) he was just not ready. He got those minutes because he was literally the only option as back up guard.

If you compare Cooney's stats this year to any other sophomore he comes out looking pretty good, not because his year was so excellent, but because sophomores don't usually shoot all that well from deep. Which is why I have a rule, never judge a shooter or a big man until their junior year.

My point is people are down on Cooney because they saw more of him in his freshman and sophomore years than they did of other shooters, but if you compare him to other shooters at that stage of development he actually comes out looking pretty good. Nobody knows the future, but history gives us every reason to believe that Cooney makes a significant leap as both a player and a shooter next year.

I don't think there's any way around viewing his shooting percentages overall as being disappointing--especially after the hot start. And some stats are slightly misleading [like the reasonably solid three point percentage, which is actually not all that bad, but which doesn't tell the story about the peaks and valleys, and the lengthy streaks in both directions at various times during the season].

But in the main I agree with your premise. For a sophomore, his output was pretty good [again, other than the shooting percentages], and I believe he can / will get better, and build upon the experience he gained this year as a starter. He needs to play better against the better caliber opponents. If he does that, he'll be a very good player for us these next two years.

 

[Francis03]

I am wondering if JB will start Mike G at the 3 instead? And have KJ play minutes at both guard spots?

Do you think too much depth with JB's short rotations could start to have a negative impact on recruiting? What I mean if JB is playing Ennis 38 minutes a night again abd KJ is forced to a bench spot basically do you think that kind of stuff will start to make the bigger ticket recruits shy away from coming to Cuse or has it already?

I think JB will be loyal to Cooney and that he'll start at the 2 no matter if Ennis returns or not.

JB has always played a short bench for the longest and it hasn't hurt us in recruiting, so I don't think it'll hurt us now imho. I think since unlike UK and a few other programs we aren't locking down numerous 5 star guys every year, it makes for more less high maintenance kids and those who are willing to be patient and wait their turn.

 

[MikeSU02]

I'm boycotting the main board because I know

Great post Francis. Always appreciated.

My few takes are:

Cooney - My concern with him is this: If he improves his shooting consistency and ability to read screens, I think he would be best utilized as a heat check guy / super sixth man. If he wants to expand his game and improve his dribbling and ability to get into the lane, look more to rebound or be a facilitator (I know a lot of this is dependent on what JB is calling for), then I think he should still start. I just don't see him improving EVERYTHING during the off season. And to be fair, I don't think anyone outside of a very few can make that type of single off season improvement. His 3pt FG% was a very solid 38%, but that doesn't convey the impact of his streakiness and the volume of shots he would continue to take. And the larger problem, if he is to stay a starter, is that his overall FG% was at 41% (I believe). I hate knocking the kid because it's such a fire starter for this board, but he played WAY too many minutes for what he was asked to do (in a perfect world, I mean). You can't expect a kid like him to basically be Ray Allen for 30+ minutes a game. With all that said, G did himself no favors with his production this year, albeit in limited time.

Rak/Chino - if DC2 does not come back, I don't think people are giving this its rightful concern. Unless I'm totally off base, if we are depending on Chino for more than 5-8 minutes a game, we are in big trouble. That is a lot of pressure on Rak to stay in the game.

Ennis/Grant and the NBA - I think I see things differently than some. I don't know what these two will do, but I think Jerami should go to the NBA and I think Tyler should at least consider coming back, even though I think Ennis will be the better NBA player. Even if Jerami develops at a solid level, consistent mid-range game, more in control going to the rim and scoring while getting bumped, maybe even a true back to the basket fade away or baby hook, etc... I don't think he is ever cracking anything but the late lottery. He's a tweener at the NBA level and unless he adds a lot of weight to his frame or develops a serious 3 pt shot, he is who he is. Ennis, on the other hand, can contend to be the #1 PG overall next year and that means possibly a top five pick. That gives him more clout within the org that picks him, more endorsements, etc.

Making the Jump - I really hope it's Roberson. I know Bees was high on him and I can see why. I hope he starts getting the system (or whatever it is that is holding him off the court) so that he can give us that dynamic scorer and rebounder we need.

Future Recruits - I really want Bryant and Battle. Would love to get Franklin Howard as well. I want dynamic offensive players and fierce competitors.

JB and Coaching Overall - I know this won't change and I know I'm pissing into the wind, but he needs to extend his bench at least by a single player and most likely, 1.5 players. You can't ask TC to run around consistently for the amount of minutes in the amount of games we play. You can't have G be the only backup guard we have. And once DJC went down, we absolutely needed another warm body in the rotation even if meant losses during the regular season. I know these are kids with TV TOs every four minutes, but that is such a meat head response that doesn't take into consideration the wear and tear over a season. Also, as others have stated, I think we need to re-calibrate to have more ball movement overall. Reduce the dependency on one or two guys and make it a priority to board and get out in transition.

Overall, I feel like we end up with teams that are built for regular season success and not post-season success. It's tough to say that with our recent run, but that is how this team felt in retrospect. No dynamic scoring, limited ball movement, no bench and a defense that was good, but not elite. I'll always remember the Pitt game, the 25-0 start, the Duke game and the culmination of the career of one of my favorite players in CJ Fair, even though I never thought he fit the bill of the #1 man on offense (and his inability to make a pass once he started an offensive move drove me insane).

95% of college basketball fans out there would love to have our problems, but so goes it for fans of elite teams. You expect Final Fours, lots of wins and not to be upset by the Daytons of the world.

But the best part is that there is always next year. 40-0. But I'm not putting that on a t-shirt.

 

[rrlbees]

Forget about rotations. If those two come back then anything less than a final four would be a major disappointment. Since you asked though here goes what I think JB will role with and what I would do. JB PG-Ennis, KJ2 SG-Cooney, Mike G, Buss SF-Roberson, Mike G, BJ PF-Grant, CMac C-Rak, DC2, Chino KJ, G, CMac, and depending on how DC2 knees check out will complete the bench. I think Buss, BJ, and Chino will get squeezed out unless they become too good to keep on the bench. Me PG-Ennis, KJ SG-Mike G, Cooney, Buss SF-Roberson, Mike G, BJ PF-Grant, CMac C-Rak, DC2, Chino I think KJ, Cooney, BJ, CMac, and DC2 could become JB's best 2nd team lineup ever. You'll have two guys that can create off the bounce, a couple of shooters, an athletic freak, and a low post space eater. What's not to love but unfortunately that's a pipedream most likely.

I think the reason JB couldn't and wouldn't use the lineup you like Francis is because the starting lineup would now have zero deep threats. Every team would play zone and the kind where you keep one foot in the paint. That would deter many of the strengths this group has. We also don't have Fair and while he had a real bad year shooting the 3, he was a small threat.

 

[Francis03]

I think the reason JB couldn't and wouldn't use the lineup you like Francis is because the starting lineup would now have zero deep threats. Every team would play zone and the kind where you keep one foot in the paint. That would deter many of the strengths this group has. We also don't have Fair and while he had a real bad year shooting the 3, he was a small threat.

I hear what you're saying but when Cooney is going through one of his cold streaks does it matter? Wouldn't it be better to have other guards who can at least create their own shot and penetrate instead of being one dimensional? Even if G would start that wouldn't stop Cooney from getting major minutes if he's on point with his shot, but having him play 30 minutes laying out bricks doesn't make much sense imo when he doesn't provide much in the other departments.

 

[rrlbees]

I hear what you're saying but when Cooney is going through one of his cold streaks does it matter? Wouldn't it be better to have other guards who can at least create their own shot and penetrate instead of being one dimensional? Even if G would start that wouldn't stop Cooney from getting major minutes if he's on point with his shot, but having him play 30 minutes laying out bricks doesn't make much sense imo when he doesn't provide much in the other departments.

I hear you, but while this isn't a popular opinion I can assure you the way it is looked at is just having the threat on the floor drawing attention 100% of the time, keeps the other team in m2m and spreads the floor a little and "unclogs" the middle some. It takes one defender out of the equation for help defense. But of course it's even more effective if he is hitting.

 

[SUFan44]

I hear you, but while this isn't a popular opinion I can assure you the way it is looked at is just having the threat on the floor drawing attention 100% of the time, keeps the other team in m2m and spreads the floor a little and "unclogs" the middle some. It takes one defender out of the equation for help defense. But of course it's even more effective if he is hitting.

Here's a quick counter - why not allow other teams to play zone? Who cares if they're clogging the paint - our best offense this past season was offensive rebounding, and isn't it easier to offensive rebound if the other team is playing zone? Haven't we had our struggles rebounding defensively out of our zone?

 

[rrlbees]

Here's a quick counter - why not allow other teams to play zone? Who cares if they're clogging the paint - our best offense this past season was offensive rebounding, and isn't it easier to offensive rebound if the other team is playing zone? Haven't we had our struggles rebounding defensively out of our zone?

With the type athletes we have we would rather play vs m2m.

 

[mark79]

I think we are going to see a big jump from Silent G. To my untrained eye, he showed the last few games the ability to drive and dish, something we sorely missed to get some easy buckets for our bigs.

Would have liked to see Tyler do more of that last year. Most of he times he penetrated, he shot the ball and near the end of the season it just wasn't going in.

 

[Antiprodigy]

What we need most, and it goes along the lines of what bees is saying, is that we need a shooter in the line-up at all times, to spread out the defense and allow the dribble drive. That is why I am really hoping that Grant comes back, and develops into a decent 3pt threat. Winning the SU lottery would be having that occur, and BJ and/or Buss becoming consistent 3pt threats. We need multiple shooters, so you can give Cooney a breather, or go to the hot hand. We see so many teams bringing in a shooter that rains down 2-4 3's against SU. SU needs that too, and I am impatient, I don't want to wait for Mr. Richardson to arrive in another year.