Turnovers

[Eric15]

Judah looks reckless at times, but surprisingly for a freshman point guard, he takes care of the ball well. Here are minutes per turnover averages for every notable SU point guard in their first season as a starter since 1980.

Pearl: 1087 min / 111 TOs = 9.79 minutes per turnover
Sherm: 1240 min / 121 TOs = TOs = 10.24 minutes per turnover
Autry: 1030 min / 112 TOs = 9.20 minutes per turnover
Sims: 1353 min / 123 TOs = 11 minutes per turnover
Hart: 1142 min / 99 TOs = 11.53 minutes per turnover
Griffin: 1247 min / 98 TOs = 12.72 minutes per turnover
McNamara: 1235 min / 85 TOs = 14.52 minutes per turnover
Flynn: 1243 min / 95 TOs = 13.08 minutes per turnover
MCW: 1408 min / 136 TOs = 10.35 minutes per turnover
Ennis: 1215 min / 58 TOs = 20.95 minutes per turnover
Mintz: 366 min / 23 TOs = 15.9 minutes per turnover

Obviously, we haven't entered into conference play yet with harder competition, but as a general observation, the only player since 1980 who takes care of the ball better than him was Ennis (with an incredible 21 minutes played per turnover).

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Judah looks reckless at times, but surprisingly for a freshman point guard, he takes care of the ball well. Here are turnovers per minute averages for every notable SU point guard in their first season as a starter since 1980.

Pearl: 1087 min / 111 TOs = 9.79 minutes per turnover
Sherm: 1240 min / 121 TOs = TOs = 10.24 minutes per turnover
Autry: 1030 min / 112 TOs = 9.20 minutes per turnover
Sims: 1353 min / 123 TOs = 11 minutes per turnover
Hart: 1142 min / 99 TOs = 11.53 minutes per turnover
Griffin: 1247 min / 98 TOs = 12.72 minutes per turnover
McNamara: 1235 min / 85 TOs = 14.52 minutes per turnover
Flynn: 1243 min / 95 TOs = 13.08 minutes per turnover
MCW: 1408 min / 136 TOs = 10.35 minutes per turnover
Ennis: 1215 min / 58 TOs = 20.95 minutes per turnover
Mintz: 366 min / 23 TOs = 15.9 minutes per turnover

Obviously, we haven't entered into conference play yet with harder competition, but as a general observation, the only player since 1980 who takes care of the ball better than him was Ennis (with an incredible 21 minutes played per turnover).

That’s an interesting list of stats. The number of average possessions would be informative

 

[kuethstheman]

When evaluating Judah's taking care of the ball, it might be accurate to count of few of his shots each game as TOs.

 

[BigNastyJon]

I would’ve thought ennis stacked up better.

 

[upperdeck]

Mintz takes less turnovers because most of mistakes turn into wild shots right now..

Turnovers also require passing unless you dribble yourself into trouble,

 

[721Comstock]

I would’ve thought ennis stacked up better.

He is - by far - the best overall in this stat.

Not sure how he coulda stacked up better than being a distant #1.

Methinks you’re misunderstanding how this stat works.

 

[Eric15]

I would’ve thought ennis stacked up better.

The bigger number is better here. Minutes per turnover, not turnovers per minute.

 

[BigNastyJon]

Apologies I’m a dumb ass. I’m also really hungover from SU Bills doubleheader - that’s my excuse

 

[hoopsupstate]

A lot of the poor shots that Judah takes are as bad as a turnover. Poor shot selection can be worse than live turnovers.

 

[AlaskaSU]

He has a very low dribble. Even when he is shoved off-balance he keeps possession. He also has quick reflexes. Love his handle but not his shooting. He lacks strength to go up strong like Waiters or craftiness like Devo, not ro mention outside shooting and a floater like Gmac.

 

[Otto'd]

That’s an interesting list of stats. The number of average possessions would be informative

This ^^

It is interesting but to me it doesn't tell the entire story of "taking care of the ball" not even close. Possession has to be factored in.

 

[Red Holzman]

Not letting the TO's bother me too much at this point.
Judah is getting after it, staying aggressive and finding out what does/doesn't work.
If smart, he'll learn and adapt and be a better player for it.
Kind of like a new driver practicing winter driving by forcing spins in parking lots(?!)

 

[721Comstock]

Not letting the TO's bother me too much at this point.
Judah is getting after it, staying aggressive and finding out what does/doesn't work.
If smart, he'll learn and adapt and be a better player for it.
Kind of like a new driver practicing winter driving by forcing spins in parking lots(?!)

Lol!!

I got busted by the cops for doing that in HS!!

I was doing power-slides, handbrake turns, and donuts, when the cop rolled up to me and flashed his lights.

Cop - "what do you think you're doing??!!"
Me - "practicing!!"
Cop - "go home. NOW."

 

[UnderHisOwnPower]

Judah looks reckless at times, but surprisingly for a freshman point guard, he takes care of the ball well. Here are minutes per turnover averages for every notable SU point guard in their first season as a starter since 1980.

Pearl: 1087 min / 111 TOs = 9.79 minutes per turnover
Sherm: 1240 min / 121 TOs = TOs = 10.24 minutes per turnover
Autry: 1030 min / 112 TOs = 9.20 minutes per turnover
Sims: 1353 min / 123 TOs = 11 minutes per turnover
Hart: 1142 min / 99 TOs = 11.53 minutes per turnover
Griffin: 1247 min / 98 TOs = 12.72 minutes per turnover
McNamara: 1235 min / 85 TOs = 14.52 minutes per turnover
Flynn: 1243 min / 95 TOs = 13.08 minutes per turnover
MCW: 1408 min / 136 TOs = 10.35 minutes per turnover
Ennis: 1215 min / 58 TOs = 20.95 minutes per turnover
Mintz: 366 min / 23 TOs = 15.9 minutes per turnover

Obviously, we haven't entered into conference play yet with harder competition, but as a general observation, the only player since 1980 who takes care of the ball better than him was Ennis (with an incredible 21 minutes played per turnover).

wow, GMac was stout, that's an impressive #

 

[OrangeYaGladi]

Tyler Ennis my favorite player in the post- Melo era

 

[UnderHisOwnPower]

Judah looks reckless at times, but surprisingly for a freshman point guard, he takes care of the ball well. Here are minutes per turnover averages for every notable SU point guard in their first season as a starter since 1980.

Pearl: 1087 min / 111 TOs = 9.79 minutes per turnover
Sherm: 1240 min / 121 TOs = TOs = 10.24 minutes per turnover
Autry: 1030 min / 112 TOs = 9.20 minutes per turnover
Sims: 1353 min / 123 TOs = 11 minutes per turnover
Hart: 1142 min / 99 TOs = 11.53 minutes per turnover
Griffin: 1247 min / 98 TOs = 12.72 minutes per turnover
McNamara: 1235 min / 85 TOs = 14.52 minutes per turnover
Flynn: 1243 min / 95 TOs = 13.08 minutes per turnover
MCW: 1408 min / 136 TOs = 10.35 minutes per turnover
Ennis: 1215 min / 58 TOs = 20.95 minutes per turnover
Mintz: 366 min / 23 TOs = 15.9 minutes per turnover

Obviously, we haven't entered into conference play yet with harder competition, but as a general observation, the only player since 1980 who takes care of the ball better than him was Ennis (with an incredible 21 minutes played per turnover).

I think Billy E should be added as well. Not trying to give you more work, but he ran the show pretty well as I recall

 

[Eric15]

I think Billy E should be added as well. Not trying to give you more work, but he ran the show pretty well as I recall

Edelin (2003-04 when he started): 563 min / 34 TO = 16.55 minutes per turnover. You're right, he was very solid with the ball.

 

[UnderHisOwnPower]

Edelin (2003-04 when he started): 563 min / 34 TO = 16.55 minutes per turnover. You're right, he was very solid

To overstate the obvious, that 2003 team was insane. Their per 40 numbers are mind bottling, showing these assist numbers have mostly to do with the supporting cast. gotta play with finishers to be elite.

 

[rrlbees]

Judah looks reckless at times, but surprisingly for a freshman point guard, he takes care of the ball well. Here are minutes per turnover averages for every notable SU point guard in their first season as a starter since 1980.

Pearl: 1087 min / 111 TOs = 9.79 minutes per turnover
Sherm: 1240 min / 121 TOs = TOs = 10.24 minutes per turnover
Autry: 1030 min / 112 TOs = 9.20 minutes per turnover
Sims: 1353 min / 123 TOs = 11 minutes per turnover
Hart: 1142 min / 99 TOs = 11.53 minutes per turnover
Griffin: 1247 min / 98 TOs = 12.72 minutes per turnover
McNamara: 1235 min / 85 TOs = 14.52 minutes per turnover
Flynn: 1243 min / 95 TOs = 13.08 minutes per turnover
MCW: 1408 min / 136 TOs = 10.35 minutes per turnover
Ennis: 1215 min / 58 TOs = 20.95 minutes per turnover
Mintz: 366 min / 23 TOs = 15.9 minutes per turnover

Obviously, we haven't entered into conference play yet with harder competition, but as a general observation, the only player since 1980 who takes care of the ball better than him was Ennis (with an incredible 21 minutes played per turnover).

You forgot our recent 3 year starting PG.

Girard
First season starter 1056min 60 TOs = 17.6
Career 2957min 211 TOs = 14.0

 

[Eric15]

You forgot our recent 3 year starting PG.

Girard
First season starter 1056min 60 TOs = 17.6
Career 2957min 211 TOs = 14.0

 

[Red Holzman]

Assist/TO ratio alongside the minutes per turnover average may provide a helpful perspective?
There's a tradeoff(?)
A PG with a higher assists/TO ratio could more easily be forgiven for a higher MPT ratio.
ie: nothing ventured, nothing gained

 

[Cheriehoop]

It’s also dependent on the pace of the games played. Fast paced, transition teams with more pressure defense concede more turnovers as the price for more possessions and transition baskets as the result of the unsettled situations it creates. Tyler Ennis’s high assist/to stat isn’t surprising considering the slow down, ball control offense we had.

 

[DoctahLexus]

Given Mintz' great handle and finishing ability in the lane, along with a strong lack of desire to shoot jumpers ...is Edelin a reasonable comp?

 

[Eric15]

Given Mintz' great handle and finishing ability in the lane, along with a strong lack of desire to shoot jumpers ...is Edelin a reasonable comp?

Judah is very athletic but often out of control in terms of shot selection. Billy was unathletic (for a P5 point guard, not a normal human being) and was always under control. Offensively I think the closest comparison to Judah is Jason Hart. Obviously, Judah isn't the insane on-the-ball defender that Hart was at this point.

 

[Col. Bleep]

This ^^

It is interesting but to me it doesn't tell the entire story of "taking care of the ball" not even close. Possession has to be factored in.

Possessions is an expression for pace of play.
It would seem that generally the faster you play, the more turnovers you'll have.