U.S. Attorney's Office announces additional charges in college hoops investigation

[moqui]

us attorney seems to imply that the universities are victims of fraud, not perpetrators. which could mean only that the schools used ineligible players unwittingly. that would mean vacating wins, but no sanctions

 

[rrlbees]

us attorney seems to imply that the universities are victims of fraud, not perpetrators. which could mean only that the schools used ineligible players unwittingly. that would mean vacating wins, but no sanctions

yea, that's assuming the schools knew nothing even those these guys were pushing them to specific schools. I don't buy it.

 

[Zepharus]

The cheating universities and their coaches get to hide behind plausible deniability. Freaking disgusting. I Thought I would be happy to have my thoughts on this crap for years vindicated... honestly it just feels worse because of what Cuse got dealt for essentially nothing. Screw all of these people.. for real

 

[Sherman20]

From what I’ve read so far. Kansas outbid Maryland for De Souss and USC Maryland Nc St for Preston.

This isn’t about specific colleges bidding for players. Remember, the money isn’t coming from the schools. This is about a shoe company(Adidas) steering high school kids to certain schools that it already sponsors and secretly paying the families. They want the best kids to go to their “flagship brands” like Louisville and Kansas, etc in order to secure the athletes’ loyalty after they turn pro. But until investigators prove that specific head coaches knew what was going down or got in the middle and helped facilitate the transaction, I don’t think it’s fair to assume guilt. Adidas wants to steer the best players to their top schools. They don’t really need to involve the head coaches. In the case of Dennis Smith, it’s alleged that an NC State assistant passed him money. Did Gottfried know the situation? I don’t know but it’s not fair to assume yes until there’s sworn testimony or proof that shows it. It’s been implied that Pitino and Miller knew about and signed off on payments to Bowen and Ayton. It wouldn’t surprise me, but I’ll wait for the evidence to come up in court when these cases get tried (if they ever do).

 

[shandeezy7]

This isn’t about specific colleges bidding for players. Remember, the money isn’t coming from the schools. This is about a shoe company(Adidas) steering high school kids to certain schools that it already sponsors and secretly paying the families. They want the best kids to go to their “flagship brands” like Louisville and Kansas, etc in order to secure the athletes’ loyalty after they turn pro. But until investigators prove that specific head coaches knew what was going down or got in the middle and helped facilitate the transaction, I don’t think it’s fair to assume guilt. Adidas wants to steer the best players to their top schools. They don’t really need to involve the head coaches. In the case of Dennis Smith, it’s alleged that an NC State assistant passed him money. Did Gottfried know the situation? I don’t know but it’s not fair to assume yes until there’s sworn testimony or proof that shows it. It’s been implied that Pitino and Miller knew about and signed off on payments to Bowen and Ayton. It wouldn’t surprise me, but I’ll wait for the evidence to come up in court when these cases get tried (if they ever do).

If it's an assistant then that's a coach in the program and said programs should get nailed. It's what happened to SU, with the allegations at a much smaller scale.

 

[Sherman20]

yea, that's assuming the schools knew nothing even those these guys were pushing them to specific schools. I don't buy it.

I don’t think it’s fair to assume anything. I want proof. Adidas is pushing them to certain schools because programs like Kansas and Louisville are their flagship brands. Adidas has more money invested in the success of those programs than others. In the case of Dennis Smith, it sounds like he was changing his mind and wanted to go somewhere like UNC (a Nike school), so they paid off the Mom to keep him at NC State. But all speculation until more details emerge.

 

[Sherman20]

If it's an assistant then that's a coach in the program and said programs should get nailed. It's what happened to SU, with the allegations at a much smaller scale.

Fair enough. And clearly some of these assistants (like Book Richardson) knew what was going down and coordinated these shady dealings with runners and agents and shoe reps, and the programs should be punished for those infractions when all the information comes out. I’m just saying there could be cases where a shoe company or agent or runner gives money to a player without the involvement of anyone associated with a college program.

 

[Waltdods]

us attorney seems to imply that the universities are victims of fraud, not perpetrators. which could mean only that the schools used ineligible players unwittingly. that would mean vacating wins, but no sanctions

They need to assert this to support their theory of the case, which needs a defraudee. Note though that the victim is the school, not necessarily the coach or even the athletic department.

 

[shandeezy7]

Fair enough. And clearly some of these assistants (like Book Richardson) knew what was going down and coordinated these shady dealings with runners and agents and shoe reps, and the programs should be punished for those infractions when all the information comes out. I’m just saying there could be cases where a shoe company or agent or runner gives money to a player without the involvement of anyone associated with a college program.

Yeah I agree that there are definitely cases where that happens. However, by the NCAA's own interpretation and enforcement of the rules, wouldn't that still make those players ineligible, or is there some sort of "reasonable knowledge" clause that allows for some ambiguity?

 

[NYCorange]

I haven't seen anything that says that Kansas participated in paying the players. Instead, I think the bigger thing is that Adidas paid to get De Sousa to Kansas and out of Under Armor Maryland. I'm not saying Kansas didn't participate. Probably did. Just nothing on it yet, and I'd imagine that it really is more about the shoe companies than the the schools. On the other hand, NC State took money from adidas and straight up gave it to Denis Smith. So it looks like they are it deep trouble.

 

[Tobias Funke]

New federal charges in college basketball scandal allege payments to steer players to Kansas, N.C. State

Hadn't seen this mentioned

 

[Willy75]

This isn’t about specific colleges bidding for players. Remember, the money isn’t coming from the schools. This is about a shoe company(Adidas) steering high school kids to certain schools that it already sponsors and secretly paying the families. They want the best kids to go to their “flagship brands” like Louisville and Kansas, etc in order to secure the athletes’ loyalty after they turn pro. But until investigators prove that specific head coaches knew what was going down or got in the middle and helped facilitate the transaction, I don’t think it’s fair to assume guilt. Adidas wants to steer the best players to their top schools. They don’t really need to involve the head coaches. In the case of Dennis Smith, it’s alleged that an NC State assistant passed him money. Did Gottfried know the situation? I don’t know but it’s not fair to assume yes until there’s sworn testimony or proof that shows it. It’s been implied that Pitino and Miller knew about and signed off on payments to Bowen and Ayton. It wouldn’t surprise me, but I’ll wait for the evidence to come up in court when these cases get tried (if they ever do).

But this is exactly what the NCAA nailed JB for, failure to know about and control what was going on in his program. Easy for them to nitpick then, but when the whole structure is shown to be rotten (here and UNC) they hide their heads in the sand.

 

[Madbiker]

So Self doesn't know Adidas is paying top recruits to go to Kansas? Sure thing.
You can be sure NC State will get clobbered but nothing will happen to Kansas -- a protected program.

 

[Fat tire 13]

Should have seen this one coming since "The Wizard of Oz" - who knew Adidas made those magic shoes?

 

[djorange1989]

Hey JB got whacked because even though he didn’t know what was going on “he should have known”. Well, every damn one of these coaches better be held to that standard and then some or I am burning down that weak a** NCAA office

 

[IthacaMatt]

Fair enough. And clearly some of these assistants (like Book Richardson) knew what was going down and coordinated these shady dealings with runners and agents and shoe reps, and the programs should be punished for those infractions when all the information comes out. I’m just saying there could be cases where a shoe company or agent or runner gives money to a player without the involvement of anyone associated with a college program.

Let's not pretend here. Miller is caught on tape discussing the $100,000 payment. How he ever coaches again in the NCAA is beyond me. The NCAA crucified Tarkanian for far less than this, nothing but innuendo, really.

 

[cuseinseattle]

Let's not pretend here. Miller is caught on tape discussing the $100,000 payment. How he ever coaches again in the NCAA is beyond me. The NCAA crucified Tarkanian for far less than this, nothing but innuendo, really.

Do we know that. I’ve not heard the audio.

 

[Orangefan1]

I don’t really see the point in leaking this information unless you somehow have proof the head coaches are involved somehow and can prove it. It’s obviously working for Sean Miller to deny as well as various coaches act as if they didn’t know anything

 

[alphaorange]

If nothing much comes of this, it will only make these schools more powerful when it comes to recruiting. Players will see the schools are untouchable. How in hell is Kentucky not in the high beams?

 

[themorey]

Based on how things went down with Arizona, Louisville, and Miami, in which the head coaches were alleged to have directed the payments, I find it highly unlikely that Kansas or Self were in the dark. However, in the previous cases there were recordings of the coaches directing payments to players. Lacking those recordings the University & Coach are presumed innocent and can take the role of victims. Unless the canaries named Gatto, Cole, Miller or Dawkins begin to sing...

 

[MSOrange]

Will it be the FBI — as opposed to Texas or Oklahoma — that ends Kansas’ streak of 14 straight Big 12 titles?

 

[Newhouser]

Other than this being a tax issue - I think this is further proof that are justice system is off the rails. Who are the injured parties in any of this? I have no legal understanding of anything but this just seems like something that the IRS should handle and the rest of the legal resources should move on to something where there is actual harm.

 

[maxxyz]

Other than this being a tax issue - I think this is further proof that are justice system is off the rails. Who are the injured parties in any of this? I have no legal understanding of anything but this just seems like something that the IRS should handle and the rest of the legal resources should move on to something where there is actual harm.

Absolutely. They should concentrate more on putting people caught with nickel bags in prison for a decade. White collar crime harms no one...

(Sorry - can’t do sarcasm font on my phone)

 

[ClamOtto]

If nothing much comes of this, it will only make these schools more powerful when it comes to recruiting. Players will see the schools are untouchable. How in hell is Kentucky not in the high beams?

This is all Adidas for now, right? Once they go after Nike, Kentucky has to be front and center. Though Calipari doesn't know a thing about it and will be shocked when he finds out.

 

[Newhouser]

Absolutely. They should concentrate more on putting people caught with nickel bags in prison for a decade. White collar crime harms no one...

(Sorry - can’t do sarcasm font on my phone)

Ha I hear you but doesn't change the fact that the harmed parties - at least according to the charges - are the schools. If that is the harmed party ....I got nothing.