What combo is better for our offense

[Alsacs]

Option 1- Junior Frank Howard and Senior Rick Jackson

Option 2 Sophomore Jonny Flynn and Senior Pascal Chuwku

People are debating the PG vs C as to the bigger problem.
I take option 1 all day long.
Frank isn’t a great PG but if you gave him a legit post player it would open the offense up a lot more.
The opposing big couldn’t just rove around the paint.
It would open driving lanes for the guards and forwards.
Create proper spacing etc.

If you put Flynn with this team our offense would get a lot more in transition and Flynn himself would get to the rim but the opposing bigs would be in his way and the rest of the team would just be relying on him getting them open looks.

 

[Melancer46]

What does the rest of the supporting cast look like? If we're just putting Flynn or Jackson on this year's team, I would take Flynn pretty easily.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Always the Point Guard.

 

[Alsacs]

What does the rest of the supporting cast look like? If we're just putting Flynn or Jackson on this year's team, I would take Flynn pretty easily.

Battle-SG
Hughes-SF
Brissett-PF

Dolezaj, Buddy off bench

Which combo do you want?

 

[Trueblue25]

frank and rick.

The games changed, you need to dominate the glass and bang downlow. Frank could potentially be a 36-40% 3 point shooter given options to pass to WITHIN the 3 point line. I think Rick complements him well. Even better would be senior Rak.

Johnny can take over whatever game he’s in, but I’m not sure Chukwu’s d makes up the difference if Flynn’s off.


Edit: i forgot this is including the rest of the team. I take Flynn and Chukwu because Tyus and Elijah move poorly without the ball and it’d open up space for Brissett to operate more to his strengths. Flynn’s dynamic where as Tyus is just iso.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Battle-SG
Hughes-SF
Brissett-PF

Dolezaj, Buddy off bench

Which combo do you want?

Flynn for sure.

 

[Alsacs]

Flynn for sure.

I disagree but I understand your point.
PG play is more important in the tournament. I just think during the season we do a lot better with Jackson.

Frank with an above average big makes our offense fine and D has more upside.
Flynn is the best player of the 4 no doubt.

 

[Melancer46]

Battle-SG
Hughes-SF
Brissett-PF

Dolezaj, Buddy off bench

Which combo do you want?

Yeah, I'd pretty easily take Flynn. I think his penetration abilities would have opened things up for us a lot more than simply having a post scorer would.

 

[Alsacs]

If Flynn is the answer then it tells me JB made a mistake not giving Carey more minutes.
Deal with the short term flaws to play the long.
This year’s Frank was not good enough for us not to play Carey.
It sucks now because next year’s PG position is now still a question mark because lord knows we can’t go deep.

 

[Trueblue25]

If Flynn is the answer then it tells me JB made a mistake not giving Carey more minutes.
Deal with the short term flaws to play the long.
This year’s Frank was not good enough for us not to play Carey.
It sucks now because next year’s PG position is now still a question mark because lord knows we can’t go deep.

200% agree, though i’m pretty back and forth betweeb flynn and rick.

Development and big man recruiting. Trend of a lot of threads this season.

 

[Cusefan0307]

If Flynn is the answer then it tells me JB made a mistake not giving Carey more minutes.
Deal with the short term flaws to play the long.
This year’s Frank was not good enough for us not to play Carey.
It sucks now because next year’s PG position is now still a question mark because lord knows we can’t go deep.

Nah Carey was a train wreck. I’m fine with the minutes he received. He turned it over and couldn’t shoot.

Bigs are easier to find than guards, even though we don’t help ourselves a lot there either.

Virginia and Purdue get along fine with bigs who do nothing, but Dunk. Their guard play is elite though.

 

[Ryand877]

If Flynn is the answer then it tells me JB made a mistake not giving Carey more minutes.
Deal with the short term flaws to play the long.
This year’s Frank was not good enough for us not to play Carey.
It sucks now because next year’s PG position is now still a question mark because lord knows we can’t go deep.

I agree. Boeheim's theory is always to play who he thinks gives him the best chance to win"today". Carey should have gotten more minutes to help with the long term outlook. Unless we get another PG, a lot of our success or lack thereof (yes, I did hear this elsewhere too so i'm not taking all credit for the thought) next year depends on his development.

 

[Melancer46]

If Flynn is the answer then it tells me JB made a mistake not giving Carey more minutes.
Deal with the short term flaws to play the long.
This year’s Frank was not good enough for us not to play Carey.
It sucks now because next year’s PG position is now still a question mark because lord knows we can’t go deep.

I think Carey was bad enough that it would have been near impossible to justify giving him a significant role the whole year.

Our average rotation player had an OBPM of 2.3. Howard was slighly below average at 2.1. Carey was at -4.4.

Our average rotation player had an overall BPM of 6.0. Once again, Howard was below average at a 3.0. But Carey was the only player on the team in the negatives at -1.8.

Howard may have been a pretty bad player this season, but Carey was among the worst players in the country.

I don't even think Carey should be guaranteed minutes for this upcoming season with Frank out of the picture. In my mind, he has to earn his role; I certainly hope he comes back next season looking like the HS player that he was, but he has to prove that he can play.

 

[Alsacs]

I think Carey was bad enough that it would have been near impossible to justify giving him a significant role the whole year.

Our average rotation player had an OBPM of 2.3. Howard was slighly below average at 2.1. Carey was at -4.4.

Our average rotation player had an overall BPM of 6.0. Once again, Howard was below average at a 3.0. But Carey was the only player on the team in the negatives at -1.8.

Howard may have been a pretty bad player this season, but Carey was among the worst players in the country.

I don't even think Carey should be guaranteed minutes for this upcoming season with Frank out of the picture. In my mind, he has to earn his role; I certainly hope he comes back next season looking like the HS player that he was, but he has to prove that he can play.

If Carey was that bad I am sorry we either suck at player development or finding fits for whatever system we run.
Freshman should struggle but top 100 kids recruits shouldn’t be that bad and I don’t blame the kid.
We have a major problem at the PG spot though.
Whose to say Goodine will be ready year 1 and he is a combo guard.

 

[Melancer46]

If Carey was that bad I am sorry we either suck at player development or finding fits for whatever system we run.
Freshman should struggle but top 100 kids recruits shouldn’t be that bad and I don’t blame the kid.
We have a major problem at the PG spot though.
Whose to say Goodine will be ready year 1 and he is a combo guard.

It happens. Just off the top of my head, some other guys that were rated as high or higher than Carey:

Isaiah Washington, Minnesota
Jahvon Quinerly, Villanova
David Duke, Providence

All 3 have been trainwrecks.

Kaleb Joseph was obviously another huge miss for us back when that happened.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

How do you not take Flynn? Rick was a good player but he isn’t going to carry you. He only topped 18 points twice as a SR. The team would still have 0.0 players who could dribble by anyone or create their own shot. You reallybturning down 17.5 points and 6.7 assists?

 

[Trueblue25]

Carey’s not remotely as bad as people on this forum push.

He had handle problems adjusting to the speed of the game.

He has a nice jumper, and the mechanics to finish effectively at the rim. His defense shows promise too. Any comparison to Kaleb’s a joke. Some kids take a year to settle into high level play. Regretfully he was not afforded more time to rack up experience.

 

[rrlbees]

Flynn and Jackson

 

[RF2044]

Flynn is by far the best player on that list [with Rick as the next best guy].

Paschal can be serviceable, but this offense lacked a point guard to provide the rudder.

Rick would have given us a low post threat, but Howard was limited as a point, and the offense would still have many of the same issues with Howard at the helm.

Flynn / Paschal all day.

 

[Melancer46]

Carey’s not remotely as bad as people on this forum push.

He had handle problems adjusting to the speed of the game.

He has a nice jumper, and the mechanics to finish effectively at the rim. His defense shows promise too. Any comparison to Kaleb’s a joke. Some kids take a year to settle into high level play. Regretfully he was not afforded more time to rack up experience.

I will simply say I hope you're right. Statistically, they were very similar, but you could potentially brush some of Carey's numbers off as simply being the result of a small sample size.

He just did not look right though. I don't think I need to explain how much he struggled taking care of the ball this season. His ball-handling and passing were both issues for him. His shot mechanics didn't look right this season either; he seemed to develop a tendency of shooting on his way down and it impacted his shot's arc and his results. His mechanics weren't the best in high school either, but it was noticeably worse this season.

Still plenty of time to correct those issues, but I don't think it's unfair to say that he had a terrible first season or to compare him to other highly touted guards that had terrible first seasons.

Edit: And to provide a little positivity, unlike Kaleb who never really showed significant flashes, Carey did show some. I remember in one of the last couple games he had a really nice crossover into a step-back midrange jumper that he pulled off that nobody else on our team is capable of doing. And his speed and quickness is also something that nobody else on our roster possesses. If he can simply fix the ball-handling issues he had, I think that would improve the rest of his game a lot.

 

[realorange]

Carey’s not remotely as bad as people on this forum push.

He had handle problems adjusting to the speed of the game.

He has a nice jumper, and the mechanics to finish effectively at the rim. His defense shows promise too. Any comparison to Kaleb’s a joke. Some kids take a year to settle into high level play. Regretfully he was not afforded more time to rack up experience.

The speed of the game and his high school experience telling him he should charge to the basket. He just couldn't seem to calm down a little and let the game come to him.

I think Jalen will look much better next year after realizing what he needs to do/change to be effective.
I remember Autry as a freshman charging into the paint and then trying to decide what he should do. Ended up too many times with some type of turnover--walk, lost dribble, bad pass.

He's certainly been told what he needs to do with four coaches who were guards. Now he just needs to turn down the hyper drive a little.

 

[Trueblue25]

I will simply say I hope you're right. Statistically, they were very similar, but you could potentially brush some of Carey's numbers off as simply being the result of a small sample size.

He just did not look right though. I don't think I need to explain how much he struggled taking care of the ball this season. His ball-handling and passing were both issues for him. His shot mechanics didn't look right this season either; he seemed to develop a tendency of shooting on his way down and it impacted his shot's arc and his results. His mechanics weren't the best in high school either, but it was noticeably worse this season.

Still plenty of time to correct those issues, but I don't think it's unfair to say that he had a terrible first season or to compare him to other highly touted guards that had terrible first seasons.

In either case, fortunately we have the added benefit of the Italy exhibitions preseason. Should help tremendously.

 

[Brooky03]

Our offense needs a big who can go to work in the paint to function correctly. Option 1 all day, every day.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Our offense needs a big who can go to work in the paint to function correctly. Option 1 all day, every day.

Who was that guy our last three Final Fours?

 

[Madbiker]

If Cary had a problem adjusting to the speed of the college game, as some suggest, why was his play clearly better early in the season and so bad later in the season? Seems to me this was a kid who was so desperate to do something in his 2 minutes of playing time that he was out of control and pressing to make a play.