Will Syracuse be better in 13'-14' ?

[TerryM]

http://insider.espn.go.com/blog/jeff-goodman/post?id=1151


"Jim Boeheim lost a lottery pick, the team’s top perimeter shooter and also a senior who started more games than anyone else in Syracuse history.

Yet the Orange have a chance to be more successful than last season, when the Orange wound up winning 30 games and advancing to the Elite Eight."


"One area that the Orange could be lacking is depth on the perimeter. The team is still hopeful that versatile and athletic 6-7 freshman Tyler Roberson will be cleared by the NCAA to play this season, but there’s a sense that he might just be able to practice with the team and won’t be able to suit up for games."

 

[Lawrinson14]

No. At least I don't think this years team will be better. A final four is something that is hard to replicate.

And that author is obviously a dingus.

 

[reedny]

No. At least I don't think this years team will be better. A final four is something that is hard to replicate.

And that author is obviously a dingus.

Well, we did advance to the Elite 8, lol, and then we advanced past it to the FF.

 

[Flacusian]

Jeff Good one. What an a$$hat. If I did my job in the same fashion that hack does his, my business would go belly up in no time. You can get more information about college basketball on this forum in 3 minutes than you get get in a month of Sundays on ESPN.com. And they pay those guys? If it wasn't for Bilas and a FEW others they would have no credibility whatsoever.

I don't need no stinkin' ESPN noodnik to tell me about my team. I already know that this team is going run rampant through the preconference and then chew up the ACC on it's way to the Tourney. 'nuff said, period!

 

[Trueblue25]

I think this recruiting class is still outrageously underrated.

 

[tee1222]

Jeff Good one. What an a$$hat. If I did my job in the same fashion that hack does his, my business would go belly up in no time. You can get more information about college basketball on this forum in 3 minutes than you get get in a month of Sundays on ESPN.com. And they pay those guys? If it wasn't for Bilas and a FEW others they would have no credibility whatsoever.

I don't need no stinkin' ESPN noodnik to tell me about my team. I already know that this team is going run rampant through the preconference and then chew up the ACC on it's way to the Tourney. 'nuff said, period!

Everything about this post is correct. I can't even count the members of this board that would give more details, insight, information with better accuracy than this guy. I sometimes wonder if they even read their articles before publishing.

 

[edowd26]

I think we could definitely be better. The question lies with the back court. No depth at PG.. ad a large question mark at the two. If someone steps up there. Lookout.

 

[two3zone]

I think we're capable, just too many questions marks to say it with certainty. Does Cooney play like a D1 player? Can Ennis transition from HS to the college game? Does our front court do ANYTHING? Is our defense as strong as it's been the past few years? Do we have anybody who can consistently hit a 3 point shot?

This is a tough question, I'm really excited to see how it plays out, I'm extremely excited for the 14-15 season.

 

[HOFCeluck]

Well definitely be better this year...I just don't know if that translates into another Final Four.

 

[djdan]

Well definitely be better this year...I just don't know if that translates into another Final Four.

This is well said. While we were certainly due for some good fortune, there's a case to be made that we had two better teams in the last four years than last year's Final Four team. I never thought last year's team had a prayer at the Final Four. Needless to say, I was delighted to be wrong. With Ennis' strong showing in Canada, I think we have every reason to believe that we'll be just as good, if not better than last year but the tournament is a such a crap shoot that it may be hard to replicate another Final Four run.

 

[Trueblue25]

I think we will be a more consistent offense, have an even better transition game...

However with our size I should NOT be worried about this...

But our rebounding, mainly on the defensive end is still a big concern.

I'm not sure how confident I am with us from the charity strike either. I trusted Triche the most from the free throw line last year.

 

[normaliswear]

Well definitely be better this year...I just don't know if that translates into another Final Four.

Completely agree. After the last regular season game last year we probably wouldn't have thought it possible for this team NOT to be better than last year's edition. They righted the ship at the correct time, but the season as a whole was certainly a mixed bag. I think Ennis is a better player right now than MCW was at this time last year. Triche was a good player for us, but I don't think its a strech to say both MikeG and Cooney have more pure talent, its just a matter of at least one of them putting that talent together. Southerland is certainly a loss. When he was hot he could dominate a game from deep. Hopefully Fair, Cooney, MikeG, and Ennis can collectively replace that shooting. Overall there's no reason to think the frontcourt wont improve though. Rak, DC2, Kieta, Fair, and Grant will all be a year improved. And even a worst case scenario for the freshman where none are really ready to contribute gives us 15 more long athletic fouls to give in TRob, BJ, and Buss (assuming Obokoh redshirts). The only way this team ISN'T better is if either A. the backup PG situation is SOOO bad that the 8 minutes a game Ennis is off the court just KILLS us. I'd say this is my biggest concern but I think there's a good chance MikeG or PG by committee does well enough to get us by just fine. Or B. Absolutely nobody can hit an outside shot. But with so many possibilities and really only needing one or two of them to pan out, I'd say that's unlikely.

 

[l'orange]

I think we have a good team this year but I am not expecting anything beyond a sweet sixteen. Hope I am wrong.

 

[cusetown1]

I think we will be better than last year and I think we will have better shooting. The way the zone was played in the tourney last year was incredible, I don't think that will be duplicated. Really really love the front court this year, and i think it will help Ennis with the learning curve although I think he's a stud already. It's going to be a fun team to watch, and the sky's the limit for what this team is capable of.

 

[Sgt Cuse]

It's hard to call any team that is starting Cooney at 2g, better than another SU team. That is a huge drop-off. He is the kind of guy you would expect to see out of our opponents in the first round of the NCAAT, on a Vermont or NC Ashville, a little hustler, who shoots up a couple of air balls. I was disappointed in seeing Cooney get the starter minutes up in Canada, I was hoping MG was a clearly better choice all along, but apparently that is not the case. My expectations have been lowered.

I like '13-'14's forwards significantly better, the center is definitely better - maybe significantly if we can get a post game out of DC2. The pg is probably slightly downgraded because we are rolling out a frosh, with the backup pg significantly less. And the 2g for '13-'14 is abysmal.

I expect improvement throughout the season for the '13-'14 squad, as Ennis improves and as the 2g gets straightened out - I'm still hoping someone beats Cooney out for starter minutes because I think his ceiling is low this year. But the '12-'13 squad had great results improvement in the BET and NCAAT. IMO they outperformed their talent level. The '12-'13 squad was the worst 30 win team that I think SU has ever had. I hope '13-'14 can have a similar run.

 

[RF2044]

It's hard to call any team that is starting Cooney at 2g, better than another SU team. That is a huge drop-off. He is the kind of guy you would expect to see out of our opponents in the first round of the NCAAT, on a Vermont or NC Ashville, a little hustler, who shoots up a couple of air balls. I was disappointed in seeing Cooney get the starter minutes up in Canada, I was hoping MG was a clearly better choice all along, but apparently that is not the case. My expectations have been lowered.

I like '13-'14's forwards significantly better, the center is definitely better - maybe significantly if we can get a post game out of DC2. The pg is probably slightly downgraded because we are rolling out a frosh, with the backup pg significantly less. And the 2g for '13-'14 is abysmal.

I expect improvement throughout the season for the '13-'14 squad, as Ennis improves and as the 2g gets straightened out - I'm still hoping someone beats Cooney out for starter minutes because I think his ceiling is low this year. But the '12-'13 squad had great results improvement in the BET and NCAAT. IMO they outperformed their talent level. The '12-'13 squad was the worst 30 win team that I think SU has ever had. I hope '13-'14 can have a similar run.

Nah, they absolutely did not outperform their talent. Did you see how we started the season, and how good our defense was last season? Last year's team was very talented. But like many college teams--even highly rated ones--they had some flaws that intermittently held them back. The team never quite shot the ball as well as the individual parts suggested they might. And they lacked consistent inside scoring.

During the postseason run--both the BET and NCAA tournaments--they rectified both issues. Triche came on, MCW started to shoot better, and they got some modicum of inside scoring that was predominantly lacking all year--mostly from Keita. Even though that was only like 6ppg, it was better than what we we'd gotten in the pivot all year long. And when those things clicked, we again became an incredibly tough team.

I don't think that last year's team was the "worst," I think that they were a good team that hit a late-season lull culminating with the debacle @ georgetown, and then improbably put that behind them and collectively elevated their level of play down the stretch.

 

[normaliswear]

It's hard to call any team that is starting Cooney at 2g, better than another SU team. That is a huge drop-off. He is the kind of guy you would expect to see out of our opponents in the first round of the NCAAT, on a Vermont or NC Ashville, a little hustler, who shoots up a couple of air balls. I was disappointed in seeing Cooney get the starter minutes up in Canada, I was hoping MG was a clearly better choice all along, but apparently that is not the case. My expectations have been lowered.

I like '13-'14's forwards significantly better, the center is definitely better - maybe significantly if we can get a post game out of DC2. The pg is probably slightly downgraded because we are rolling out a frosh, with the backup pg significantly less. And the 2g for '13-'14 is abysmal.

I expect improvement throughout the season for the '13-'14 squad, as Ennis improves and as the 2g gets straightened out - I'm still hoping someone beats Cooney out for starter minutes because I think his ceiling is low this year. But the '12-'13 squad had great results improvement in the BET and NCAAT. IMO they outperformed their talent level. The '12-'13 squad was the worst 30 win team that I think SU has ever had. I hope '13-'14 can have a similar run.

Way WAY to hard on Cooney. Or at the very least underestimating his talent level. The kid was a top 75 4 star player with offers all around the ACC and BE. Whether he performs up to his talent level is yet to be seen, but I'm not ready to say its out of the question based on a rough freshman year. There is a very long list of guys who were next to worthless as freshman who are very good players is subsequent seasons. To say he is the talent level of a mid-major guard is silly.

 

[Sgt Cuse]

Nah, they absolutely did not outperform their talent. Did you see how we started the season, and how good our defense was last season? Last year's team was very talented. But like many college teams--even highly rated ones--they had some flaws that intermittently held them back. The team never quite shot the ball as well as the individual parts suggested they might. And they lacked consistent inside scoring.

During the postseason run--both the BET and NCAA tournaments--they rectified both issues. Triche came on, MCW started to shoot better, and they got some modicum of inside scoring that was predominantly lacking all year--mostly from Keita. Even though that was only like 6ppg, it was better than what we we'd gotten in the pivot all year long. And when those things clicked, we again became an incredibly tough team.

I don't think that last year's team was the "worst," I think that they were a good team that hit a late-season lull culminating with the debacle @ georgetown, and then improbably put that behind them and collectively elevated their level of play down the stretch.

I didn't think the individual parts suggested they would ever be a good shooting team. I was never as sold, as many were, on Dirty, and that is shown in my believing we will be much better at forward this year. And yes, we had no post game. Poor outside shooting and a lack of inside scoring makes for serious offensive problems when forced into a half court game.

The defense was excellent. And '13-'14's defense looks like it should also be good, lots of length and the atitude now seems carried on.

My "worst" comment was in comparison to the 30 win teams, and I stand by it. Six 30 win teams of which '12-'13 is the worst.

 

[RF2044]

I didn't think the individual parts suggested they would ever be a good shooting team. I was never as sold, as many were, on Dirty, and that is shown in my believing we will be much better at forward this year. And yes, we had no post game. Poor outside shooting and a lack of inside scoring makes for serious offensive problems when forced into a half court game.

Interesting. The individual parts definitely suggested that we would shoot better collectively. Dirty was a known commodity, and true to form hit approximately 40% from three last year. Not sure what you weren't sold on. CJ hit nearly 50% from three. Triche was a 4 year starter--there isn't a poster here who foresaw him shooting a mere 28% from three point range. The big question was what MCW and Cooney could bring to the table as complimentary floor spacin shooters [answer, turns out not much]. But the individual parts suggested that this would be a better three point shooting team than what the sum of the parts actually was last season.

One more thing to consider: I loved the 2012 squad--loved them. What an unbelievable year we had. But do you think that team--for all of their impressive accomplishments--had consistently good shooting, let alone any semblance of low post scoring? No on both counts. Yet, that team put together the single best individual season in program history [even though they only made the elite 8], and they were yet they had just as serious of offensive problems in half court settings as what you describe above. Know how they compensated?

 

[IthacaMatt]

It's hard to call any team that is starting Cooney at 2g, better than another SU team. That is a huge drop-off. He is the kind of guy you would expect to see out of our opponents in the first round of the NCAAT, on a Vermont or NC Ashville, a little hustler, who shoots up a couple of air balls. I was disappointed in seeing Cooney get the starter minutes up in Canada, I was hoping MG was a clearly better choice all along, but apparently that is not the case. My expectations have been lowered.

I like '13-'14's forwards significantly better, the center is definitely better - maybe significantly if we can get a post game out of DC2. The pg is probably slightly downgraded because we are rolling out a frosh, with the backup pg significantly less. And the 2g for '13-'14 is abysmal.

I expect improvement throughout the season for the '13-'14 squad, as Ennis improves and as the 2g gets straightened out - I'm still hoping someone beats Cooney out for starter minutes because I think his ceiling is low this year. But the '12-'13 squad had great results improvement in the BET and NCAAT. IMO they outperformed their talent level. The '12-'13 squad was the worst 30 win team that I think SU has ever had. I hope '13-'14 can have a similar run.

Let's be honest. Brandon was a very good teammate, but he did not have a very good final season.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Interesting. The individual parts definitely suggested that we would shoot better collectively. Dirty was a known commodity, and true to form hit approximately 40% from three last year. Not sure what you weren't sold on. CJ hit nearly 50% from three. Triche was a 4 year starter--there isn't a poster here who foresaw him shooting a mere 28% from three point range. The big question was what MCW and Cooney could bring to the table as complimentary floor spacin shooters [answer, turns out not much]. But the individual parts suggested that this would be a better three point shooting team than what the sum of the parts actually was last season.

One more thing to consider: I loved the 2012 squad--loved them. What an unbelievable year we had. But do you think that team--for all of their impressive accomplishments--had consistently good shooting, let alone any semblance of low post scoring? No on both counts. Yet, that team put together the single best individual season in program history [even though they only made the elite 8], and they were yet they had just as serious of offensive problems in half court settings as what you describe above. Know how they compensated?

The difference in 2012 was that although the guards weren't great shooters, two of them could get to the rim at will and finish. Neither MCW or Brandon did that for us last year.

 

[Sgt Cuse]

Let's be honest. Brandon was a very good teammate, but he did not have a very good final season.

Might be true, but yet the divide between Brandon and Cooney was huge. And as of the Canadian trip no one had beaten out Cooney for the 2g position. That's a problem.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Might be true, but yet the divide between Brandon and Cooney was huge. And as of the Canadian trip no one had beaten out Cooney for the 2g position. That's a problem.

Yes, last year it was. But how much worse than 28% is Cooney likely to shoot from 3 this year? I think he can beat Brandon's mark.

 

[urban96]

Might be true, but yet the divide between Brandon and Cooney was huge. And as of the Canadian trip no one had beaten out Cooney for the 2g position. That's a problem.

Boeheim does like to start experience over talent. Not a knock on cooney, I think he has the talent but just has to settle down some. Also, I wouldnt count out Mike G after the canadian games, its gonna take him a few games to get back into it after taking a year off and joining a new team and learning a new position. Buss also looks like hes going to be a defensive monster!

 

[RF2044]

Boeheim does like to start experience over talent. Not a knock on cooney, I think he has the talent but just has to settle down some. Also, I wouldnt count out Mike G after the canadian games, its gonna take him a few games to get back into it after taking a year off and joining a new team and learning a new position. Buss also looks like hes going to be a defensive monster!

Good post. The fact of the matter is, both Cooney and Gbinije are relatively inexperienced / unproven at this stage of their developmental curves. Writing either of them off at this point is premature.

The Canadian scrimmages were a good taste of live action for BOTH of them. The question is, how will the build upon the experience leading up to the start of practice?