Worst Roster Since When?

[MamesJungro]

He was only a true freshmen? What do you want?

Obviously, I want him to be an All-ACC player, but to win games now, we need more current All-ACC players. I was pointing out that our arguably best defensive player graded out as a mid-tier linebacker, underscoring our gap in top-end talent.

The broader point of this thread is my genuine surprise that, in year three under Fran, the talent gap seems to be widening. Hopefully, I’m wrong, and there are six or seven NFL-guys players on campus who are ready to contribute, but I would love to know who everyone thinks they are

 

[Ttk.gman2]

Because that’s historically true for most teams with mostly 3 star recruits. That’s what the data shows it’s not based on my “feelings”.

So you don’t actually have any real insight—you’re just leaning on data that didn’t even apply to us last year, when more than two or three true freshmen played meaningful, impactful roles. And it’s not just us either; I can name multiple other teams where the same thing happened. On top of that, you didn’t even rebut anything I said—you just kept saying “data” without addressing the actual points.

 

[Ttk.gman2]

Obviously, I want him to be an All-ACC player, but to win games now, we need more current All-ACC players. I was pointing out that our arguably best defensive player graded out as a mid-tier linebacker, underscoring our gap in top-end talent.

The broader point of this thread is my genuine surprise that, in year three under Fran, the talent gap seems to be widening. Hopefully, I’m wrong, and there are six or seven NFL-guys players on campus who are ready to contribute, but I would love to know who everyone thinks they are

Samuels , AD, Steve , Perry , Peal, Tremble for sure we will see who else will have break out years next year.

 

[Ttk.gman2]

This is why for a team on a budget like Syracuse, the bulk of the spending should be done in the portal, NOT on high school classes. I know the portal prices are higher but you cannot be spending as much as we are on 20+ players (all the freshmen save 2 or 3) that are non-contributors every year. If we completely ditched the 20+ non contributing freshmen that's at least 5-7 very good all conference G5 players. I'd rather have those guys as starters and 1-2 star recruits warming the bench for free instead of expensive high 3 star freshmen warming the bench.

Sure we could go 6-6 or even 7-5 if things pan out, but the current strategy we are using the upside is very limited.

I know we keep saying "yeah we lost almost the entire 2024 high school class but wait for the 2025 guys." At this time next year we will be saying "yeah we lost almost the entire 2025 high school class, but wait for the great 2026 guys to develop!" It doesn't appear as though we even have enough money to retain these great recruiting classes and we're using the excuse of "well Fran didn't want them here anyway." Fran says a LOT of things for marketing purposes.

That’s still not even true we have more true freshmen and redshirt freshmen contributing than 2 or 3.

 

[Ttk.gman2]

Yes, and they're everywhere. Just look at the wall behind you and whip out your studfinder.

?

 

[SuFTW]

?

 

[PAcuse]

Angeli, Mack, Washington, Russell, Adeleye, Keyshawn Johnson, AD, Tremble, Peal, Samuels are all dudes I would say are studs. That doesn’t include guys that are gonna get better this off-season that are also going to end up breaking out this year.

Cole Weaver, Ahmad Miller, Flounoy, Fontus, Nasir Ward, both Kerr twins, Outten, Noah Meyers, D’appoloni, Joe Cruz, Kahlil Stewart, Rodgers and Wilson on the end. Amare Gough, Darien Williams, Rayshon Andrews, Nissi, Nyandoro, Hughes (if he’s healthy), Juju Johnson.
All these guys are set up to have good seasons and potential break out years. Not saying they all do. But I bet most of these guys come in and contribute in big ways this season. The coaching staff loves a lot of these guys. I expect the guys that I listed that are just coming into the program to make big impacts. And the guys already in the program that I listed, to take big steps forward. And there’s always a few guys every year that come out of nowhere and play good

You are onto solid points, pump the breaks on the Kerrs a bit...one is unproven and Davien had a huge drop off from Freshman year. They both will need to put alot together quickly.

 

[qdawgg]

So you don’t actually have any real insight—you’re just leaning on data that didn’t even apply to us last year, when more than two or three true freshmen played meaningful, impactful roles. And it’s not just us either; I can name multiple other teams where the same thing happened. On top of that, you didn’t even rebut anything I said—you just kept saying “data” without addressing the actual points.

If actual “data” doesn’t provide you enough insight than that’s on you.

 

[Ttk.gman2]

If actual “data” doesn’t provide you enough insight than that’s on you.

Watching players who were true freshman contribute on the team last year showed me? Did you watch Syracuse football last year?

 

[Cusefan69]

Not asking him to rush for 100 yards. I am asking him to run through the hole created by the OL to get 1 yard for the first down.

The hole created with 8 in the box? You make it sound like it he did that ten times a game. No matter. Not something I am looking to have a long discussion about...cheers!

 

[ImperialOrange]

Good lord, why is everyone calling me a schmuck? I was bored at work and trying to get a conversation going. Mea culpa on the ratings, it was 2025 when we finished last in the ACC. This year, as several of you noted, we’re closer to 40.

That said, my point still stands. Do we have any preseason All-ACC players? Maybe, if you really squint, Samuels or Peal. We’re a developmental program that just fired several coaches tied to player development and turned over most of the 2022–2024 classes. In the NIL era, what’s the track record of relying on largely anonymous 18- and 19-year-olds while lining up against older, better-recruited, better-paid rosters?

I don’t post much, but I’ve been on this board since the AOL days. After watching 20 years of mostly cellar-dwelling awfulness, it’s frustrating to think we finally had a glimmer of hope, only to watch the door get slammed shut by Indiana, Ole Miss, Texas Tech, and whatever other program happens to have a billionaire alum this cycle.

We were 10th in 2025, 11th last year and 6th in 2024 (thanks Kyle and Fadil!) in transfers. It's an interesting topic but you lose any traction when you start off factually inaccurate for what a 60 second Google search could net you.

We certainly need more players that are ready game 1 next season vs last. I think we have done so but no way we'll know until game 1 next season.

 

[DocFlanders]

Can’t count on freshman elevating a program significantly.

That’s what I worry about. Get good HS recruits, but without elite budgets they be gone if they flourish, and as Fran said with Watson they’d be remiss not to….CFB is so awesome now….sure

Fran was the coach we needed pre NIL

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Hughes at safety also we brought in 2 really good players with production at DT ? Also Calvin Russell in my opinion will be Wr1 that’s why we brought him to Syracuse.

If Calvin has over 750 yards as a true freshmen, it will be one of the Top 10 true freshman performances over the last 6 seasons. I don't think it is fair to expect him to put up WR1 numbers next season.


Edit
It would be 6th best IMO. Look back at true frosh kids 2021-25 and you will only see Worthy (981, 81.8 per game), Concepcion (839, 64.5 per), Williams (857, 71.4 per), Smith (1315 but played a lot of games, 82.2 per), Toney (1211 also a lot of games, 75.7 per) have big seasons.

Maybe Calvin is at that level, but to expect it is another thing entirely.

 

[Archbold44]

If Calvin has over 750 yards as a true freshmen, it will be one of the Top 10 true freshman performances over the last 6 seasons. I don't think it is fair to expect him to put up WR1 numbers next season.

Good point. I also think the ACC has good coaches and we will face opponents that have experienced DBs to take advantage of a young guy. But perhaps, even if the numbers are not there, he will generate attention in the same way that Samuels did. Not so much the stats as the impact on the game.

 

[Archbold44]

Can’t count on freshman elevating a program significantly.

That’s what I worry about. Get good HS recruits, but without elite budgets they be gone if they flourish, and as Fran said with Watson they’d be remiss not to….CFB is so awesome now….sure

Fran was the coach we needed pre NIL

I thought he was the coach we needed from a portal recruiting standpoint. The problem is the money seems to be neutralizing that.

 

[qdawgg]

Watching players who were true freshman contribute on the team last year showed me? Did you watch Syracuse football last year?

I’m usually smart enough not to argue with people who clearly don’t know anything and have weak arguments like, “did you watch SU FB”. No little buddy, I did not.

You expect a whole bunch of freshmen to contribute. We had some players contribute. The same amount I said is normal to expect. Do you do math, there’s a calculator on your phone.

 

[ImperialOrange]

If Calvin has over 750 yards as a true freshmen, it will be one of the Top 10 true freshman performances over the last 6 seasons. I don't think it is fair to expect him to put up WR1 numbers next season.


Edit
It would be 6th best IMO. Look back at true frosh kids 2021-25 and you will only see Worthy (981, 81.8 per game), Concepcion (839, 64.5 per), Williams (857, 71.4 per), Smith (1315 but played a lot of games, 82.2 per), Toney (1211 also a lot of games, 75.7 per) have big seasons.

Maybe Calvin is at that level, but to expect it is another thing entirely.

Depends which of our WRs draws opposition DB1, etc. He could be more effective than his stats show OR could have stats as result of someone else peeling coverage and putting him in 1 v 1s down feild. I think he'll be most productive in the red zone (if we can get there) unless one of the other "speedsters" consistently draw safeties off of Calvin.

Also depends if we give QBs enough time to go through reads and have routes develop.

 

[shu 49]

Angeli, Mack, Washington, Russell, Adeleye, Keyshawn Johnson, AD, Tremble, Peal, Samuels are all dudes I would say are studs. That doesn’t include guys that are gonna get better this off-season that are also going to end up breaking out this year.

Cole Weaver, Ahmad Miller, Flounoy, Fontus, Nasir Ward, both Kerr twins, Outten, Noah Meyers, D’appoloni, Joe Cruz, Kahlil Stewart, Rodgers and Wilson on the end. Amare Gough, Darien Williams, Rayshon Andrews, Nissi, Nyandoro, Hughes (if he’s healthy), Juju Johnson.
All these guys are set up to have good seasons and potential break out years. Not saying they all do. But I bet most of these guys come in and contribute in big ways this season. The coaching staff loves a lot of these guys. I expect the guys that I listed that are just coming into the program to make big impacts. And the guys already in the program that I listed, to take big steps forward. And there’s always a few guys every year that come out of nowhere and play good

I agree but look at all playoff final 4 teams and they have great dt and at least 1 great end. I like Perry and I think the Georgia state kid can help but it may take him a year to get used to teams and size guys we play. I know we won’t get too 4- 4* to 5* guys at dt and end but bathroom

How do you know the freshmen won’t contribute next year beyond just two or three players—what actually tells you that? This class is better than last year’s, and we had more than three freshmen make an impact then. JoJo White and Cooper could both play right away on the offensive line, while Alexander Haskell and Houston have clear paths to snaps on the defensive line. Calvin Russell is almost guaranteed early playing time, and Hughes legitimately has a chance to start at safety as a true freshman. Wilson and Rodgers could contribute early off the edge if they add weight, Chase is already technically sound enough to play situationally at corner, and Amare Gough is an explosive freshman out of Virginia who could absolutely make a name for himself. So let’s see if it really ends up being “only” two or three—I’ll come back to this.

I can’t explain enough how little chance freshmen oline guys have to play. Once in a blue moon u get one. They need strength of course but also technique and knowing the offense. Hitting a 300 lb guy in high school is not like hitting a 23 year old man with 6 extra years of lifting and speed work.

 

[shu 49]

I agree but look at all playoff final 4 teams and they have great dt and at least 1 great end. I like Perry and I think the Georgia state kid can help but it may take him a year to get used to teams and size guys we play. I know we won’t get too 4- 4* to 5* guys at dt and end but bathroom

I can’t explain enough how little chance freshmen oline guys have to play. Once in a blue moon u get one. They need strength of course but also technique and knowing the offense. Hitting a 300 lb guy in high school is not like hitting a 23 year old man with 6 extra years of lifting and speed work.

Ignore my prior mistake don’t know what I did wrong.