Wrap Up Thoughts (Coaching)

[CarolinaCuse]

I know your thoughts on D3 football, but the only difference between those players and our players is 2+ inches, 20-30 plus pounds and .2-.3 seconds in the 40. D3 football is still a great brand of football, and learning there is the same as anywhere.

My favorite example - when Allegheny College won the DIII National Championship in 1994, the HC was Ken O'Keefe (former Iowa OC and now, Miami Dolphins WE coach) and the OC/OL coach was Joe Philbin (now Miami HC). Oh, and the team starred Stan Drayton (former SU RB coach, now OSU Asst HC/RB coach).

 

[crzdsufan]

No apologies here. I love HCSS, BUT I also expect to see a vast improvement next year in wins and with an offense that outscores it's own defense. Anything less than 6 wins next year in my book means it is time to move on. Yes, cut the chords and start all over again. Been a season ticket holder for 34 years and have sat through some daunting seasons but this was the worst. On offense I never saw any improvements in any facet of the game, running, blocking, QB efficiency, wide receivers... I'm not big on letting coaches go but our Offensive Line Coach was terrible. I think HCSS must cut that chord ASAP and the university needs to put some money together for a experienced, well thought of offensive line coach-as well as money for some very valuable assistant coaches that we need to keep. I hated the GRob era but this season ranks as the worst ever in my book. Only one thing was admirable and that was these kids almost never quit, except in the Pitt game. ON a 3-9 team that is something to tip your hat to.

 

[chakka3421]

Well #1 on your list is out the window already in year 2. You really saying that 7-6 and 3-9 earn 2 more years? I could care less about experienced head coach. I just want a good coach.

I was referring to years 3 & 4 - assuming they get back to 6 plus wins either year. What I'm saying is under current AD, we ain't changing out the coaching staff until after year 4. SUAD does not have enough money yet (as well as Gross won't do anything either) to make any changes next year. If we get back to bowling in 2016, the Shafer gets year 5. However, 2016 schedule is similar to 2014.

This year was a punt...

 

[orangeinjersey]

Terrell Hunt leading an offense averaging 30+ points a game? GTFOH. Folks are actually counting on Broyld? Has anyone at SU been hyped up so much during their time at SU with such little results? In 3 years he STILL HASNT CAUGHT A TD. Yes i realize he has been hurt, but for a guy who is always hurt, i am not sure why so many folks are counting on him to be healthy next year.

 

[SUinNYC]

Once again, reading comprehension is lacking. Nobody in this thread is being a Shafer apologist. This is a thread dedicated to scenarios that may occur within our football program should the aforementioned happen.

Try reading top to bottom, may make more sense.

It's hard to read because my eyes are still bleeding from watching this Shafer-coached team all season.

 

[money3189]

The season's too disappointing to recap. It's all been talked about relentlessly. Some thoughts moving forward.

This entire Coaching Staff has one year to prove their worth. Some possible scenarios:
1) Team Improves record wise (2+ W's), offense remains consistent with this years' results - Significant overhaul of the offensive staff, including multiple position coaches and the OC. HCSS and Defensive staff remain largely intact and remain for a tenuous 4th season.
2) Team improves record wise (2+ W's), offense shows significant progress (24+ ppg/ 390+ypg as a minimum baseline) may be enough to buy the entire staff a 4th year, minus a possible position coach change here and there. But, it's a hard sell.
3) Team Record stays the same or gets worse - house cleaned. Doesn't matter how much the offense improves, if the record doesn't follow suit, the alarm goes off and changes are made.

I like HCSS. He needs to develop though. He's been a lifelong Coordinator that was up in the booth. He was able to fly off the handle and say what he wanted up there. As the face of the program, you cannot do that. You can be excitable, but, you've gotta be able to take a step back and compose yourself. The players feed off the head man, let your position coaches motivate.

Position coaches - Joe Adam, Fred Reed and DeAndre Smith be on notice. I doubt any of them lose their job this year. The only attrition we may see, and I think we do, is George McDonald taking a WR/Recruiting Co. job down South. Those jobs will be available for him, it's only a matter of whether or not he wants to take one. I'm not bullish on any position coaches outside of Daoust and Acosta. I did really like Lester as a QB coach, his promotion may have been premature, but, was it necessitated by McDonald's inadequacy?

Sink or Swim, and you're already in the deep end boys, no more time to learn to paddle.

Im with you on all this.

 

[Finwad32]

It's hard to read because my eyes are still bleeding from watching this Shafer-coached team all season.

I'm not going to lie, I lol'd

 

[Crusty]

Averaging 30+ will almost double this years' point production. Attainable, yes, likely, no.

And, this isn't my wish list. Just some thoughts on what will lead to coaching changes or not. An increase of 7 ppg and 70 ypg, is a significant increase IMO. That's all I was trying to say.

To be where I'd like us to be offensively, we'd better be well over 400 yds offensively per game and at least 30+ points.

This thread is molding into what we'd like to see as opposed to what the intent was.

Sorry about that. I was trying to point out that we need to be able to score 30+ points in order to have a winning season.There are 4 teams in our division that average more than 30 points and one (NCS) that averaged 29.6. In conference play the number is about 25.

If we can't achieve 30+ and 25+ in conference play it is only a matter of how many games we will lose. If the staff is to survive they don't have a choice - they need to have an offense that scores 30/25 points or we have a lousy season - again.

I am having a hard time envisioning meeting those targets. Thus, I have a hard time with coach scenarios based on performance - they all seem to end in the same place.

I don't think metrics, close losses or moral victories will cut it any more. I think it is win or die.

Two quick points. Coaches contracts always have provisions for firing and they do not include full pay if fired. First of all, in NYS any income earned would reduce whatever SU owned. If Shafer were to be fired next year with one year left and he got a DC job for 2016 paying say, $500,000, we would owe him $900,000 for the balance of his contract. Very doable.

With respect to D3 coaches, I agree there are great coaches in waiting there, but I suspect that extra .2 or .3 difference in the 40 changes a lot of things. A difference of 3/10th (about 1 1/2 feet in the 40) together with a couple of inches in height, better quickness and technique, is the difference between wide receivers being open and not. D3 is a good brand of ball but I think the difference is measured on a log scale rather than a linear one.

As I see it, Shafer is betting his future on Lester.

 

[orangeinjersey]

As I see it, Shafer is betting his future on Lester.

There is a reason they say you shouldnt be in business with friends/family

 

[Frozen]

Has anyone at SU been hyped up so much during their time at SU with such little results?

 

[Willy75]

Sorry Fin - Shaffer has 2 more years (maybe 3 years if we go at least 6-6 in year 4) regardless of number of wins next year. SUAD is currently building a war chest to do:

1. Keep building war chest if Shafer & the band keep winning
2. In year 5 (after year 4 of Shafer years) hire and experienced HC or OC at a name brand university

SUAD is in no position to hire next year - Melo Center & IPF needs to be paid off along with BE exit fees.

The long term strategy with new ACC monies has been set - it will only change if we have a change at AD this year.

If this is indeed the case (i.e. results don't matter) we have very little chance of having a viable fb program in the foreseeable future, and don't think that fans won't figure that out very quickly, if they haven't already. It does, however, solve the Carrier Dome replacement question as attendance at virtually all home games could be comfortably handled at a high school field.

 

[Crusty]

Terrell Hunt leading an offense averaging 30+ points a game? GTFOH. Folks are actually counting on Broyld? Has anyone at SU been hyped up so much during their time at SU with such little results? In 3 years he STILL HASNT CAUGHT A TD. Yes i realize he has been hurt, but for a guy who is always hurt, i am not sure why so many folks are counting on him to be healthy next year.

He did stay in a Holiday Inn last night.