After Thinking About it, Lester Has Shown Nothing

[Scooch]

it's almost like the record doesn't mean anything.

even in we kept it close, FSU was going to win on a pass. i'm almost willing to ignore that. all i need is for shafer to not look like a total nitwit and for the offense to look like a normal college offense. that isn't happening and they need to try someone else.

For some people it doesn't. There's always a reason/excuse why record doesn't matter. Then those same people lose their when national media outlets pick 3 win SU to be last in the conference.

 

[Millhouse]

For some people it doesn't. There's always a reason/excuse why record doesn't matter. Then those same people lose their when national media outlets pick 3 win SU to be last in the conference.

well to be fair, it is crazy that national media outlets don't realize how bad wake is!

if it weren't for wake, shafer would be playing out the string

 

[SUbear]

Lester is one of the few bright spots on this team. He's turned an abysmal offense into something positive. Not sure what more can be done with our personnel. And that's not a knock on them.

Lester has been an upgrade, but considering who,what we had is that really saying much?

 

[SUFan44]

well to be fair, it is crazy that national media outlets don't realize how bad wake is!

if it weren't for wake, shafer would be playing out the string

So true.

 

[Millhouse]

So true.

McDonald as OC vs P5 teams not named Wake Forest 380 yards per game
Lester as OC vs P5 teams not named Wake Forest 278 yards per game

 

[SUFan44]

McDonald as OC vs P5 teams not named Wake Forest 380 yards per game
Lester as OC vs P5 teams not named Wake Forest 278 yards per game

Might add that I think our skill position players this year are light years better than last year.

Improved versions of Ishmael, Phillips, Estime. Big losses were West & PTG - Fredericks more than makes up for loss of PTG, IMO. West is the only real big loss.

Then Dungey > Hunt. I think anyone with two eyes can see that.

Making those numbers look even worse.

 

[rrlbees]

i I am sure I am in the Mood police's top 10 wanted with you. SS is an easy guy to like but I just don't see his high water mark being better than 7-5. The coaching hasn't improved.

You don't think there's a mood police on the negative side that attacks any posters positive outlook?

 

[Millhouse]

Might add that I think our skill position players this year are light years better than last year.

Improved versions of Ishmael, Phillips, Estime. Big losses were West & PTG - Fredericks more than makes up for loss of PTG, IMO. West is the only real big loss.

Then Dungey > Hunt. I think anyone with two eyes can see that.

Making those numbers look even worse.

lester gets the back half of last year florida state one
i messed up 370 mcdonald to 281 lester (i had the louisville game wrong)

 

[SUFan44]

lester gets the back half of last year florida state one
i messed up 370 mcdonald to 281 lester (i had the louisville game wrong)

90 yards is still significant.

 

[Alsacs]

You don't think there's a mood police on the negative side that attacks any posters positive outlook?

I don't attack positive outlook. I am realist and call out spin. When praise is warranted I give it but I don't like spin to make mediocrity better than it is. I accept my position but the mood police I am talking about want to set false narratives.

 

[rrlbees]

I don't attack positive outlook. I am realist and call out spin. When praise is warranted I give it but I don't like spin to make mediocrity better than it is. I accept my position but the mood police I am talking about want to set false narratives.

It works both ways.

 

[RF2044]

I don't have a problem at all with people changing their minds. I am always willing to admit when I am wrong or have changed my mind. I only brought the post I did up because of the level of scorn I received and I thought that was funny now.

I may be annoying to some but posts are never nuts. I just found that to be funny now. I have no problem with people's positions evolving. This is a place for differences of opinions. I agree SS is likable guy and I have no ill will towards him I jut want a new HC leading SU FB.

Yup, and your post just became a convenient way to raise the point I was making, it wasn't really in response to you or directed at you.

LGO!!!

 

[OrangeViking]

This is where a message board is fruitless. 99.9% chance you won't change my opinion of HCSS and staff, and 99.9% chance anything I post won't change anyone else's opinion. So I don't post on the subject and rarely bother to read. I primarily come here for info, not opinions.

 

[DownTheField]

I'm not sure what our O ranking was but we are averaging 10 more points per game than last year.

 

[Millhouse]

I'm not sure what our O ranking was but we are averaging 10 more points per game than last year.

42 pts from returns and overtime is still a lot through 8 games.

they're 64th in scoring

without those 42, SU would be 99th in the country.

maybe that's too harsh to expect no scores at all in OT or on returns.

with 3 TD, they'd be 88th. scoring is an obvious way to judge an offense but it gets fuzzy because of other stuff having nothing to do with the offense

 

[FrancoPizza]

West is the only real big loss..

Ehhhh... that's giving way too much credit. We're replacing mediocre seniors with mediocre-to-slightly-approaching-average underclassmen.

 

[SUFan44]

Ehhhh... that's giving way too much credit. We're replacing mediocre seniors with mediocre-to-slightly-approaching-average underclassmen.

I was trying to be kind. Agree with you.

 

[blizz]

The offense has 0 TD's in the 2nd half in the last 3 games. I don't know what that means in the grand schemes of either "Fire Shafer", or "This Program is Building", but it's not good, not good at all.

To me this is the most telling. Good defenses are making effective adjustments and pretty much shutting us down after wveryone has settled in. Despite the claim of being "multiple" there seems to be little trouble of keying each particular set and situation.

 

[shandeezy7]

FWIW, I've had a similar progression, even though for some baffling reason I've been labeled "negative" by the board's mood police. I actually was fine with Shafer's hiring because I knew we were up against it given the timing of Marrone's departure. And I loved the way Shafer talked when he got the gig. I thought he did a good job in 2013 all things considered. We lost a ton offensively and to come within 1 win of Marrone's high water mark was strong. I was discouraged by last season but willing to flush it given the ridiculous amount of injuries and internal issues.

I was not a fan of not seeking an OC beyond Lester but I also acknowledged that it's Shafer's ship to captain so he should hire who he wants.

This season has been disappointing though. Not just for the W/L record, I "predicted" 5-7, but because we're not improving nearly enough, and our game planning and game day management continues to be very poor. I've realized that the current staff has a ceiling, they just do. I'm not passionately calling for Shafer to be fired, but if Coyle decides to do that I certainly understand.

At this point, I've become a Shafer agnostic. I don't have faith in him, nor do I have disbelief in him. I'm just...blah.

 

[Cusefan78]

Up till fsu I was 100% keep shafer now I'm starting to waiver a bit. That timeout really is tough to defend. Really want him to figure it out so we don't have another start over but I trust coyle. After the season whatever he says is fine with me. If this gets any worse and I'll be firmly on the pitchfork side

 

[baggerbob]

Seems to me that we were in the hole after 1st down almost every series in the second half. The offense is so much more effective when you are second and 3 than second and 9 or 10 or worse. Add to the fact that Dungey had an off day passing the ball, partly his fault and partly the receivers. As someone mentioned above we are slow running the offense (number of plays) and the plays we run are slow to develop. Yards per game has a lot to do with the low number of plays we run game to game. FSU ran a very standard D but we were not able to find a single mismatch. I know their talent level is much better, but we didn't do anything differently than we did all season. At least give Custis and Enoicy a few plays, maybe a quick slant or crossing pattern over the middle. And please use something that is designed to get 8 yards when you need 8 yards and not 6 or 7 on third down.

Wake Forest, LSU, Pitt, and FSU, Cornelius, and Avant had a stat line of zero. You might as well not play them at all. Just because you can practice well, doesn't mean you can play at this level. That puts more pressure on Eric to make plays, and it shows.

 

[Ottoble]

111th in passing yards
116th in total yards

Can you imagine what it would be with hunt?

Here's the thing you keep banging the drum but we are a slower tempo team not an up tempo offense purposefully to keep time of possesion and try to protect the thin defense here's the per play stats. Offensively we are better, defensively we are much worse lost 8 starters from a D that kept us in games we shouldn't have been in with that offense and that many injuries. Young on O thin and Young on D. Shafer needs to greatly improve game management he needs to study this, get a game management card and to hire a quality control staff member non coach that all they do on game day is track this.


Per play stats.
Yds per play
2015 5.3 #74
2014 4.8 #102

Offense Points per Play
2015 .433 #41 New OC/system
2014 .235 #122

Opp points per play
2015 .436 #87 lost 8 starters
2014 .344 #37

Fyi Offense Points per Play
Alabama 2015 .439 #38
Alabama 2014 .496 #15



Get the two pieces to line up with one more year of age, talent and development and a coach that dedicates himself to studying game management in the offseason. mix in some tempo for our Soph QB maybe some JUCO DBs... well you tell me what being mid top 30s in both O and D means, nope I will, top 25 cause most teams cant put both together and several teams above us in these stats will play a tougher schedule than us next year ours is softer that usual.

 

[Millhouse]

Here's the thing you keep banging the drum but we are a slower tempo team not an up tempo offense purposefully to keep time of possesion and try to protect the thin defense here's the per play stats. Offensively we are better, defensively we are much worse lost 8 starters from a D that kept us in games we shouldn't have been in with that offense and that many injuries. Young on O thin and Young on D. Shafer needs to greatly improve game management he needs to study this, get a game management card and to hire a quality control staff member non coach that all they do on game day is track this. Per play stats. Yds per play 2015 5.3 #74 2014 4.8 #102 Offense Points per Play 2015 .433 #41 New OC/system 2014 .235 #122 Opp points per play 2015 .436 #87 lost 8 starters 2014 .344 #37 Fyi Offense Points per Play Alabama 2015 .439 #38 Alabama 2014 .496 #15 Get the two pieces to line up with one more year of age, talent and development and a coach that dedicates himself to studying game management in the offseason. mix in some tempo for our Soph QB maybe some JUCO DBs... well you tell me what being mid top 30s in both O and D means, nope I will, top 25 cause most teams cant put both together and several teams above us in these stats will play a tougher schedule than us next year ours is softer that usual.

we have been over the points a million times. And playing slow doesn't work. And yards per play is dropping fast

 

[Ottoble]

we have been over the points a million times. And playing slow doesn't work. And yards per play is dropping fast

Actually I think points per play is the more important number. And the improvement there is impressive do you rememeber how many times we stalled in the redzone last year?

 

[TheCusian]

we have been over the points a million times. And playing slow doesn't work. And yards per play is dropping fast

To me - that's what was so discouraging vs FSU. I expected us to hold steady in YPP (we get better as the defense gets better)...

Might still be some youth on the road issues - especially vs a ranked "name" opponent. But discouraging anyways.