Carmelo passed Larry Bird last night in points

[JarHeadJim]

For 31st for most all time points in the NBA.

http://www.landofbasketball.com/all_time_leaders/points_total_career_season.htm

 

[MikeSU02]

For 31st of most all time points in the NBA.

http://www.landofbasketball.com/all_time_leaders/points_total_career_season.htm

He should end up in the top 10, which will make him a HoF lock.

Really enjoying this version of Melo. Scores a little less, but does everything else a little more. Really trusts his teammates and, I think, really kiles KP6's swagger.

 

[CusefanATL]

An ATL sports talk guy (chris dimino - rutgers grad from NJ) said this morning "I can't remember 2 meaningful NBA points in his entire career. Not 2" to which 1 of the cohosts replied "1 of the best college players though"

Hard to argue.

 

[AZOrange]

An ATL sports talk guy (chris dimino - rutgers grad from NJ) said this morning "I can't remember 2 meaningful NBA points in his entire career. Not 2" to which 1 of the cohosts replied "1 of the best college players though" Hard to argue.

let me know when they remember meaningful points from ewings career, Durants career, Paul's career. Lol

 

[Eric15]

An ATL sports talk guy (chris dimino - rutgers grad from NJ) said this morning "I can't remember 2 meaningful NBA points in his entire career. Not 2" to which 1 of the cohosts replied "1 of the best college players though"

Hard to argue.

Off the top of your head, can you remember two meaningful points from Larry Bird's career? The only legendary play coming to mind for me "...and there's a steal by Bird!"

 

[Moontan]

An ATL sports talk guy (chris dimino - rutgers grad from NJ) said this morning "I can't remember 2 meaningful NBA points in his entire career. Not 2" to which 1 of the cohosts replied "1 of the best college players though"

Hard to argue.

I was about to post something similar.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

An ATL sports talk guy (chris dimino - rutgers grad from NJ) said this morning "I can't remember 2 meaningful NBA points in his entire career. Not 2" to which 1 of the cohosts replied "1 of the best college players though"

Hard to argue.

It's actually insanely easy to argue. That's radio tough guy talk, nothing more, and it's a tired narrative that circulates because Carmelo's an easy target.

 

[UnderHisOwnPower]

It's actually insanely easy to argue. That's radio tough guy talk, nothing more, and it's a tired narrative that circulates because Carmelo's an easy target.

It's easy to come up with a few highlights, like right from the start being drafted behind Darko. All of Detroit knew that was a blunder, and they were right. He elevated the Nuggets and had some great years out there, then came home to NY where he always wanted to play, and has played hard the whole time, despite having to overcome their mismanagement. Tough guy talk, and very lazy "journalism". Why listen to that garbage?

 

[Fireball Jr.]

He should end up in the top 10, which will make him a HoF lock.

Really enjoying this version of Melo. Scores a little less, but does everything else a little more. Really trusts his teammates and, I think, really kiles KP6's swagger.

I realize he has more talent around him this year, but also seems as if a switch has gone off and he finally gets it.

 

[MikeSU02]

I realize he has more talent around him this year, but also seems as if a switch has gone off and he finally gets it.

This version, imo, also lends itself to a longer career.

He doesn't have to fight for so many FGA. He can facilitate a little more. Pick his spots. Set up teammates. His skip passes last night were awesome.

 

[realorange]

I agree with MikeSU02. I think Melo has realized he can't do it by himself anymore and is working to get a team around him. I'm sure it gets rid of a lot of physical problems and mental frustrations with the attitude he's working with.

 

[AZOrange]

I agree with MikeSU02. I think Melo has realized he can't do it by himself anymore and is working to get a team around him. I'm sure it gets rid of a lot of physical problems and mental frustrations with the attitude he's working with.

Frankly he's finally playing with good players who are not known knuckleheads

 

[OrangeDW]

let me know when they remember meaningful points from ewings career, Durants career, Paul's career. Lol

The lengths people go to and the stupid things they say to in order to crap on Melo is mindblowing to me. It's become like the "cool" thing to do for some reason...and it's disappointing when Cuse fans join in rather than put these mouthbreathers in their place. He's had a hall of fame career, is having an outstanding comeback season after last year's injury, and has his team overachieving greatly in year 13 of his career - a time when a lot of guys fall off hard, or have already fallen off by this point.

 

[CusefanATL]

It's easy to come up with a few highlights, like right from the start being drafted behind Darko. All of Detroit knew that was a blunder, and they were right. He elevated the Nuggets and had some great years out there, then came home to NY where he always wanted to play, and has played hard the whole time, despite having to overcome their mismanagement. Tough guy talk, and very lazy "journalism". Why listen to that garbage?

There is certainly a flip side to this argument. I love melo more than most but lets not act like his NBA career hasnt been somewhat of a flop to what we thought it would be based on his college year. He literally is the best college player since Laettner? And he is an after thought to anyone who follows the NBA.

If you asked anyone on this board what his NBA averages would have been they would have said 25, 10, and 5 with numerous conference finals and finals. Instead its like 25 on 20 shots, 6 or 7 boards, 3 assists. 1 conf final, and not even close to sniffing the finals.

and saying he "came home to the NY" is a little disengenuous, no? he destroyed the knicks franchise (and in turn his career) by demanding the trade instead of just going there for a few million less (in all actuallity prob a few million more with endorsements - he 'only' makes 8 per year - if the team is good) 6 weeks later.

 

[OrangeDW]

There is certainly a flip side to this argument. I love melo more than most but lets not act like his NBA career hasnt been somewhat of a flop to what we thought it would be based on his college year. He literally is the best college player since Laettner? And he is an after thought to anyone who follows the NBA.

If you asked anyone on this board what his NBA averages would have been they would have said 25, 10, and 5 with numerous conference finals and finals. Instead its like 25 on 20 shots, 6 or 7 boards, 3 assists. 1 conf final, and not even close to sniffing the finals.

and saying he "came home to the NY" is a little disengenuous, no? he destroyed the knicks franchise (and in turn his career) by demanding the trade instead of just going there for a few million less (in all actuallity prob a few million more with endorsements - he 'only' makes 8 per year - if the team is good) 6 weeks later.

Whoa...25, 10 and 5??? Number of players who have EVER averaged 25, 10, and 5? I'm honestly curious, if anyone knows. Oscar. Is that it? 25, 10 and 5?? He's a flop because he didn't do that? Afterthought? He's an all star every year and on the Olympic team every time. If you're naming the top players of the last decade, he's certainly going to be one of the top 10 names that comes up every time.

Destroyed the Knicks franchise? He led them to a 54 win season. Do you remember how bad the Knicks were in the 2000-10 decade? What were they clinging to? Carmelo made them decent and relevant for the first time in over a decade. I guess it's his fault that Amare fell apart and that Tyson Chandler(their 2 other big acquisitions) sucked in the playoffs every year too?

Honestly curious how closely you follow the NBA.

 

[CusefanATL]

Whoa...25, 10 and 5??? Number of players who have EVER averaged 25, 10, and 5? I'm honestly curious, if anyone knows. Oscar. Is that it? 25, 10 and 5?? He's a flop because he didn't do that? Afterthought? He's an all star every year and on the Olympic team every time. If you're naming the top players of the last decade, he's certainly going to be one of the top 10 names that comes up every time.

Destroyed the Knicks franchise? He led them to a 54 win season. Do you remember how bad the Knicks were in the 2000-10 decade? What were they clinging to? Carmelo made them decent and relevant for the first time in over a decade. I guess it's his fault that Amare fell apart and that Tyson Chandler(their 2 other big acquisitions) sucked in the playoffs every year too?

Honestly curious how closely you follow the NBA.

do me a favor, take your melo pride out of it.

Is he what you thought he would after Syracuse? He was a rebounding vaccuum. ANd he was an inside presence. Now what is he? He sits 25 feet out and shoots mainly jumpers and happens to grab a few rebounds. The ball just stops with him. It never did that at Cuse. He got the ball in the low post or he just went around whomever was guarding him.

And he couldnt "destroy" the knicks franchise because he is perenially a top 15ish player. But thats all he is and all he really ever was. So when I say "destroy" its not in that exact sense. Its in the sense that they didnt even need Chandler because they would have had Mozgov. And they would have had more salary flexibility, and a 1st round draft pick. He "destroyed" them by making them more average than they could have been. I totally understand getting all of the money you can. But there are limited options with that with the salary cap. Kobe could do it, because he could stay with his team. If you are switching teams, you HAVE to take the cut like Lebron and even more so Wade did (on his own team).

And FYI I've been lucky enough to have some beyond insane connections with the NBA. Ive been to hundreds of games and watched even more. I love Melo through thick and thin and support him and follow his career and watched a ton of his games on TV. I'm sorry that I thought he would have a better career than what he has had. His scoring stats are awesome. But not much else is.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

There is certainly a flip side to this argument. I love melo more than most but lets not act like his NBA career hasnt been somewhat of a flop to what we thought it would be based on his college year. He literally is the best college player since Laettner? And he is an after thought to anyone who follows the NBA.

If you asked anyone on this board what his NBA averages would have been they would have said 25, 10, and 5 with numerous conference finals and finals. Instead its like 25 on 20 shots, 6 or 7 boards, 3 assists. 1 conf final, and not even close to sniffing the finals.

and saying he "came home to the NY" is a little disengenuous, no? he destroyed the knicks franchise (and in turn his career) by demanding the trade instead of just going there for a few million less (in all actuallity prob a few million more with endorsements - he 'only' makes 8 per year - if the team is good) 6 weeks later.

Mismanagement botched the Knicks. D'Antoni put too much wear and tear on Stat's knees, they should have amestied Stoudemire once he got hurt and they had Melo in the fold, and they certainly shouldn't have reupped Billups to only later use the amnesty on him.

Melo ate lot of cap and required some talent to get him from the Nuggets, but he also allowed ownership to increase ticket prices like crazy. That's not part of the HOF case, but that part isn't at all lost on ownership.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Its in the sense that they didnt even need Chandler because they would have had Mozgov.

That's an insane statement.

 

[Knicks411]

Mismanagement botched the Knicks. D'Antoni put too much wear and tear on Stat's knees, they should have amestied Stoudemire once he got hurt and they had Melo in the fold, and they certainly shouldn't have reupped Billups to only later use the amnesty on him.

Melo ate lot of cap and required some talent to get him from the Nuggets, but he also allowed ownership to increase ticket prices like crazy. That's not part of the HOF case, but that part isn't at all lost on ownership.

The only thing I'll say against this is I think it's a little revisionist history to say they should have amnestied Stat. (The billups thing was a mess though) D'Antoni did play him too much his first year in NY; but that season he averaged 25-8 on a 56% true shooting, made second team all NBA, and was 28 years old. In hindsight, sure; but it's awfully hard to at the time say they should have just taken him off their roster.

Anyone who expected Melo to average 25-10-5; come on guys.

 

[CusefanATL]

Mismanagement botched the Knicks. D'Antoni put too much wear and tear on Stat's knees, they should have amestied Stoudemire once he got hurt and they had Melo in the fold, and they certainly shouldn't have reupped Billups to only later use the amnesty on him.

Melo ate lot of cap and required some talent to get him from the Nuggets, but he also allowed ownership to increase ticket prices like crazy. That's not part of the HOF case, but that part isn't at all lost on ownership.

I dont disagree with any of the 1st part. But if Melo just signed there 6 weeks later, it would have GREATLY improved their cap and roster.

the bold: Melo is a HOF'er in almost the same way Dominique is. I can't imagine him not getting in HOF. Heck he'll get in for his Cuse achievements alone. But Melo raising ticket prices does nothing for his career. And he in at least a few areas chose the gauranteed dollar over the better career - especially in his prime. With Melo's talent, i think that view was shortsighted.

 

[CusefanATL]

Anyone who expected Melo to average 25-10-5; come on guys.

I am really surprised that people didnt think that coming out of college. He averages 6.6 boards a game and is heavily criticized for that. so should i have said 25-8-5?

 

[OrangeDW]

do me a favor, take your melo pride out of it.

Is he what you thought he would after Syracuse? He was a rebounding vaccuum. ANd he was an inside presence. Now what is he? He sits 25 feet out and shoots mainly jumpers and happens to grab a few rebounds. The ball just stops with him. It never did that at Cuse. He got the ball in the low post or he just went around whomever was guarding him.

And he couldnt "destroy" the knicks franchise because he is perenially a top 15ish player. But thats all he is and all he really ever was. So when I say "destroy" its not in that exact sense. Its in the sense that they didnt even need Chandler because they would have had Mozgov. And they would have had more salary flexibility, and a 1st round draft pick. He "destroyed" them by making them more average than they could have been. I totally understand getting all of the money you can. But there are limited options with that with the salary cap. Kobe could do it, because he could stay with his team. If you are switching teams, you HAVE to take the cut like Lebron and even more so Wade did (on his own team).

And FYI I've been lucky enough to have some beyond insane connections with the NBA. Ive been to hundreds of games and watched even more. I love Melo through thick and thin and support him and follow his career and watched a ton of his games on TV. I'm sorry that I thought he would have a better career than what he has had. His scoring stats are awesome. But not much else is.

The ball stops? You're posting like you haven't watched a Knicks game all season when you say things like that, that's why I asked. He's currently 2nd among SF's in rebounds, and 3rd among SF's in assists. But yeah, the "ball stops" and he only "grabs a few boards". He's producing the same as Kevin Durant and Paul George in those categories. But those guys are "cool" to hype up as all around players. Expecting a small forward to grab 10 boards per game in the NBA because he did in college though? NBA Small forwards don't average 10 rebounds per game. I can't even think of the last one who did.

Top 15ish player? Maybe now, but nah...he was pretty clearly top 10 and closer to 5 for most of his Knicks years. He was 3rd in MVP voting a few years ago. Only playing the same position as Kevin Durant and Lebron James(they may go down as the 2 greatest SF's ever when it's all said and done) kept him off first team All NBA.

Mozgov...who cares? He's a decent role player at best. Tyson Chandler(sucking in the playoffs and all) was way better than Mozgov. Amare's injuries "destroyed" them by making them more average than they could've been. Remember when Melo went there, it was to team up with Amare who was still a superstar. Amare's body started falling apart weeks after Melo got there.

 

[CusefanATL]

That's an insane statement.

Mozgov is younger and significantly cheaper. 10 and 10 and 1.5 blocks from chandler for 13 million vs Mozgov 9, 7 and 1.2 blocks for 3.5 million is not insane by any stretch.

 

[OrangeDW]

I am really surprised that people didnt think that coming out of college. He averages 6.6 boards a game and is heavily criticized for that. so should i have said 25-8-5?

He's usually near the league leaders for rebounding at his position. His rebounding is fine. Lots of 10 reb. per game guys in college become 6-7 reb. per game guys in the pros.

25, 7, and 3 is really, really good, but yeah offering up numbers that like 1 guy in the history of basketball has gotten was kind've out there.

 

[OrangeDW]

Mozgov is younger and significantly cheaper. 10 and 10 and 1.5 blocks from chandler for 13 million vs Mozgov 9, 7 and 1.2 blocks for 3.5 million is not insane by any stretch.

Mozgov's are a dime a dozen in the NBA.