Holy Moly, Cassullo just went off on Marrone

[RMH44]

This is true, but if we are talking about how they treat people they work with, Bobby should be careful about throwing stones.

Understood, but I heard that one of BC's complaints stemmed from how DM treated some of the staff. It would be very interesting to hear what the other staff members thought at the time. Especially, if part of the reason BC was let go was because he was defending his colleagues.

 

[rrlbees]

Someone should ask Rob Long where he stands in the Casullo/Marrone debate

I discussed that in another thread.

 

[RoofBeam]

I wasn't a huge fan of how Bob ripped some of the players on the sidelines but Rob Long did have a very difficult time kicking well at key times during games and like it or not this was Casullo's motivational style.

 

[timkay99]

I think he was a competent coach, certainly not without any redeeming features, and I don't equate ambition and self-absorption with evil. My only point is that I think SU could have done better with the hire...actually, much better. And while I understand that some people bristle at this suggestion, I think that is because they lack the imagination required to see how a transformative personality might have galvanized the University (which is what Marrone started out to want to do but which required a very different set of interpersonal abilities than Marrone possesses).

Considering Marrone was like the 4th choice and fallback after previous candidates turned down the job, I think you greatly underestimate how poor this job was considered nationally when Marrone took it.

 

[billsin01]

You mean the guy who took us back to bowls, rebuilt the foundation of the program and actually had Buffalo playing meaningful football in December?

Thin skinned, but Doug has more character in his pinky than Gross, the Bills FO (who are desperately trying to save their jobs), the hacks at the Buffalo News like Jerry Sullivan and Bucky and the other sources who are lurking in the dark under "anonymous sources." Not going to touch our own village idiot, Bob Casullo.

I don't know. I've got a few problems with this post, so I'll enumerate them:

1) Can we stop talking about character? Huge pet peeve of mine. At the end of the day most people probably fall somewhere between good and bad character but it's hard to really know and even harder to judge. And, while DM may in fact have exemplary character, at some point you have to own your actions as well and he hasn't done that particularly well.

2) It is really strange to hear how much criticism seems to eat at him. I mean, if it is such a big deal that sports radio goofballs are giving him the business, why not give up the NFL altogether and coach somewhere close to home and out of the spotlight -- Hofstra or some place like that. Seriously, I'm not knocking him but how the hell is he going to handle the Jets job if he gets irked by a few yokels in Buffalo?

3) Pointing to his record is, eh, fair, I guess, but it's not like you're pointing to anything he actually 'finished'. Right? I mean, he left SU but it wasn't like he left us poised to go out and start winning 10+ every year. It's certainly possible that we would be far more successful each of the past two years with DM but he took us from abysmal to respectable. It's a lot harder to take that next step to legit ACC title/BCS game contender. And while Buffalo had a great year relative to it's past decade, they probably don't beat the pats had the pats cared in the least about that game, which essentially means you're pounding your chest over an 8-7 record (Pats win not included) in a league that features a TON of parity.

I don't know, I'm not a huge fan of the trend of media hatchet jobs when someone leaves town, but I also think DM has to look in the mirror at some point on this stuff.

 

[billsin01]

Considering Marrone was like the 4th choice and fallback after previous candidates turned down the job, I think you greatly underestimate how poor this job was considered nationally when Marrone took it.

I'd argue that the middle is where this discussion is likely the most true. SU was an atrocious job and I doubt many would have wanted it. Likewise, DM did a really nice job completely turning the job around. So as far as the hire -- I'd say it's tough to argue that DM wasn't about as good as they could have done at the time. The intriguing question is was DM a guy who was going to make them a player in the ACC? Could he have put together a program that was in the top tier of that conference year=in and year-out. Obviously we'll never know but I'm not quite as sold on that.

 

[timkay99]

I'd argue that the middle is where this discussion is likely the most true. SU was an atrocious job and I doubt many would have wanted it. Likewise, DM did a really nice job completely turning the job around. So as far as the hire -- I'd say it's tough to argue that DM wasn't about as good as they could have done at the time. The intriguing question is was DM a guy who was going to make them a player in the ACC? Could he have put together a program that was in the top tier of that conference year=in and year-out. Obviously we'll never know but I'm not quite as sold on that.

Remember, Syracuse joined the ACC in 2013. While there were always murmurs, Syracuse never got the benefit of hiring with the ACC weight behind them in 2009.

Think its unfair to determine if Marrone could make Cuse a top tier team in the ACC given the expectations of the job were to get the team to the top of the Big East eventually.

I don't believe there is a head coach that Syracuse could have hired in 2009 that would be someone who could guide them to the top of the ACC. I do think Marrone could have done it eventually.

 

[billsin01]

Remember, Syracuse joined the ACC in 2013. While there were always murmurs, Syracuse never got the benefit of hiring with the ACC weight behind them in 2009.

Think its unfair to determine if Marrone could make Cuse a top tier team in the ACC given the expectations of the job were to get the team to the top of the Big East eventually.

I don't believe there is a head coach that Syracuse could have hired in 2009 that would be someone who could guide them to the top of the ACC. I do think Marrone could have done it eventually.

I don't disagree -- I was saying that I think it's tough to argue there was a better hire out there, at least who would have taken the job. I was more just thinking out loud about whether or not DM would have eventually built a a program that would annually reside in the top 4 of the ACC or whatever. Interesting to ponder.

 

[Cuseregular]

It is odd that a coach would publicly rip another, but the impression I get of Casullo is that he's that mouthy relative that really doesn't know when to shut up and will tell you 100 reasons why he was fired, and none are his fault.

Does that make what he said untrue? No.

But it carries a lot less weight coming from him. But as was posted above, if a lot of people are calling someone a dick, it's probably got some truth to it.

no the mouthy relative justs spouts off and never shuts up, whether it be about how much they know and you don't know about politics, the weather or Aunt Millies pot roast.

He's held on to this for years and as you note may very well be true (it is).

 

[Cuseregular]

Have you ever heard a coach, even a retired one, say anything close to this about another coach? I think you are completely underestimating the import of this. Casullo has worked for a lot of coaches and is very well respected in the fraternity.

I'm putting this post to you since it's apparrent you have more than half a clue (you have a full clue actually ), and to dispell the notions that some of the less than well informed.

To your point have we ever heard of a coach coming out in this way? Don't think we ever have. He could have come out years ago with this but chose to stay silent. Now that the reality is out there in the public sphere from SO many people from many of his stops along the way I don't blame Bob for confirming what others are now saying.

Bob is not just a good guy, but is great guy. He could have gotten back into coaching but has had a good career and decided to not get back into the mix though he could've of it he decided to, very easily I might add. You are right that in the coaching and football fraternity (of which I've been a part of my whole life) he was and is well regarded and well respected.

He CHOSE not to get back into it as he is more interested in helping out his son and family at this point in his life and it's no coincidence that his son is also very well regarded and successful. He's a good father, a good family man, a good brother, a good son and a good friend (the latter I would know something about), one who cares greatly about other people.

A man of great character he is also a man who isn't perfect. He has flaws. And if anything the only thing he can be accused of is being perhaps too old school in his predominant approach on coaching in the modern era. I and he and others of the over 50 set were coached with more negative motivational methods with a lot of yelling.

The coddled home schooled kids of today who are brought up in the child centered households of the modern era as opposed to parent centered households of a different era, they don't like or respond as well to the old ways, and rather need to be affirmed while trying to motivate them. This is where he errored but is also part of the was reason Marrone wanted him so bad. Clearly according to reports, I don't know as I never saw it, but with Long he went too old school on him or so I hear yelling too much. He's had this approach his whole career with ultimate hope that it would help the player and the team succeed, both in the game of football and in the game of life. This can be argued.

But what cannot be argued and I can tell you with first hand knowledge is that unlike a lot of other coaches and what's been written here he's NOT egotistical, NOT self centered, NOT a greedy narcissist and NOT out of control. All quite the opposite. Talk to anyone one of us who really know him and have spent time with him vs. the same with Marrone and see how things end up.

If Bobs words confirming what many have apparently experienced and already knew and are now saying, if they contribute to DM not getting a job it will be an instructive example of how the bad treatment of so many others will result in some bad karma that will sooner or later come back to bite you in the butt.

It's really not that hard to be decent. Decent to past players (it's well documented here and elsewhere he was not), decent to past professional staff (one of who I know personally who after 25 years of service to SU he took off the sideline during games and ended his time with SU), decent to current players too (remember his rule that injured players can't be on the sideline during games and were exhiled to the stands), and on and on as Bees and others note.

Bob aint perfect but I'm here tell you that on the scale of yeay or nay as to how one judges a person, Bobs a great person who doesn't deserve some of the things people are writing here vs. say some of the things now coming out now about another person confirming what Bob already knew.

 

[Toga]

I wasn't a huge fan of how Bob ripped some of the players on the sidelines but Rob Long did have a very difficult time kicking well at key times during games and like it or not this was Casullo's motivational style.

Of all positions, I would think punter and FG kicker are the two where the in your face stuff would be least effective or possibly counterproductive.

 

[Toga]

I'm putting this post to you since it's apparrent you have more than half a clue (you have a full clue actually ), and to dispell the notions that some of the less than well informed.

To your point have we ever heard of a coach coming out in this way? Don't think we ever have. He couldn't have come out years ago with this but chose to stay silent. Now that the reality is out there in the public sphere from SO many people from many of his stops along the way I don't blame Bob for confirming what others are now saying.

Bob is not just a good guy, but is great guy. He could have gotten back into coaching but has had a good career and decided to not get back into the mix though he could've of it he decided to, very easily I might add. You are right that in the coaching and football fraternity (of which I've been a part of my whole life) he was and is well regarded and well respected.

He CHOSE not to get back into it as he is more interested in helping out his son and family at this point in his life and it's no coincidence that his son is also very well regarded and successful. He's a good father, a good family man, a good brother and a good friend (the latter I would know something about).

A man of great character he is also a man who isn't perfect. He has flaws. And if anything the only thing he can be accused of is being perhaps too old school in his predominant approach on coaching in the modern era. I and he and others of the over 50 set were coached with more negative motivational methods with a lot of yelling.

The coddled home schooled kids of today who are brought up in the child centered households of the modern era as opposed to parent centered households of a different era, they don't like or respond as well to the old ways. This is where he errored but is also part of the was reason Marrone wanted him so bad. Clearly according to reports, I don't know as I never saw it, but with Long he went too old school on him or so I hear yelling too much. He's had this approach his whole career with ultimate hope that it would help the player and the team succeed. This can be argued.

But wha can't be argued and I can tell you with first hand knowledge that unlike other coaches and what's written here he's NOT egotistical, NOT self centered, NOT a greedy narcissist and NOT out of control. All quite the opposite. Talk to anyone one of us who really know him and have spent time with him vs. the same with Marrone and see how things end up.

If Bobs words confirming what many already knew and are saying now, if they contribute to DM not getting a job it will a instructive example of how bad treatment of so many others will result in some bad karma that will sooner or later come back to bit you in the butt.

It's really not that hard to be decent. Decent to past players, decent to past professional staff (one of who I know personally who after 25 years he took him off the sideline during games and ended his time with SU), current players too (remember his rule that injured players can't be on the sideline during games and were exhiled to the stands), and an on as Bees and others note.

Bob aint perfect but I'm here tell you that on the scale of yeay or nay as how one judges a person, Bobs a great person who doesn't deserve some of the things people are writing here vs. say some of the things now coming out now about another person confirming what Bob already knew.

It's really not that hard to be decent. Truer words never spoken.

 

[billsin01]

I'm putting this post to you since it's apparrent you have more than half a clue (you have a full clue actually ), and to dispell the notions that some of the less than well informed.

To your point have we ever heard of a coach coming out in this way? Don't think we ever have. He couldn't have come out years ago with this but chose to stay silent. Now that the reality is out there in the public sphere from SO many people from many of his stops along the way I don't blame Bob for confirming what others are now saying.

Bob is not just a good guy, but is great guy. He could have gotten back into coaching but has had a good career and decided to not get back into the mix though he could've of it he decided to, very easily I might add. You are right that in the coaching and football fraternity (of which I've been a part of my whole life) he was and is well regarded and well respected.

He CHOSE not to get back into it as he is more interested in helping out his son and family at this point in his life and it's no coincidence that his son is also very well regarded and successful. He's a good father, a good family man, a good brother, a good son and a good friend (the latter I would know something about), ne who cares greatly about othe people,

A man of great character he is also a man who isn't perfect. He has flaws. And if anything the only thing he can be accused of is being perhaps too old school in his predominant approach on coaching in the modern era. I and he and others of the over 50 set were coached with more negative motivational methods with a lot of yelling.

The coddled home schooled kids of today who are brought up in the child centered households of the modern era as opposed to parent centered households of a different era, they don't like or respond as well to the old ways. This is where he errored but is also part of the was reason Marrone wanted him so bad. Clearly according to reports, I don't know as I never saw it, but with Long he went too old school on him or so I hear yelling too much. He's had this approach his whole career with ultimate hope that it would help the player and the team succeed, both in the game of football and in the game of life. This can be argued.

But what cannot be argued and I can tell you with first hand knowledge that unlike other coaches and what's written here he's NOT egotistical, NOT self centered, NOT a greedy narcissist and NOT out of control. All quite the opposite. Talk to anyone one of us who really know him and have spent time with him vs. the same with Marrone and see how things end up.

If Bobs words confirming what many have apparently experienced and already knew and are now saying, if they contribute to DM not getting a job it will a instructive example of how bad treatment of so many others will result in some bad karma that will sooner or later come back to bite you in the butt.

It's really not that hard to be decent. Decent to past players (it's well documented her and elsewhere he was not), decent to past professional staff (one of who I know personally who after 25 years of service to SU he took off the sideline during games and ended his time with SU), current players too (remember his rule that injured players can't be on the sideline during games and were exhiled to the stands), and on and on as Bees and others note.

Bob aint perfect but I'm here tell you that on the scale of yeay or nay as to how one judges a person, Bobs a great person who doesn't deserve some of the things people are writing here vs. say some of the things now coming out now about another person confirming what Bob already knew.

I'm one of those who hammers Casullo any chance I get but I will say this -- I have no idea what kind of person he is. To be fair, I don't care b/c I don't expect much out of my sports figures and don't generally consider that I'd find too many of them to be 'great guys'. I'm not painting with a broad brush -- merely stating that I don't really expect it and frankly don't care that much one way or the other.

What I will say is that if you consider Casullo's conduct on the sidelines coupled with the abject disaster that were his special teams, it's hard to have a great feeling about the guy. I mean, I'm in my mid-30s so I don't think I'm a coddled home-schooler but I'd take his first two rants seriously and then tune him out. The idea that his complete lack of control is motivation is ridiculous, IMO.

But whatever, at the end of the day I think this whole judging people's character business is absurd. Win games and try not to be a complete . The second part shouldn't be that hard.

 

[PhatOrange]

I

I would consider myself a relatively ambitious person building a career. I'm a 43 year old partner in a law firm who put myself through college and law school. Each job I've had, I've looked to do the best job I could. Only when I mastered the tasks and goals of that job did I start looking for a new challenge. I did not already have a plan in place for my next job when I took a job. That sounds like Hollywood bullspit to me for larger than life characters.

I don't think its crap. Lots of people climbing the ladder have the next job in mind. That's what climbing the ladder is.

 

[Forza Azzurri]

Have you ever heard a coach, even a retired one, say anything close to this about another coach? I think you are completely underestimating the import of this. Casullo has worked for a lot of coaches and is very well respected in the fraternity.

I have to think that Casullo has decided to call it a day because what he just did is career suicide.

 

[cuseguy]

I have to think that Casullo has decided to call it a day because what he just did is career suicide.

Was he planning to get back in coaching?

 

[OburgOrange]

Was he planning to get back in coaching?

Read Cuseregular's post above, #60

 

[Statesman1]

All this talk of what a swell guy Casullo is and what an abrasive jerk St. Doug was/is brings me back to a time one of our starting mlb's Dad's talked my ear off about his boy at a home game during the GROB era. He told me all about what a great kid his son was and what a great group of nice young men GRob had assembled. Real nice boys, hard workers, and good students. GRob was a swell guy, too! The kind of guys you'd like your daughter to marry. Fantastic! This man was a complete gentleman and it was a genuine pleasure to chat with this proud father. One problem- his son should never have been a starter for us as play after play he consistently gave up the edge to the opposing rb's in yet another GROB rout. Pass defense was even worse as he just didn't have the tools to keep up. This was a dark time in our program as you all know. If I'm looking for qualities in a future son in law- this kid sounded like he fit the bill. However, if I'm building a competitive football program I'm going in a different direction. Same thing for coaches- as much as I'd like to have a coach who is a swell guy I'd sooner have a competent one. If the worse thing Marrone did was rub people the wrong way and not get along with the media, I couldn't be more fine with that - as long as he's putting a beat down on the Mountaineers. And if I'm a Bills fan (thank God I'm not), I'm not too worried about text messages or internal power struggles- I'm happy my team played meaningful games into December. But then again I'm not a booster looking to get his ego stroked, a former player looking for access, or a member of the media looking for a quote, so my only dog in the hunt is the quality of the product on the field. Both Syracuse and Bills fans had similar problems in that regard until St. Doug arrived on the scene, and for that he gets a tip of the cap.

 

[rrlbees]

All this talk of what a swell guy Casullo is and what an abrasive jerk St. Doug was/is brings me back to a time one of our starting mlb's Dad's talked my ear off about his boy at a home game during the GROB era. He told me all about what a great kid his son was and what a great group of nice young men GRob had assembled. Real nice boys, hard workers, and good students. GRob was a swell guy, too! The kind of guys you'd like your daughter to marry. Fantastic! This man was a complete gentleman and it was a genuine pleasure to chat with this proud father. One problem- his son should never have been a starter for us as play after play he consistently gave up the edge to the opposing rb's in yet another GROB rout. Pass defense was even worse as he just didn't have the tools to keep up. This was a dark time in our program as you all know. If I'm looking for qualities in a future son in law- this kid sounded like he fit the bill. However, if I'm building a competitive football program I'm going in a different direction. Same thing for coaches- as much as I'd like to have a coach who is a swell guy I'd sooner have a competent one. If the worse thing Marrone did was rub people the wrong way and not get along with the media, I couldn't be more fine with that - as long as he's putting a beat down on the Mountaineers. And if I'm a Bills fan (thank God I'm not), I'm not too worried about text messages or internal power struggles- I'm happy my team played meaningful games into December. But then again I'm not a booster looking to get his ego stroked, a former player looking for access, or a member of the media looking for a quote, so my only dog in the hunt is the quality of the product on the field. Both Syracuse and Bills fans had similar problems in that regard until St. Doug arrived on the scene, and for that he gets a tip of the cap.

You don't have to be a saint. But you don't need to be a dick either. There is a happy medium. Too many people from too many different perspectives have said dick.

 

[Toga]

You don't have to be a saint. But you don't need to be a dick either. There is a happy medium. Too many people from too many different perspectives have said dick.

Well here's the happy medium - Saint Dick

 

[Scooch]

All this talk of what a swell guy Casullo is and what an abrasive jerk St. Doug was/is brings me back to a time one of our starting mlb's Dad's talked my ear off about his boy at a home game during the GROB era. He told me all about what a great kid his son was and what a great group of nice young men GRob had assembled. Real nice boys, hard workers, and good students. GRob was a swell guy, too! The kind of guys you'd like your daughter to marry. Fantastic! This man was a complete gentleman and it was a genuine pleasure to chat with this proud father. One problem- his son should never have been a starter for us as play after play he consistently gave up the edge to the opposing rb's in yet anothe
r GROB rout. Pass defense was even worse as he just didn't have the tools to keep up. This was a dark time in our program as you all know. If I'm looking for qualities in a future son in law- this kid sounded like he fit the bill. However, if I'm building a competitive football program I'm going in a different direction. Same thing for coaches- as much as I'd like to have a coach who is a swell guy I'd sooner have a competent one. If the worse thing Marrone did was rub people the wrong way and not get along with the media, I couldn't be more fine with that - as long as he's putting a beat down on the Mountaineers. And if I'm a Bills fan (thank God I'm not), I'm not too worried about text messages or internal power struggles- I'm happy my team played meaningful games into December. But then again I'm not a booster looking to get his ego stroked, a former player looking for access, or a member of the media looking for a quote, so my only dog in the hunt is the quality of the product on the field. Both Syracuse and Bills fans had similar problems in that regard until St. Doug arrived on the scene, and for that he gets a tip of the cap.

If you're going to go Full Jerk then you need to win a LOT. Like Bobby Knight.

Being a jerk and going to minor bowls is the worst of both worlds.

 

[Chip]

If you're going to go Full Jerk then you need to win a LOT. Like Bobby Knight.

Being a jerk and going to minor bowls is the worst of both worlds.

Other than the actual winning, the other thing that guys like Bobby Knight, Bill Parcells, even Belichick (in his own quiet way) have going for them, is that they are entertaining. They all have a good sense of humor. Just like JB. Yes, that sense of humor is often at the expense of the media person asking them what they consider the dumb question, but they make it interesting. I actually think Belichick is busting a kidney on the inside with his one word answers, but keeps the stone face as well as anyone.

Marrone is humorless. So it just doesn't work. Whether people think that's fair or not is irrelevant. Just makes him perceived as even more of a dik.

 

[Scooch]

Other than the actual winning, the other thing that guys like Bobby Knight, Bill Parcells, even Belichick (in his own quiet way) have going for them, is that they are entertaining. They all have a good sense of humor. Just like JB. Yes, that sense of humor is often at the expense of the media person asking them what they consider the dumb question, but they make it interesting. I actually think Belichick is busting a kidney on the inside with his one word answers, but keeps the stone face as well as anyone. Marrone is humorless. So it just doesn't work. Whether people think that's fair or not is irrelevant. Just makes him perceived as even more of a dik.

Yep, Belichick is a world class troll. Every response he gives is carefully crafted.

We're on to Cincinnati.

 

[WalnutPark]

Other than the actual winning, the other thing that guys like Bobby Knight, Bill Parcells, even Belichick (in his own quiet way) have going for them, is that they are entertaining. They all have a good sense of humor. Just like JB. Yes, that sense of humor is often at the expense of the media person asking them what they consider the dumb question, but they make it interesting. I actually think Belichick is busting a kidney on the inside with his one word answers, but keeps the stone face as well as anyone.

Marrone is humorless. So it just doesn't work. Whether people think that's fair or not is irrelevant. Just makes him perceived as even more of a dik.

Also all three of those you cited are incredibility smart, from a tactical standpoint but also from a motivational standpoint.

 

[orangeinjersey]

My mom always told me, if you dont have anything nice to say, dont say anything at all. I can assure you, Mr Casullo will probably not be seeing the coaching sidelines of anything other than a local pop warner team in his future.

In any profession, you simply dont burn (in this case, drop a thermo nuclear bomb) a bridge. What happens if Dougie in retirement moves to where Casullo lives and runs the local pop warner? Now Cassullo is out of a job.

You simply dont do this. You want to bitch about a guy, go bith to your buddies / co workers over a few drinks at a bar. You dont do it on a radio show.

Doug did a good job at SU, and did a good job at Buffalo, he'll get another job. And I am not sure that having ambition and thinking about your next move is a bad trait. I just started a new job in September, and already have an exit strategy in place, just in case. The days of slaving for a single company are over, Loyalty is over. You make your nut and you move on, thats the name of the game these days. Cassullo sounds like an out of touch old timer.