Jordan Tucker Derail Thread

[dasher]

So final fours matter, but not titles? That's a fascinating take.

try to stick what the conversation was all about. Arizona hasn't advanced to the final four in ages. They are a elite program but that is a black mark on them. I said it was about advancing. You then jumped in (for some reason that will never be understand) trying to be cute. And sadly, Uconn's 4 titles are a greater accomplishment than we have ever accomplished. In the case of Uconn vs syracuse, other factors do come in to play. We have smoked them in our history head to head. We have more final fours. We had a much better all time league record than they did. So it is certainly more complex than just the titles. But the titles are what you play for. Syracuse vs Arizona, which this wasn't about either, is more difficult to compare.

 

[dasher]

I'm just arguing that the F4s don't truly matter to recruits. I think there is enough evidence to support this now re: Arizona, Kansas, Miami currently. I just think it gets overvalued as a recruiting pitch in today's game. Nice for the statistic nerds, historians, and for fans obviously to compare and debate program hierarchy over. Just my $.02.

I didn't say they did.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Great. maybe next time you can post something that makes sense and is relevant to the conversation. I remain hopeful. Good luck.

Luckily we are in the derail thread

I don't need to make relevant posts!

 

[dasher]

Luckily we are in the derail thread

I don't need to make relevant posts!

That doesn't mean you can't try.

 

[HOFCeluck]

try to stick what the conversation was all about. Arizona hasn't advanced to the final four in ages. They are a elite program but that is a black mark on them. I said it was about advancing. You then jumped in (for some reason that will never be understand) trying to be cute. And sadly, Uconn's 4 titles are a greater accomplishment than we have ever accomplished. In the case of Uconn vs syracuse, other factors do come in to play. We have smoked them in our history head to head. We have more final fours. We had a much better all time league record than they did. So it is certainly more complex than just the titles. But the titles are what you play for. Syracuse vs Arizona, which this wasn't about either, is more difficult to compare.

Sorry dash. I didn't realize I breached protocol in the Tucker derail thread.

 

[dasher]

Sorry dash. I didn't realize I breached protocol in the Tucker derail thread.

Don't let it happen again.

 

[Zelda Zonk]

Yea I don't know why people keep bringing up the fact we added White, Thompson and Gillon late to last year's team as evidence that we're fine. We made the NIT and if we didn't add them probably would've missed the CBI.

We lost at home to SJU by 30, lost on a neutral floor to an awful UConn team, lost at home to a bad Georgetown team, got run out of the gym at BC before we "turned the corner" and developed into a team that was difficult to beat in the dome but still struggled to beat anyone away from it. We beat two teams (neither tournament teams) away from the Dome all year and it took a buzzer beater and Gillon going 9-10 from 3.

Why would I be excited about that being one of the better outcomes if we have some unexpected dominoes fall our way?

Well, you're responding to a response about my post, and nowhere in it is the suggestion that we would be or were "fine" with grad transfers. My example of white, though — seems a pretty simple assumption that tucker in 17-18 will not produce as much as White just did for us. So, getting tucker isn't evidence that we're fine either.

I also said that I hoped we got tucker, with the implication that a grad transfer is absolutely a Plan B or fallback. No, duh, it's not a good 'strategy.' But swap in a 4-star freshman for AW3 last season and we lose to StJ, Uconn, Gt, BC, et al by even more.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Think about how dumb that statement is- SILENT VERBAL

 

[cuse10]

So what? They are ALWAYS good. Can beat anybody and play hard. When is the last time Arizona was blown out by an inferior team? They ran into a super hot team in Xavier who couldn't miss in that S16 game. Otherwise they are playing in another E8. Which would've been like three in the last four years. Two E8 losses were like one possession games against those Wisconsin excellent Kaminsky/Dekker teams and one was in OT. Sign me up for that and no bubble, please.

Another E8, but not another F4. That's how low some of your standards are? Arizona recruits well because it has a beautiful campus and hot co-eds which young men like. Going to the pool after class beats trudging through a foot of snow and playing video games on South Campus. Some of you ignore these things.

 

[Ward]

Well, you're responding to a response about my post, and nowhere in it is the suggestion that we would be or were "fine" with grad transfers. My example of white, though — seems a pretty simple assumption that tucker in 17-18 will not produce as much as White just did for us. So, getting tucker isn't evidence that we're fine either.

I also said that I hoped we got tucker, with the implication that a grad transfer is absolutely a Plan B or fallback. No, duh, it's not a good 'strategy.' But swap in a 4-star freshman for AW3 last season and we lose to StJ, Uconn, Gt, BC, et al by even more.

Yea, I'm with you and what I think we're seeing across the board is the fan base overvaluing some of these recruits/late options because of how the roster looks right now in addressing certain holes. Tucker would probably be a pretty good shooter for us right away but he most likely wouldn't be as productive from 3 as White was last year (nobody in program history has) and I doubt he's as good as Malachi was 2 years ago. Would he be a big a upgrade to the roster and fill a huge void, yes, but it's relative.

My posts on us being fine or not fine aren't narrowed down to just grad transfers and is why I included Thompson. My overall point was having an incomplete roster in May with plenty of holes to fill is a pretty rough position to be in so don't get why some posters here are trying to normalize it. The realistic high school options have been picked over for the most part and then you're at the mercy of what 5th year guy might be available who would want to come on board. I think objectively speaking ending up with Thompson, White and Gillon last year was probably the realistic best case scenario and outcome in terms of finding guys pretty late who fit needs and we can get to come here - and look where that got us. Now fast forward 12 months and we're in the same spot with 2 guards on the roster ready to play ACC minutes in the fall and a roster that will struggle to make more than 4 three pointers a game.

 

[cuse10]

Ayala is a very good player.

Never said he wasn't. The way some of you act, you'd think he's the second coming of Carmelo. He's a fringe four star prospect and a four year player that fits the program archetype. Nothing more.

 

[Shark58]

Think about how dumb that statement is- SILENT VERBAL

we drive on parkways and park on driveways


true story

 

[Peacone36]

Pastner's coaching GT now, and he hasn't gotten hardly anybody drafted either in his career.

But that's all gonna change now, because reasons!! :blah:

I didn't say it was going to change. I just said his system is a better system than our prior coaches. Current NBA Players: Cuse 8 GT 5 (6 if you count Bosh)

Blowing us away...

 

[721Comstock]

GaTech hasn't gotten very many guys drafted of late.
Pastner hasn't gotten very many guys drafted at all.

But put them together, and they're the next Kentucky at sending guys to the NBA? :crazy:


Meanwhile, SU has been to 3 Final Fours in Tucker's lifetime, and has had a first rounder drafted for how many consecutive years now?

Question for Admins -
WHY is discussing the recent NBA draft success (or lack thereof) and NCAA Final Four success (or lack thereof) between the 2 programs that Jordan Tucker is deciding between - considered a thread derail?? :noidea:

I would think those factors are pretty much the opposite of a derail.

Syracuse has a very strong record of NCAA post-season success in Jordan Tucker's lifetime, including a National Championship, and 2 other recent Final Four appearances.
And a very strong record of first round draft picks in the NBA draft.

Neither GaTech as a program in recent years, nor Josh Pastner as a HC period, has ANY OF THAT.

 

[Briancuse]

Think about how dumb that statement is- SILENT VERBAL

Is a silent verbal where you use sign language to tell them your coming?

 

[jgeorge322]

Think about how dumb that statement is- SILENT VERBAL

While it is a paradox, there is a specific meaning for the phrase. A verbal commit is someone who commits to a school but does not sign LOI papers. A silent version is one who told the coaches but did not make it public. The real misnomer is the word verbal. People often confuse verbal with oral. Verbal means words, either written or spoken. Thus, while even more paradoxical, the term silent oral commitment might be more accurate. Silent and verbal are not necessarily opposites. Writing something is verbal but also silent if what is written is not spoken.

Off to cocktail hour. Happy Friday.

 

[AZOrange]

While it is a paradox, there is a specific meaning for the phrase. A verbal commit is someone who commits to a school but does not sign LOI papers. A silent version is one who told the coaches but did not make it public. The real misnomer is the word verbal. People often confuse verbal with oral. Verbal means words, either written or spoken. Thus, while even more paradoxical, the term silent oral commitment might be more accurate. Silent and verbal are not necessarily opposites. Writing something is verbal but also silent if what is written is not spoken.

Off to cocktail hour. Happy Friday.

Aka a "wink"

 

[Briancuse]

This is interesting because I read that knox and duval both wanted ESPN time for announcement but they couldn't get it.. So I'm going to assume the same will be for tucker even tho there was a report he was trying to get air time.

I would assume that is correct if top 10 guys can't get it, why would the 40th rated kid get it?

 

[Day2]

I would assume that is correct if top 10 guys can't get it, why would the 40th rated kid get it?

Because he's been to the TNT studio.

 

[Melancer46]

This is interesting because I read that knox and duval both wanted ESPN time for announcement but they couldn't get it.. So I'm going to assume the same will be for tucker even tho there was a report he was trying to get air time.

Maybe this is why Tucker was at TNT studios.

 

[Melancer46]

Because he's been to the TNT studio.

Great minds.

 

[Day2]

Great minds.

First.

 

[cliftonparksufan]

Because he's been to the TNT studio.

But does he know Danny Schayes

 

[Frozen]

I would assume that is correct if top 10 guys can't get it, why would the 40th rated kid get it?

Especially in May.

 

[721Comstock]

I didn't say it was going to change. I just said his system is a better system than our prior coaches. Current NBA Players: Cuse 8 GT 5 (6 if you count Bosh)

Blowing us away...

Pretty sure Syracuse had like 10-11 guys get minutes in the NBA this past season.
But whatever.
How many 1st round draft picks you guys had in the past decade?

Tech has 2 Final Fours EVER in program history.
Boeheim has FIVE, himself.

In Tucker's lifetime, we've had a National Championship, and 2 more Final Fours.
Tech has the one FF in '04, and a whole lotta nada since.