Some People Aren't Going to Like Hearing This...

[CIL]

I watched the game with a very, very, very knowledgable NFL front office person tonight. Despite all of our laments about referees, missed fields goals, GMac, and Hunt, we as fans over looked one other aspect of this game -- talent. He has personally evaluated a lot of players on this year's team.

We as fans tend to overestimate our talent or somehow believe that a perfectly coached game can lead us to a win. Sometimes the other team is just better. And ND was just better. We are also a damn slow football team.

He actually put some plays on rewind and slowed them down. Our WR's really struggle getting consistent separation. West has nice hands but he made the comment that he is painfully slow and should have had multiple steps on the guy given his release. He likes Gulley but he just isn't fast enough. In his words, "how can you not beat a DE around the edge at this level" on that swing pass.

Our interior OL got blown up by ND's 94 on multiple occasions. He single handedly hurt our run game. Kelly made a poor play on Hunter Jr's TD catch. He hesitated on that route -- he could have blown him up or made a play on the ball. Instead he thought about it and did neither. Also said both our corners are a bit stiff and need to get better.

There were some silver linings I guess. He loved how hard we played for Shafer and co tonight. We played through every whistle and fought hard. He actually likes Hunt as a college QB. He made some decent throws and probably paid in a boatload of pain. In his words, "he's noa top 10 QB, but you could do a hell of a lot worse." He said we'd think differently about him if we had a WR that scared anyone else.

We just have to get better folks. We can nitpick calls all day long, but at the end of the day we do not have the horses to play with top 20 teams yet. Our DL still fails to get push without sending the house, and our skill guys aren't quite skilled enough.

I loved the way these kids competed today. I hope estime and Moore are ok and we get better from here.

 

[Todd Gack]

I watched the game with a very, very, very knowledgable NFL front office person tonight. Despite all of our laments about referees, missed fields goals, GMac, and Hunt, we as fans over looked one other aspect of this game -- talent. He has personally evaluated a lot of players on this year's team. We as fans tend to overestimate our talent or somehow believe that a perfectly coached game can lead us to a win. Sometimes the other team is just better. And ND was just better. We are also a damn slow football team. He actually put some plays on rewind and slowed them down. Our WR's really struggle getting consistent separation. West has nice hands but he made the comment that he is painfully slow and should have had multiple steps on the guy given his release. He likes Gulley but he just isn't fast enough. In his words, "how can you not beat a DE around the edge at this level" on that swing pass. Our interior OL got blown up by ND's 94 on multiple occasions. He single handedly hurt our run game. Kelly made a poor play on Hunter Jr's TD catch. He hesitated on that route -- he could have blown him up or made a play on the ball. Instead he thought about it and did neither. Also said both our corners are a bit stiff and need to get better. There were some silver linings I guess. He loved how hard we played for Shafer and co tonight. We played through every whistle and fought hard. He actually likes Hunt as a college QB. He made some decent throws and probably paid in a boatload of pain. In his words, "he's noa top 10 QB, but you could do a hell of a lot worse." He said we'd think differently about him if we had a WR that scared anyone else. We just have to get better folks. We can nitpick calls all day long, but at the end of the day we do not have the horses to play with top 20 teams yet. Our DL still fails to get push without sending the house, and our skill guys aren't quite skilled enough. I loved the way these kids competed today. I hope estime and Moore are ok and we get better from here.

For one, I'm fine with hearing this -- ND has superior talent. SU doesn't need to be in the final four -- crawl before you walk and get into the top 25.

 

[RF2044]

Great post.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

What's tough is, if Gulley's not fast enough...

 

[ORANGEsPHK]

Yes, I think we all knew this - I mean look at the players we have compared to ND and other Top 25 teams. But I think we'll get there and are heading that way.

However, I think as a fan base its easy to get excited about the talent we are starting to collect. I hope it all gels together in a few years, because its going to take a little while for the talent to catch up. In any case, we're in way better shape then we were under GRob.

 

[Cuseregular]

I watched the game with a very, very, very knowledgable NFL front office person tonight. Despite all of our laments about referees, missed fields goals, GMac, and Hunt, we as fans over looked one other aspect of this game -- talent. He has personally evaluated a lot of players on this year's team.

We as fans tend to overestimate our talent or somehow believe that a perfectly coached game can lead us to a win. Sometimes the other team is just better. And ND was just better. We are also a damn slow football team.

He actually put some plays on rewind and slowed them down. Our WR's really struggle getting consistent separation. West has nice hands but he made the comment that he is painfully slow and should have had multiple steps on the guy given his release. He likes Gulley but he just isn't fast enough. In his words, "how can you not beat a DE around the edge at this level" on that swing pass.

Our interior OL got blown up by ND's 94 on multiple occasions. He single handedly hurt our run game. Kelly made a poor play on Hunter Jr's TD catch. He hesitated on that route -- he could have blown him up or made a play on the ball. Instead he thought about it and did neither. Also said both our corners are a bit stiff and need to get better.

There were some silver linings I guess. He loved how hard we played for Shafer and co tonight. We played through every whistle and fought hard. He actually likes Hunt as a college QB. He made some decent throws and probably paid in a boatload of pain. In his words, "he's noa top 10 QB, but you could do a hell of a lot worse." He said we'd think differently about him if we had a WR that scared anyone else.

We just have to get better folks. We can nitpick calls all day long, but at the end of the day we do not have the horses to play with top 20 teams yet. Our DL still fails to get push without sending the house, and our skill guys aren't quite skilled enough.

I loved the way these kids competed today. I hope estime and Moore are ok and we get better from here.

yep and yep on all. Especially the no horses part, but the very real question that I think is reasonable re the "yet" part is is this ceiling insurmountable? Much like at our alma-mater losing I think it's 15th straight with no hope there given the climate right now. Should I allow myself to believe with the IPF, etc. that they're some sort of magic bullet to overcome all the obstacles up here and that there's a realistic shot to get there to have the horses to compete in a game like this? Feeling very negative re that, and not just in the shadow of this game. Appreciate the effort as RF said but seriously exhausted, frustrated and oh so bored as a fan.

 

[phil77]

I know this will not make a lot of people happy either but if our older talent sucks lets play the younger guys. If we are going to be bad anyway be bad with talented youth. Play Ish and Custis more. Philips and Morris more. Let the kids play and see what we have.

 

[007]

I watched the game with a very, very, very knowledgable NFL front office person tonight. Despite all of our laments about referees, missed fields goals, GMac, and Hunt, we as fans over looked one other aspect of this game -- talent. He has personally evaluated a lot of players on this year's team.

We as fans tend to overestimate our talent or somehow believe that a perfectly coached game can lead us to a win. Sometimes the other team is just better. And ND was just better. We are also a damn slow football team.

He actually put some plays on rewind and slowed them down. Our WR's really struggle getting consistent separation. West has nice hands but he made the comment that he is painfully slow and should have had multiple steps on the guy given his release. He likes Gulley but he just isn't fast enough. In his words, "how can you not beat a DE around the edge at this level" on that swing pass.

Our interior OL got blown up by ND's 94 on multiple occasions. He single handedly hurt our run game. Kelly made a poor play on Hunter Jr's TD catch. He hesitated on that route -- he could have blown him up or made a play on the ball. Instead he thought about it and did neither. Also said both our corners are a bit stiff and need to get better.

There were some silver linings I guess. He loved how hard we played for Shafer and co tonight. We played through every whistle and fought hard. He actually likes Hunt as a college QB. He made some decent throws and probably paid in a boatload of pain. In his words, "he's noa top 10 QB, but you could do a hell of a lot worse." He said we'd think differently about him if we had a WR that scared anyone else.

We just have to get better folks. We can nitpick calls all day long, but at the end of the day we do not have the horses to play with top 20 teams yet. Our DL still fails to get push without sending the house, and our skill guys aren't quite skilled enough.

I loved the way these kids competed today. I hope estime and Moore are ok and we get better from here.

I'm sure many here don't want to believe that this is largely a talent issue.

But there are some of us who have been consistently talking about the glaring lack of talent, speed and play makers on both sides of the ball. If Shafer and staff can find a way to win 6 - and I still believe that is going to mean we have to win 3 of the last 4 games with a depleted roster - then this season will be a success.

 

[Full_Rebar]

What about all those 40 times that were reported in the Spring/Summer?

In all seriousness, we know West isn't fast, but Lemon/Sales/Provo weren't burners either. Until the speed is there, it's up to the staff to find a scheme for the talent we have, not the talent we want.

On defense, it doesn't make sense to me that we put corners on an island and pray the blitz gets to the QB fast enough.

 

[TheCusian]

Phillips and Ish (and maybe Custis) are the future on O. We need more guys like that...

 

[GoSU96]

I watched the game with a very, very, very knowledgable NFL front office person tonight. Despite all of our laments about referees, missed fields goals, GMac, and Hunt, we as fans over looked one other aspect of this game -- talent. He has personally evaluated a lot of players on this year's team.

We as fans tend to overestimate our talent or somehow believe that a perfectly coached game can lead us to a win. Sometimes the other team is just better. And ND was just better. We are also a damn slow football team.

He actually put some plays on rewind and slowed them down. Our WR's really struggle getting consistent separation. West has nice hands but he made the comment that he is painfully slow and should have had multiple steps on the guy given his release. He likes Gulley but he just isn't fast enough. In his words, "how can you not beat a DE around the edge at this level" on that swing pass.

Our interior OL got blown up by ND's 94 on multiple occasions. He single handedly hurt our run game. Kelly made a poor play on Hunter Jr's TD catch. He hesitated on that route -- he could have blown him up or made a play on the ball. Instead he thought about it and did neither. Also said both our corners are a bit stiff and need to get better.

There were some silver linings I guess. He loved how hard we played for Shafer and co tonight. We played through every whistle and fought hard. He actually likes Hunt as a college QB. He made some decent throws and probably paid in a boatload of pain. In his words, "he's noa top 10 QB, but you could do a hell of a lot worse." He said we'd think differently about him if we had a WR that scared anyone else.

We just have to get better folks. We can nitpick calls all day long, but at the end of the day we do not have the horses to play with top 20 teams yet. Our DL still fails to get push without sending the house, and our skill guys aren't quite skilled enough.

I loved the way these kids competed today. I hope estime and Moore are ok and we get better from here.

The playstation nation doesn't get that.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

yep and yep on all. Especially the no horses part, but the very real question that I think is reasonable re the "yet" part is is this ceiling insurmountable? Much like at our alma-mater losing I think it's 15th straight with no hope there given the climate right now. Should I allow myself to believe with the IPF, etc. that they're some sort of magic bullet to overcome all the obstacles up here and that there's a realistic shot to get there to have the horses to compete in a game like this? Feeling very negative re that, and not just in the shadow of this game. Appreciate the effort as RF said but seriously exhausted, frustrated and oh so bored as a fan.

I think it can get back, but the next time it does it won't be consistent. It will be because the stars aligned and we have a few players that are much better than expected. Might be another boost before we have elite talent regularly.

 

[OrangeFoo]

yep and yep on all. Especially the no horses part, but the very real question that I think is reasonable re the "yet" part is is this ceiling insurmountable? Much like at our alma-mater losing I think it's 15th straight with no hope there given the climate right now. Should I allow myself to believe with the IPF, etc. that they're some sort of magic bullet to overcome all the obstacles up here and that there's a realistic shot to get there to have the horses to compete in a game like this? Feeling very negative re that, and not just in the shadow of this game. Exhausted, frustrated and oh so bored as a fan.

That's my fear too... 4 weeks ago all I read about was this being the fastest and longest and biggest team we have had in a decade. Now all of the sudden we are too slow and too small. This includes last week btw.

Estime is a perfect example... He came from Florida with a rep as a burner... He looks about average to me. What gives?

 

[orangepassion]

I know ND has more talent, but I believe we have enough talent to score more than 3 points in 3 quarters. It would help we wouldn't get penalties on seemingly every offensive drive, particularly the false starts in the 1st half. We need to be more disciplined there and aren't good enough to overcome these constant mistakes.
Does east carolina have such great talent?

I believe Estime is our best playmaker, but we need to get him the ball on the run. Unfortunately, the overthrow to him was probably hunt's worst pass of the night. That play to Lewis was our 1st medium to deep ball that I recall seeing us get with room to run afterwards.

 

[007]

The playstation nation doesn't get that.

To be fair, there were a lot good posters talking about a 8 win season as being a MINIMAL expectation for the season.

 

[Alsacs]

It was 2 star guys vs. 4 star guys. We competed hard and I am not upset at Shafer at all he did everything he could to help the kids out there. We lack talent Herbie was destroying PTG in a nice way with how complementary he was of Erv Philips. Herbie mocked our talent in a nice way without going mayock on us.

 

[baggerbob]

I know this will not make a lot of people happy either but if our older talent sucks lets play the younger guys. If we are going to be bad anyway be bad with talented youth. Play Ish and Custis more. Philips and Morris more. Let the kids play and see what we have.

Basically if Enoicy is healthy get him in the game, Custis, and Enoicy are as fast as the current receivers, but have size. They have upside, our current group, can't outrun anyone, we are good between the 20 yard lines, and unable to score in the red zone.

 

[CIL]

To be fair, this isn't GRob or early Marrone talent either. We are a mid level BCS program that can play with the majority of our schedule, but teams like ND, Clemson, and FSU are just way above us. Even the skill level speed between us and MD was apparent last week. If we cannot push the other team's DL around, this offense is going to struggle to score points, period. We just don't have the Harrison, Moore, even McIntosh types here right now.

Ishmael, Custis, Philips et al may end up being those guys, but right now those kids aren't physically ready yet. I love Ben Lewis' game and his effort, but that should have been 6 there. It wasn't.

 

[GoSU96]

I read about was this being the fastest and longest and biggest team we have had in a decade.

That's true, doesn't mean the roster matches man to man with a program with 4 straight top 10 classes.

Gully has never had a ton of lateral quickness, he's a one cut inside runner, that's his game, he's not a glider and he's not going to win to the edge. But he's a very good straight ahead burst runner.

This roster is much improved, doesn't mean there isn't room for a great deal of improvement.

 

[tep624]

To be fair, there were a lot good posters talking about a 8 win season as being a MINIMAL expectation for the season.

To be fair, we won 7 games last year with virtually the same team against a very similar schedule. Your point?

Why wouldn't the minimal expectation be improvement over last season with an OC that's no longer a rookie, a HC that's no longer a rookie, and a team that was returning the most starters in the conference? And a team that added on some freshman ready to contribute?

 

[jekelish]

I don't think many people here are of the belief our talent or speed is on the level of the top 25 teams, but I do admit I thought we were finally getting faster.

Honestly, Erv is about the only guy whose speed consistently looks to be on par with the guys at the big time programs. That's also what makes it so frustrating that we run all those screens and stretch plays - hard to find success there if the defense is faster than the offense.

 

[RF2044]

I'm sure many here don't want to believe that this is largely a talent issue.

But there are some of us who have been consistently talking about the glaring lack of talent, speed and play makers on both sides of the ball. If Shafer and staff can find a way to win 6 - and I still believe that is going to mean we have to win 3 of the last 4 games with a depleted roster - then this season will be a success.

Couldn't agree more.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

To be fair, we won 7 games last year with virtually the same team against a very similar schedule.

We also won that BC game right at the end, and the bowl game with a late come back.

It's possible our record last season was deceiving.

 

[Todd Gack]

We also won that BC game right at the end, and the bowl game with a late come back. It's possible our record last season was deceiving.

And yet we won. We also lost to Pitt because of a missed XP. We all choose to be optimists or pessimists.

 

[Xanadu]

What about all those 40 times that were reported in the Spring/Summer?

In all seriousness, we know West isn't fast, but Lemon/Sales/Provo weren't burners either. Until the speed is there, it's up to the staff to find a scheme for the talent we have, not the talent we want.

On defense, it doesn't make sense to me that we put corners on an island and pray the blitz gets to the QB fast enough.

The one thing I would say is that the talent level is much better in the ACC than when we played in the Big East. Especially the speed