2021-22 Transfer Thread

[nyclax]

So, I wasn’t paying as much attention as perhaps I should have, but after checking out the Inside Lacrosse transfer recap, I see that Maryland lost three offensive contributors to the portal? What’s up with that?

They had no chance of getting playing time this year, and probably not next year either. It's going to happen when Tillman brings in so many transfers to eat up starting spots. He is clearly ok with the tradeoff.

 

[ivorytower]

Pallonetti and Avanzato have done well and likely Demaio and Sawyer will do as well . Dont know if it has happened yet but the frequent use of transfer portal by Rutgers and UM and some others likely starts weighing on decisions by the recruited when other suitors are equal. Problably not so much for Duke or ND given their academic prestige .

 

[ClvrUsrnm]

They had no chance of getting playing time this year, and probably not next year either. It's going to happen when Tillman brings in so many transfers to eat up starting spots. He is clearly ok with the tradeoff.

Fair enough. It is a curious thing that Tillman and Brecht do with all the transfers. Perhaps they think of it as a way to get more out of their recruits, as in if they don’t do the job, they can and will be replaced.

 

[Zack80]

One can never be sure why a player transfers, although one can speculate on the playing time issue.
Nick DeMaio is a lefty attackman with 2 years of eligibility left. I think Logan Wisnauskas deciding to stay for an extra year would have only given him one year to play, and even then, he would have to beat out Daniel Kelly.
The timing of Jack Sawyer's transfer in July, did make it seem that the addition of Owen Murphy might have led to his transfer. Sawyer, a right-handed attack/midfielder has 3 years of eligibility left, so he could get past this year's 5th year transfers, Khan and Donville along with 5th year players like Fairman, A.DeMaio, and Wisnauskas. The Terps have Danny Maltz for another few seasons as right-handed finisher and brought in an UA AA in Eric Spanos.

Recently, midfielder Jake Smith dropped off the roster. I don't know if he is transferring or not.

Anyways, I didn't notice you all lamenting the addition of Gavin because he might make Syracuse's other goalies sit. You seemed to be rather happy because it made Syracuse a stronger team.

 

[nyclax]

Anyways, I didn't notice you all lamenting the addition of Gavin because he might make Syracuse's other goalies sit. You seemed to be rather happy because it made Syracuse a stronger team.

Not sure it's quite the same. Maryland brought in two stars in Khan and Donville, both of whom are definitely going to play and eat up what would have been someone else's playing time. And while not a star (yet), Murphy is going to have a role and has 4 years of eligibility still.

Gavin is probably the favorite to start but there's no way they are just penciling him in as the starter without competition especially since he wasn't there for fall ball. There's a difference between adding a guy to improve your depth at a position that was lacking vs. bringing in all the top talent that is humanly possible to bump out the homegrown guys who would have been in line for some sort of role otherwise. There is no way those guys are beating out Khan or Donville for playing time. Meanwhile Gavin is not like some star goalie. He started two games and did pretty good. He can be beat out.

 

[DoctahLexus]

Not sure it's quite the same. Maryland brought in two stars in Khan and Donville, both of whom are definitely going to play and eat up what would have been someone else's playing time. And while not a star (yet), Murphy is going to have a role and has 4 years of eligibility still.

Gavin is probably the favorite to start but there's no way they are just penciling him in as the starter without competition especially since he wasn't there for fall ball. There's a difference between adding a guy to improve your depth at a position that was lacking vs. bringing in all the top talent that is humanly possible to bump out the homegrown guys who would have been in line for some sort of role otherwise. There is no way those guys are beating out Khan or Donville for playing time. Meanwhile Gavin is not like some star goalie. He started two games and did pretty good. He can be beat out.

Totally agree that these are completely different situations. In addition to losing Porter we also lost our longtime primary backup goalie to the portal last year (Strang). We have more of a need for depth there.

Zach80 I am not sure why you think it is hypocritical or biased for Cuse fans to question MDs portal decisions when the rosters are in totally different shape. Besides nyclax wasn't even saying outright that it is a 100% bad decision. He said "clearly he (Tillman) is ok with the tradeoff." I wouldn't call that lamenting. He just seems to think (as do I) that you open yourself up to losing some potential recruits right out of highschool and younger players transferring.

 

[ClvrUsrnm]

One can never be sure why a player transfers, although one can speculate on the playing time issue.
Nick DeMaio is a lefty attackman with 2 years of eligibility left. I think Logan Wisnauskas deciding to stay for an extra year would have only given him one year to play, and even then, he would have to beat out Daniel Kelly.
The timing of Jack Sawyer's transfer in July, did make it seem that the addition of Owen Murphy might have led to his transfer. Sawyer, a right-handed attack/midfielder has 3 years of eligibility left, so he could get past this year's 5th year transfers, Khan and Donville along with 5th year players like Fairman, A.DeMaio, and Wisnauskas. The Terps have Danny Maltz for another few seasons as right-handed finisher and brought in an UA AA in Eric Spanos.

Recently, midfielder Jake Smith dropped off the roster. I don't know if he is transferring or not.

Anyways, I didn't notice you all lamenting the addition of Gavin because he might make Syracuse's other goalies sit. You seemed to be rather happy because it made Syracuse a stronger team.

Who’s lamenting? I was just asking because I was curious. Tillman can run his program however he sees fit. Defensive much?

 

[Zack80]

Not sure it's quite the same. Maryland brought in two stars in Khan and Donville, both of whom are definitely going to play and eat up what would have been someone else's playing time. And while not a star (yet), Murphy is going to have a role and has 4 years of eligibility still.

Gavin is probably the favorite to start but there's no way they are just penciling him in as the starter without competition especially since he wasn't there for fall ball. There's a difference between adding a guy to improve your depth at a position that was lacking vs. bringing in all the top talent that is humanly possible to bump out the homegrown guys who would have been in line for some sort of role otherwise. There is no way those guys are beating out Khan or Donville for playing time. Meanwhile Gavin is not like some star goalie. He started two games and did pretty good. He can be beat out.

Owen Murphy and Gavin are pretty much the same sort of transfers though. If Gavin wins the goalie job, he will probably play a lot more this spring.

If Donville had transferred to Syracuse, you'd be pretty happy - even though he put someone else on the bench.

 

[Zack80]

Fair enough. It is a curious thing that Tillman and Brecht do with all the transfers. Perhaps they think of it as a way to get more out of their recruits, as in if they don’t do the job, they can and will be replaced.

It is not that curious, both are trying to be successful. Brecht wants to get back to the NCAA tmt, and Tillman wants to win a title.

 

[ClvrUsrnm]

It is not that curious, both are trying to be successful. Brecht wants to get back to the NCAA tmt, and Tillman wants to win a title.

It’s curious because it shows they have no faith in the players they themselves recruited. It’s also curious because of the message that it may send to future recruits.

 

[nyclax]

Owen Murphy and Gavin are pretty much the same sort of transfers though. If Gavin wins the goalie job, he will probably play a lot more this spring.

If Donville had transferred to Syracuse, you'd be pretty happy - even though he put someone else on the bench.

No they aren't.

A) Murphy is more proven. He played in all six of Hopkins' 2020 games and started half of them. Had 13 pts in those six games including hat tricks against Syracuse and Princeton. He was quickly becoming one of their best offensive players.

B) Syracuse had a need for goalie depth. Maryland had 0 need for another attackman. None. Was not an area of deficiency whatsoever. They added a talented player to what was already one of the more talented offenses in the country. Not remotely like Cuse desperately needing more experience in its goalie room sans Porter.

So Murphy was a proven scorer who entered a situation in which he wasn't actually *needed*. Gavin was a less proven goalie who entered a situation that really needed someone like him (honestly, they probably could have used Dolan from Binghamton in addition/instead of Gavin but it's too late for that). How are those two things at all the same?

 

[Zack80]

No they aren't.

A) Murphy is more proven. He played in all six of Hopkins' 2020 games and started half of them. Had 13 pts in those six games including hat tricks against Syracuse and Princeton. He was quickly becoming one of their best offensive players.

B) Syracuse had a need for goalie depth. Maryland had 0 need for another attackman. None. Was not an area of deficiency whatsoever. They added a talented player to what was already one of the more talented offenses in the country. Not remotely like Cuse desperately needing more experience in its goalie room sans Porter.

So Murphy was a proven scorer who entered a situation in which he wasn't actually *needed*. Gavin was a less proven goalie who entered a situation that really needed someone like him (honestly, they probably could have used Dolan from Binghamton in addition/instead of Gavin but it's too late for that). How are those two things at all the same?

A) Gavin is credited with having solid appearances against Army and Loyola for UVa. It seems about the same to me. Both have shown they are solid at the D1 level.
B) You are mistaken here. Maryland has little need for another attackman this season, but Murphy has 4 more years of eligibility. Things are a little thin for righthanders at UMd down the road: Long will probably return for a 5th year next year, Maltz has a few seasons to go, and Spanos is incoming as a freshman.

 

[ClvrUsrnm]

A) Gavin is credited with having solid appearances against Army and Loyola for UVa. It seems about the same to me. Both have shown they are solid at the D1 level.
B) You are mistaken here. Maryland has little need for another attackman this season, but Murphy has 4 more years of eligibility. Things are a little thin for righthanders at UMd down the road: Long will probably return for a 5th year next year, Maltz has a few seasons to go, and Spanos is incoming as a freshman.

A little thin down the road? They’ve got 70 different rosters of attackmen to choose from.

 

[nyclax]

A) Gavin is credited with having solid appearances against Army and Loyola for UVa. It seems about the same to me. Both have shown they are solid at the D1 level.
B) You are mistaken here. Maryland has little need for another attackman this season, but Murphy has 4 more years of eligibility. Things are a little thin for righthanders at UMd down the road: Long will probably return for a 5th year next year, Maltz has a few seasons to go, and Spanos is incoming as a freshman.

Gotta be honest, I have no idea what you're trying to say here.

You say "things are a little thin for righthanders down the road" but then list three guys who are righties, one of whom has 4 years of eligibility and another still has 3?

 

[Zack80]

A little thin down the road? They’ve got 70 different rosters of attackmen to choose from.

Not really that sort of counting argument when you are trying to be a top 5 team and go for titles.

 

[ClvrUsrnm]

Not really that sort of counting argument when you are trying to be a top 5 team and go for titles.

It was a joke

 

[Zack80]

Gotta be honest, I have no idea what you're trying to say here.

You say "things are a little thin for righthanders down the road" but then list three guys who are righties, one of whom has 4 years of eligibility and another still has 3?

Long played midfield last year, 2nd team AA. Tillman often plays attackmen at midfield, as a matter of fact, all 6 of Maryland's starters on the offense last season played attack in high school.
Then there are injuries, players leaving the team for other reasons, players who don't pan out, ...

 

[nyclax]

Long played midfield last year, 2nd team AA. Tillman often plays attackmen at midfield, as a matter of fact, all 6 of Maryland's starters on the offense last season played attack in high school.
Then there are injuries, players leaving the team for other reasons, players who don't pan out, ...

Maltz has already panned out, Spanos was a top recruit. That's to say absolutely nothing of guys like Brennan, Malever, Koras, and Kelly who theoretically are going to play attack at some point in their careers. That is not thin. They have both established guys and young top recruits just waiting. That's the definition of deep. How many more dudes do you want sitting on the bench wasting away? The whole point is that they didn't NEED another attackman.

 

[ClvrUsrnm]

Maltz has already panned out, Spanos was a top recruit. That's to say absolutely nothing of guys like Brennan, Malever, Koras, and Kelly who theoretically are going to play attack at some point in their careers. That is not thin. They have both established guys and young top recruits just waiting. That's the definition of deep. How many more dudes do you want sitting on the bench wasting away? The whole point is that they didn't NEED another attackman.

What happened to Jack Brennan? Wasn’t he getting run and producing in 2020?

 

[Zack80]

Maltz has already panned out, Spanos was a top recruit. That's to say absolutely nothing of guys like Brennan, Malever, Koras, and Kelly who theoretically are going to play attack at some point in their careers. That is not thin. They have both established guys and young top recruits just waiting. That's the definition of deep. How many more dudes do you want sitting on the bench wasting away? The whole point is that they didn't NEED another attackman.

Brennan, Malever, J.Koras, and Kelly are all lefthanders. Brennan and J.Koras have played midfield so far - J.Koras is listed as a midfielder on the roster, Brennan as an A/M.
Spanos was a top recruit, who missed much of his high school career due to knee injuries. He was healthy last spring and was outstanding.

The Terps are deep this year, but not necessarily that deep next year. At this time, who are the established players for 2023 - Long (assuming he returns for a 5th year), Maltz, and possibly one might consider Malever. You want nine contributors - attack, 1st midfield and 2nd midfield. (Probably, at least one of the top 9 will be injured so you probably need 10.) Murphy probably fits in that top 9 (or 10).

Brennan was injured last season and didn't play.

 

[nyclax]

Brennan, Malever, J.Koras, and Kelly are all lefthanders. Brennan and J.Koras have played midfield so far - J.Koras is listed as a midfielder on the roster, Brennan as an A/M.
Spanos was a top recruit, who missed much of his high school career due to knee injuries. He was healthy last spring and was outstanding.

The Terps are deep this year, but not necessarily that deep next year. At this time, who are the established players for 2023 - Long (assuming he returns for a 5th year), Maltz, and possibly one might consider Malever. You want nine contributors - attack, 1st midfield and 2nd midfield. (Probably, at least one of the top 9 will be injured so you probably need 10.) Murphy probably fits in that top 9 (or 10).

Brennan was injured last season and didn't play.

We were talking about attack specifically. Now Murphy just needs to fit into their top 10 for next year? Feels like you're moving the goal posts now.

Those three righthanders (Long, Maltz, Spanos) are still going to be there next year. Two are still going to be there in 2024. One is still going to be there in 2025. Doesn't sound like a need to me.

If anything, I think they made the move because Tillman knows his future attack pipeline might be what you'd call thin. Not seeing a lot of standout attackmen in their 2022 or 2023 classes. But the current team is the opposite of thin next year and the following year. And as someone else mentioned, that assumes they don't just bring in another Khan next year, which cannot be assumed.

 

[ivorytower]

Zach, this is not going 'terrifically" for you.


0 in Cuse today, welcome to the tundra, we've got fun and games.

 

[Zack80]

Zach, this is not going 'terrifically" for you.


0 in Cuse today, welcome to the tundra, we've got fun and games.

Actually, I'm doing just fine.
You might remember that I am a Terp fan. I know the Terps' personnel well, and I know how things work with the Terps.

Owen Murphy was a good pickup for the Terps given his eligibility, whether as an attackman or midfielder. It is not a given that he will be a big player for the Terps, even given his nice start at Hopkins, but he is another good possibility for one going down the road.

You might notice that the Terps didn't get Joey Spallina, McCabe Millon, or any other 5-star attackmen in the next 2 classes. Maybe Spanos will move up to a 5-star in IL's rankings, but right now he is a 4-star - and he has had injury problems, so there is no 5-star attackman in this year's class.