2022 Baseball Hall of Fame Ballot

[br801]

That why baseball writers suck. Has nothing to do with whether or not he should be in the H of F. Small minded people who hold his political view against him.

Among other things, he has supported insurrection and promoted the idea of killing journalists. If you make those views public, yeah, some people are going to have issues with him.

 

[Day2]

An interesting note on Edmonds. His counting stats aren’t where they need to be due to a lack of plate appearances, but he’s only 7 home runs shy of 400 and 51 hits shy of 2000. Add in the postseason and he surpasses both marks, making him one of only four CFs with 400 HRs, 2000 hits, and 1000 walks.

The other three are Mantle, Mays, and Griffey.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Among other things, he has supported insurrection and promoted the idea of killing journalists. If you make those views public, yeah, some people are going to have issues with him.

What would America be if no one ever supported insurrection?

 

[Day2]

What would America be if no one ever supported insurrection?

 

[Day2]

More Edmonds numbers: Jim Edmonds' ranks among center fielders

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Jefferson, Adams, Washington, etc. Would disagree.
Now, that said, I don’t agree with what occurred, we should remember the words of Jefferson when talking about governmental form:
“… I hold it that a little rebellion now and then is a good thing, and as necessary in the political world as storms in the physical.1 Unsuccesful rebellions indeed generally establish the incroachments on the rights of the people which have produced them. An observation of this truth should render honest republican governors so mild in their punishment of rebellions, as not to discourage them too much. It is a medecine necessary for the sound health of government." - Thomas Jefferson to James Madison, January 30, 17872

 

[Day2]

Jefferson, Adams, Washington, etc. Would disagree.
Now, that said, I don’t agree with what occurred, we should remember the words of Jefferson when talking about governmental form:
“… I hold it that a little rebellion now and then is a good thing, and as necessary in the political world as storms in the physical.1 Unsuccesful rebellions indeed generally establish the incroachments on the rights of the people which have produced them. An observation of this truth should render honest republican governors so mild in their punishment of rebellions, as not to discourage them too much. It is a medecine necessary for the sound health of government." - Thomas Jefferson to James Madison, January 30, 17872

You’ve convinced me. I’m sitting here convinced.

 

[br801]

Jefferson, Adams, Washington, etc. Would disagree.
Now, that said, I don’t agree with what occurred, we should remember the words of Jefferson when talking about governmental form:
“… I hold it that a little rebellion now and then is a good thing, and as necessary in the political world as storms in the physical.1 Unsuccesful rebellions indeed generally establish the incroachments on the rights of the people which have produced them. An observation of this truth should render honest republican governors so mild in their punishment of rebellions, as not to discourage them too much. It is a medecine necessary for the sound health of government." - Thomas Jefferson to James Madison, January 30, 17872

I must have missed the part where he commented on the idea of people in power fomenting the rebellion in an attempt to remain in power indefinitely.

 

[UnknownOrange]

Saw Paul O'Neill's name and it made me wonder... who is a similar offensive player that has never sniffed the HOF

Keith Hernandez. Better overall, and a much MUCH better defender

 

[bpo57]

I didn’t say yes, I said he had too few homers, but his defense should be part of the consideration, although it almost never is (see Blair, Paul).

I thought he was a very solid RFer but not exceptional.

 

[bpo57]

Nobody is overlooking his postseason performance. His postseason numbers match his regular season numbers almost identically. That’s great!

Saying Player A is better than Player B because he has more rings is silly.

Matching already excellent regular season #s with similar postseason #s is not a minor thing considering the pressure and the fact you're facing well above average pitching in the postseason.

 

[donniesyracuse]

Matching already excellent regular season #s with similar postseason #s is not a minor thing considering the pressure and the fact you're facing well above average pitching in the postseason.

I did not say it was a minor thing. I literally said “that’s great!”

 

[bpo57]

Nobody is overlooking his postseason performance. His postseason numbers match his regular season numbers almost identically. That’s great!

Saying Player A is better than Player B because he has more rings is silly.

My point, which I apparently did not make effectively, is the impact Ortiz had on his team winning those three rings not just that he had three rings. It kinda blows my mind that we're debating the candidacy of a guy with 541 HRs and 1768 RBIs (every eligible player that hit more HRs and/or drove in more runs than Ortiz is in the HoF except for the proven steroid users). He's also hands down the best postseason performer of the last 40 years. Not even close.

 

[Day2]

Had Rolen and Edmonds played for the Yankees or Red Sox, both of them would already be in the Hall. Had Ortiz stayed with the Twins, he would not be in the Hall.

 

[Cowtown]

Among other things, he has supported insurrection and promoted the idea of killing journalists. If you make those views public, yeah, some people are going to have issues with him.

It's amusing how Tuttle, who actually considers himself some sort of intellectual, somehow needs that explained to him.

 

[Alsacs]

Had Rolen and Edmonds played for the Yankees or Red Sox, both of them would already be in the Hall. Had Ortiz stayed with the Twins, he would not be in the Hall.

I wouldn’t agree.
Bernie Williams had a similar career to Jim Edmonds. Not as good but really close and he didn’t sniff the HOF.

Rolen just wouldn’t get my support if he were a Red Sox. I watched the guy and at no point did i ever think he was the 1% of his sport. Which is a HOFer.

 

[Cowtown]

What would America be if no one ever supported insurrection?

Context, young man, context. An idea whose time has come.)

 

[Day2]

I wouldn’t agree.
Bernie Williams had a similar career to Jim Edmonds. Not as good but really close and he didn’t sniff the HOF.

Rolen just wouldn’t get my support if he were a Red Sox. I watched the guy and at no point did i ever think he was the 1% of his sport. Which is a HOFer.

You don’t seem to appreciate defense in baseball. Bernie Williams was horrible in the field. Edmonds was one of the best defensive CFs of all time.

On top of that, Edmonds’ WAR is over 10 points higher than Williams’. They’re not that similar.

Your standards for 3B must be very high, perhaps because you’ve seen up to five of the eight 3B with higher WAR than Rolen: Schmidt, Boggs, Beltre, Brett, Jones. We’re talking about the HOF. The top ten at each position should be represented, shouldn’t they?

 

[Alsacs]

You don’t seem to appreciate defense in baseball. Bernie Williams was horrible in the field. Edmonds was one of the best defensive CFs of all time.

On top of that, Edmonds’ WAR is over 10 points higher than Williams’. They’re not that similar.

Your standards for 3B must be very high, perhaps because you’ve seen up to five of the eight 3B with higher WAR than Rolen: Schmidt, Boggs, Beltre, Brett, Jones. We’re talking about the HOF. The top ten at each position should be represented, shouldn’t they?

Bernie had a poor arm but he won 4 GG in a row.
Adrian Beltre is a HOF 3b.
He is what I want at 3b HOF.
Chipper was a HOF.

I don’t see it from Rolen.
Nolan Arenado is a future HOFer.

 

[Alsacs]

Scott Rolen is the Matt Williams of the 00s.
I don’t see that as a HOFer.

 

[Day2]

Scott Rolen is the Matt Williams of the 00s.
I don’t see that as a HOFer.

That’s why WAR exists. Because of what you can’t see.

 

[Day2]

Bernie had a poor arm but he won 4 GG in a row.
Adrian Beltre is a HOF 3b.
He is what I want at 3b HOF.
Chipper was a HOF.

I don’t see it from Rolen.
Nolan Arenado is a future HOFer.

Williams had a negative dWAR. Williams and Edmonds could be the exact same hitter, but Edmonds still comes out ahead because he took runs away.

Just because Beltre and Jones are HOFers doesn’t mean Rolen isn’t. They’re all in the top ten.

Your argument would be like saying Melo isn’t one of the all-time great scorers in NBA history, despite fact he’s ranked 9th. That Kobe, Jordan, and LBJ are, but not Melo.

 

[Alsacs]

Williams had a negative dWAR. Williams and Edmonds could be the exact same hitter, but Edmonds still comes out ahead because he took runs away.

Just because Beltre and Jones are HOFers doesn’t mean Rolen isn’t. They’re all in the top ten.

Your argument would be like saying Melo isn’t one of the all-time great scorers in NBA history, despite fact he’s ranked 9th. That Kobe, Jordan, and LBJ are, but not Melo.

I don’t see Rolen as a Melo.
The comp would be someone like Joe Johnson.
Who I don’t see as a HOFer in the NBA but a good player but not a HOFer.

 

[Day2]

I don’t see Rolen as a Melo.
The comp would be someone like Joe Johnson.
Who I don’t see as a HOFer in the NBA but a good player but not a HOFer.

Melo is 9th all-time in scoring.

Rolen is 9th all-time in WAR among 3B.

 

[MSOrange]

Glanville: Bonds shouldn't be a Hall of Famer -- and that's OK

For one former player, Bonds' candidacy was an unwelcome reminder of how different the stakes felt when cheating isn't entertaining or theoretical -- it was costing you a job.

www.espn.com