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newmexicuse

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#1
well i am not upset w the loss of oo per se. if sid is healthy, he would have been an unecessary luxury.

i am happy that we ended up w bras over golden...much more upside imho.

what is bothering me is that we only got one out of three recruits that we chased against mid majors.

we just should not be losing those recruiting battles.
 

Day2

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#2
well i am not upset w the loss of oo per se. if sid is healthy, he would have been an unecessary luxury.

i am happy that we ended up w bras over golden...much more upside imho.

what is bothering me is that we only got one out of three recruits that we chased against mid majors.

we just should not be losing those recruiting battles.
Perhaps the staff needs to work on selling the program to players who won’t get immediate time. Perhaps. Still, if the player is looking to play a lot or even start, there’s not much we can do.

How many times have we criticized players like Tucker who didn’t see the writing on the wall and wound up transferring? There’s a good chance that Golden and OO would have eventually transferred had they picked us.

I agree that we should win these battles, but it’s not a big deal. Plenty of fish in the sea.
 

newmexicuse

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#5
Perhaps the staff needs to work on selling the program to players who won’t get immediate time. Perhaps. Still, if the player is looking to play a lot or even start, there’s not much we can do.

How many times have we criticized players like Tucker who didn’t see the writing on the wall and wound up transferring? There’s a good chance that Golden and OO would have eventually transferred had they picked us.

I agree that we should win these battles, but it’s not a big deal. Plenty of fish in the sea.
pt is important to every recruit, but we have to do a better job in identifying kids who have the confidence to compete for pt. if a kid lacks the confidence to compete for pt, he is probably the wrong kid for our program. we just should not be losing recruits to mid majors.
 
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cliftonparksufan

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#7
pt is important to every recruit, but we have to do a better job in identifying kids who have the confidence to compete for pt. we just should not be losing recruits to mid majors.
Especially now coming off sanctions. I'm not arguing that some kids want to go to a St Bonaventure because he knows he can play as a frosh. That's going to happen, but we want kids that want to buy into the system.

Many "star" players barely played as freshman. Look at Michael Carter Williams. Just finished his 5th NBA season. Has made $13 million bucks and supposedly is very money savvy. Only played 269 minutes as a freshman.

Look at Dion Waiters. Just finished his 6th NBA season. Has made $32 million bucks and has three years remaining on his contract good for $36 million bucks. Only played 554 minutes as a freshman.
 
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#8
Any other diamonds in the ruff out there at the Center position besides Dimon Carrigan? It's unfathomable to me that we'd go into 2018 without any insurance at the center position given the health question marks of Sidibe. I can live with losing Osun IF we've got someone else in mind.
 

OrangeFoo

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#9
Especially now coming off sanctions. I'm not arguing that some kids want to go to a St Bonaventure because he knows he can play as a frosh. That's going to happen, but we want kids that want to buy into the system.

Many "star" players barely played as freshman. Look at Michael Carter Williams. Just finished his 5th NBA season. Has made $13 million bucks and supposedly is very money savvy. Only played 269 minutes as a freshman.

Look at Dion Waiters. Just finished his 6th NBA season. Has made $32 million bucks and has three years remaining on his contract good for $36 million bucks. Only played 554 minutes as a freshman.
Look at a coach who is known for a short bench, a short leash and who caters his system to stars. I said it earlier and I’ll say it again, if I was a marginal top 100 recruit I wouldn’t go to Syracuse any more than I would go to Duke or Kentucky. It’s the same as in football when we ask why a high three star would go to Alabama or FSU or other blue blood where they would get recruited over instead of to Syracuse where we offer playing time. And yes, Syracuse football is to Alabama as St. Bonaventure is to Syracuse hoops.
 

jdubs30

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#10
Perhaps the staff needs to work on selling the program to players who won’t get immediate time. Perhaps. Still, if the player is looking to play a lot or even start, there’s not much we can do.

How many times have we criticized players like Tucker who didn’t see the writing on the wall and wound up transferring? There’s a good chance that Golden and OO would have eventually transferred had they picked us.

I agree that we should win these battles, but it’s not a big deal. Plenty of fish in the sea.
Good point about Tucker actually. Many here , including me, said he'd get 30mpg here and wouldn't get off the bench at DUke, and we killed him for not seeing it. It's very likely like Osuni could start at SBU from day 1, meanwhile if he came to Cuse there was a good chance that he'd barely see the court as a freshman. That's a massive difference


pt is important to every recruit, but we have to do a better job in identifying kids who have the confidence to compete for pt. if a kid lacks the confidence to compete for pt, he is probably the wrong kid for our program. we just should not be losing recruits to mid majors.
I hate this notion. These kids are the top in the country at what they do - they are not scared of competition. They aren't dumb either, they look at the roster and see 2 players at his position who played well last year, OO probably does not have confidence issues, but PC and BS will get more opportunities from day 1. This also bringsme back to Tucker, who most likely though he'd get PT at Duke because he believed he wouldn't take a back seat to anyone.

Moral of the story is people choose their narrative based on the recruit, ignoring the fact that these kids are human beings who make decisions that are best for them and you can't view all of them in a vacuum. It's not that every kid gets a bag, or every kid lacks confidence, or every kid is scared of competition, or every kid would prefer a "mid-major". It's just every kid will do what's best for him - SBU, Duke and UK all sold kids on what they'd get at their programs. Just like we sold Braswell or Goodine or Jalen Carey. This is an inexact science. Darius Bazley chose Syracuse and Bryce Golden didn't - you cannot compare these kids.
 

hoopsupstate

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#11
2019 is a big year and we can’t say we are a lock for any of the players we are currently recruiting. We have Goodine in the fold, but I’m not confident that we can sign any of the higher recruited guys.
 

Trueblue25

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#12
well i am not upset w the loss of oo per se. if sid is healthy, he would have been an unecessary luxury.

i am happy that we ended up w bras over golden...much more upside imho.

what is bothering me is that we only got one out of three recruits that we chased against mid majors.

we just should not be losing those recruiting battles.
We have no idea how much opportunity/pt OO was promised by the staff, and we dont know how much of a chance we had in the first place with golden.

Bras was the only one we gave the full court press to and we got him fairly easily.
 

DeGrozz

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#13
if I was a marginal top 100 recruit I wouldn’t go to Syracuse any more than I would go to Duke or Kentucky.
I disagree completely.

Since 2010, these are our marginal top-100 recruits (I've used 70+ in the rankings, but gave their final # so you can dice the list how you'd like)

2010 - Baye Moussa Keita (146) and CJ Fair (81)
2011 - Trevor Cooney (105)
2012 - None
2013 - BJ Johnson (89), Ron Patterson (175), and Chinoso Obokoh (180)
2014 - None
2015 - Tyler Lydon (72) and Frank Howard (79)
2016 - Taurean Thompson (74)
2017 - Marek Dolezaj (111), O'Shea Brissett (137), Bourama Sidibe (189), and Howard Washington (289)

Besides the 2013 class that was the victim of our sanctions, I think that argument could be made that the program finds a ton of talent in that borderline top-100 and up area that fits the system very well and gives them a real chance to thrive.
 

two3zone

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#14
I disagree completely.

Since 2010, these are our marginal top-100 recruits (I've used 70+ in the rankings, but gave their final # so you can dice the list how you'd like)

2010 - Baye Moussa Keita (146) and CJ Fair (81)
2011 - Trevor Cooney (105)
2012 - None
2013 - BJ Johnson (89), Ron Patterson (175), and Chinoso Obokoh (180)
2014 - None
2015 - Tyler Lydon (72) and Frank Howard (79)
2016 - Taurean Thompson (74)
2017 - Marek Dolezaj (111), O'Shea Brissett (137), Bourama Sidibe (189), and Howard Washington (289)

Besides the 2013 class that was the victim of our sanctions, I think that argument could be made that the program finds a ton of talent in that borderline top-100 and up area that fits the system very well and gives them a real chance to thrive.
2013 wasn’t a victim of sanctions at all. Roberson and Ennis were in that class.
 

DeGrozz

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#15
2013 wasn’t a victim of sanctions at all. Roberson and Ennis were in that class.
I believe the reduction in scholarships played a significant role in those players transferring, which is why we really saw no production from that class (especially from BJ who really blossomed into a good college player). Maybe I am not remembering that correctly though.
 

two3zone

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#16
I believe the reduction in scholarships played a significant role in those players transferring, which is why we really saw no production from that class (especially from BJ who really blossomed into a good college player). Maybe I am not remembering that correctly though.
They left because they were never going to play.
 
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#19
I have to laugh at those throwing Tucker out there. You're proving my point. Duke was able to get Tucker even though we knew he wouldn't play early. We failed to get Golden or Osun who would have been in similar situations as freshmen. That's the issue.
 

cliftonparksufan

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#20
Yes, and I also realize he will never play a minute for us so it doesn't matter if he was the #1 ranked recruit
But, he was a signed recruit. For the sake of your argument, let's blame the coaches and the player equally on why he is not attending. But, he was a signed recruit.

What if we still add someone. How about if it's Tyus Battle. No one is expecting him to return. But what if he does. How much will that strenghten the roster.

And Sidibe. The kid hardly played. What if he is injury free. That's like having a new player.

There is a lot that can still happen but no reason to write everything off yet.
 

jdubs30

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#21
I have to laugh at those throwing Tucker out there. You're proving my point. Duke was able to get Tucker even though we knew he wouldn't play early. We failed to get Golden or Osun who would have been in similar situations as freshmen. That's the issue.
Think you're wrong here. I think Tucker went to Duke thinking he'd be the first guy off the bench, then Allen + 4 freshman would leave and he would play a major role in 2019 as well. There is no way Tucker thought he'd get 0 PT as a freshman - in fact, him leaving 3 months in proves that. If he was still in Durham I'd agree with you but the kid didn't make it to Christmas. He clearly thought he was going to play.
 

pfister1

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#22
pt is important to every recruit, but we have to do a better job in identifying kids who have the confidence to compete for pt. if a kid lacks the confidence to compete for pt, he is probably the wrong kid for our program. we just should not be losing recruits to mid majors.
Any chance that the highlighted statement and the underlined statement are contradictions?
 
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Capt. Tuttle

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#23
Look at a coach who is known for a short bench, a short leash and who caters his system to stars. I said it earlier and I’ll say it again, if I was a marginal top 100 recruit I wouldn’t go to Syracuse any more than I would go to Duke or Kentucky. It’s the same as in football when we ask why a high three star would go to Alabama or FSU or other blue blood where they would get recruited over instead of to Syracuse where we offer playing time. And yes, Syracuse football is to Alabama as St. Bonaventure is to Syracuse hoops.
I don't think SU FB is that close.
 
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#24
I have to laugh at those throwing Tucker out there. You're proving my point. Duke was able to get Tucker even though we knew he wouldn't play early. We failed to get Golden or Osun who would have been in similar situations as freshmen. That's the issue.
You're not thinking logically. Whether WE knew he wouldn't see early playing time at Duke is irrelevant. HE obviously thought he would see early playing time. Perhaps if Golden or Osun thought they would see significant playing time at SU they would have signed with us. Perhaps not. Either way, your point is not proven.

Also, you continue to ignore other factors that may have contributed to their decisions (such as Osun's relationship with the coach who left LaSalle for the Bonnies). You seem to think everybody, including recruits, value the exact same things you do.
 

SoBristol

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#25
N
.....

And Sidibe. The kid hardly played. What if he is injury free. That's like having a new player.

There is a lot that can still happen but no reason to write everything off yet.
Need to consider that this late recruiting effort started only when Bazley went g-league.

We can project a pretty solid rotation of 7 (two returning centers, two starting forwards, Howard & Carey at the guard spots, Hughes to swing between SG and SF). The late recruiting effort was to find spare parts -- one at forward (Braswell), and a reserve center -- who might slide in somewhere on the bench, joining Buddy and Washington. And who might emerge as contributors in 2019-20 and beyond. Not a normal cycle -- not going to worry.
 



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