A Lot of Unknowns With This Year's Team | Page 3 | Syracusefan.com

A Lot of Unknowns With This Year's Team

I like the optimism, but I think we are going to have trouble scoring. There is some young, green talent on this team, but we don't run a very sophisticated offense. We rely on guards who can beat their man off the dribble, and 3 point shooters to create space for driving lanes for the guards. Do we have those guys on this squad?

If you look at the backcourt, you've got Frank and Washington at the PG, and Geno Thorpe as a combo and Tyus Battle, who is going to be our go-to guy. Can Thorpe play the point well enough to unseat Frank and Washington, so that we have our two best scoring guards on the floor?

I think JB will try to play Frank and Washington at PG early in the season, and rotate Thorpe in and out. I don't trust Frank to be much more than a backup PG, but I think he's going to get first shot at winning the job. Washington sounds like a poor man's Tyler Ennis (i.e., a true PG). If Frank loses his starting spot, will he also lose his Shznit?

Turning to the front court, we have 2 unproven guys at Center - Chukwu and Sidibe. Chukwu, to me, looked so clumsy out there in the zone before he hurt his eye. I was very disappointed in his footwork and his movement. I was expecting a much more natural player. He seemed very mechanical. Unless he did a lot of drills to improve his footwork and slides in the middle of the zone, I don't think he's going to be a starting caliber player.

Sidibe, to me, has a lot of promise. He wasn't ranked as high as some big men in this class, but he played against several of them last year, both in the summer on the AAU circuit, and then in New Jersey, playing for a high level HS program at St. Benedicts. Whenever he played the highly rated kids, he really competed, and he got the best of several of them. He showed a good motor, and good skills scoring inside. To me, he looked like a poor man's Anthony Davis (the guy who used to play for the Pacers back in the 90s). I could definitely see him winning the starting job, although he is still awfully thin.

Turning to the forwards, again there is a lot of promise but so little experience. Starting with O'Shea Brissett, he looks like a prototype SU forward, in the C.J. Fair / Kris Joseph mold. Any kid who is named the best player in Canada has to be pretty good. I see him as our starting SF. But I wonder if he can hit the three against ACC defenders.

We really need him to, because if we don't have a forward who is a threat from outside, historically our offense turns to crap. Teams bunker in against us to cut off all our driving lanes, and challenge us to hit 3's. That's what I kind of see with this team. I don't think we have nearly enough outside shooting to keep teams honest and open up the floor for our athletes.

Next up is Matt Moyer, who is probably the nicest kid and the best representative of the program that you could ever hope for. When I looked at his film from prep school, he played in that good New England prep league for South Kent, I think it was. Previously, he had been player of the year in Ohio. He showed a really good motor around the rim, was a hard worker inside, and had a bit of a nasty streak (which seems out of place for what a nice kid he is). I don't recall him showing any real outside game, though. He reminded me a young Terrence Roberts. I think he will start at the four, and play in the high post on offense, with Sidibe in the low post.

I think those 2 guys might play well together, and could be our best inside "tandem". The only problem is that they both weigh only about 215, and are going to get pushed around on the defensive boards. We are going to have an awful time on the defensive boards this year. That means that we are not really going to have a fast break offense (again).

And then the wildcard is Marek Dolezaj. Despite all this one-and-done talk, I just don't see him starting. According to the official roster, he weighs about 30 pounds less than any of our already-too-skinny frontcourt players. He doesn't really have a 3 point shot at this level. His release point is too low, and he shoots it too flat. But, boy!, can he blow by people on the drive. But we lack the 3 point shooters for him to have the space to spread out a man-to-man defense, and then let him blow past his defender. His lack of weight contributes to his relative quickness for such a big guy, but if the other guys are going to struggle on the boards, Dolezaj is going to get killed. I just can't see him playing defense at this level.

So that's my pre-season synopsis on what I see. I think there are some interesting pieces here, but we need the following recruiting class to really turn this roster into something. Hopefully the only guy we lose is Battle, and really, I wouldn't mind if we wind up crappy and miss the NCAA tournament this year, if it meant that he came back to have a good run.

If we somehow kept Battle (yeah, I know, but guys from crappy teams seldom get drafted in the top half of the 1st round, and Battle does have that potential), then the 2018-19 team could be special. If Battle leaves, we will definitely need a high scoring 2G who is a dead eye from three.

We could have:

PG: Jalen Carey, Howard Washington
SG: Tyus Battle, Buddy Boeheim
SF: O'Shea Brissett, Marek Dolezaj
PF: Darius Bazley, Matt Moyer
C: Bourama Sidibe, Nate Roberts, Pascal Chukwu

Did you leave Elijah Hughes out for any reason or just as an oversight?
 
Kids always get drafted higher off winning teams. Really? I guess Fultz should have stayed another year and hoped his team could have had a winning record.
The things people come up with. :bat:
I was just getting caught up on this thread and was waiting for someone to point this example out. NBA scouts are not dumb. Individual talent trumps any winning record!

You're 100% right here. Fultz was on a terrible team on the West Coast, with very little exposure to the rest of the country and I think he ended up in a good spot!
 
I hope he has a huge chip on his shoulder and he proves everyone wrong. Bodes well for us either way. Nothing like watching a gritty hard working point guard who loves huge assist numbers, some 3 point shooting, and great defense. I am excited for him but if he doesn't play much this year he needs to keep his head up and start next year. Never stay down.

I’ve seen HW play in high school, albeit a few years ago and the EYBL 2 years ago. I just think that some on the board are expecting way too much of him. He is a smart player who plays under control but seldom tries to make a play on his own. I think he understands his limitations and does try to do too much because he knows he can’t which I consider a positive not a negative. After skimming these posts, calling him a great defender and athletic are a stretch.
 
I’ve seen HW play in high school, albeit a few years ago and the EYBL 2 years ago. I just think that some on the board are expecting way too much of him. He is a smart player who plays under control but seldom tries to make a play on his own. I think he understands his limitations and does try to do too much because he knows he can’t which I consider a positive not a negative. After skimming these posts, calling him a great defender and athletic are a stretch.

People said he's athletic?
 
He plays D1 basketball on a full scholarship for an ACC team - he's gotta have some athletic ability.

I agree. It's just not what I'd list as a strength.
 
People said he's athletic?
See below, the way I read it is that Cuse gets athletes and we got HW.

I totally agree that Washington is Ennis like!( I also agree with your post). He seems to put his team first and figuring out how to get others involved. That becomes infectious. One thing about Cuse is we always get athletes. Being athletic gets you far. Being an unselfish athlete wins titles The demeanor of the team is its point guard. Thorpe is similar. Frank explodes, life is great.Frank implodes, it could be ok if notbetter I love a team with players out to prove something and underestimated( tip of the hat to you iommi)
 
Kids always get drafted higher off winning teams. Really? I guess Fultz should have stayed another year and hoped his team could have had a winning record.
The things people come up with. :bat:

I can give you a dozen examples of guys going higher than they should have because of a hot streak in the tournament.
 
I can give you a dozen examples of guys going higher than they should have because of a hot streak in the tournament.

And for every one you name I can name 20 that did well during the combine and shot up or had successful regular seasons.
 
I can give you a dozen examples of guys going higher than they should have because of a hot streak in the tournament.

No you can't, because they don't exist. You presume they went higher, because you don't know how teams (not Chad Ford, et al) had them rated prior to the tournament and prior to workouts.

What matters are the workouts, and the body of work from senior year of high school through college.



A GM would be an idiot to pick a kid because he got hot for a few games. Lots of people can get hot. 3-6 games is not a good sample size to use when projecting for an 82-98 game season.

If only the NCAA tournament mattered, GMAC's 43 points ought to have gotten him drafted, not to mention his championship run.
Shouldn't Melo have gone #1, or at least #2, based upon his championship run?
If only the NCAA tournament mattered, why are guys brought in for workouts after the tournament?
John Wallace went at the same place in the first round after the final four as he was projected to go in his junior year. His tournament made no difference in where he was drafted. None.
 
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See below, the way I read it is that Cuse gets athletes and we got HW.

I totally agree that Washington is Ennis like!( I also agree with your post). He seems to put his team first and figuring out how to get others involved. That becomes infectious. One thing about Cuse is we always get athletes. Being athletic gets you far. Being an unselfish athlete wins titles The demeanor of the team is its point guard. Thorpe is similar. Frank explodes, life is great.Frank implodes, it could be ok if notbetter I love a team with players out to prove something and underestimated( tip of the hat to you iommi)

Basketball guards are not athletic? Looks coordinated and athletic to me. You watch his film? No one said super freak. Splitting hairs a bit maybe
 
You left him out of your possible lineup for next year.

Yeah, I guess people are looking at him as the next starting 2G, but boy he was not impressive at East Carolina.
Sure, people are building him up based on pre-season workouts, but over the years, we've heard that about Frank Howard, Josh Wright, Kaleb Joseph, Ethan Cole and a lot of other guys.
 
No you can't, because they don't exist. You presume they went higher, because you don't know how teams (not Chad Ford, et al) had them rated prior to the tournament and prior to workouts.

What matters are the workouts, and the body of work from senior year of high school through college.



A GM would be an idiot to pick a kid because he got hot for a few games. Lots of people can get hot. 3-6 games is not a good sample size to use when projecting for an 82-98 game season.

If only the NCAA tournament mattered, GMAC's 43 points ought to have gotten him drafted, not to mention his championship run.
Shouldn't Melo have gone #1, or at least #2, based upon his championship run?
If only the NCAA tournament mattered, why are guys brought in for workouts after the tournament?
John Wallace went at the same place in the first round after the final four as he was projected to go in his junior year. His tournament made no difference in where he was drafted. None.


Right off the top of my head, there was a freshman PF at UNC, one of the years they won the title, Marvin Williams, I think it was. He wasn't even a starter, but he was bouncy and he was a freshman, and he wound up going I think 2nd in the draft. That should be a franchise player. He's still in the NBA, I think, but he's just a journeyman.

People could say the same thing about Dion, or Jonny Flynn. Those teams got so much publicity (Flynn for the 7 OT game), and Flynn was the #6 pick and Dion #4. Were they really that good, or did some big time TV games sway the opinion of the sports media, draft projections and ultimately NBA GMs? Wes Johnson, where did he go again? 6th overall? And that's just our team.

Pervis Ellison. Never Nervous Pervis went after Louisville won the NCAA his freshman year. He went #1 overall. Don't you think the hype of winning the NCAA had a lot to do with that? And what about Malachi? Was he really that good a prospect, or did the Virginia game change some people's minds? Remember, it only takes 1 GM for you to get drafted.
 
Yeah, I guess people are looking at him as the next starting 2G, but boy he was not impressive at East Carolina.
Sure, people are building him up based on pre-season workouts, but over the years, we've heard that about Frank Howard, Josh Wright, Kaleb Joseph, Ethan Cole and a lot of other guys.

Buss Patterson, Tyler Roberson, BJ Johnson, Trevor Cooney, then probably about 15 more the past decade.
 
Right off the top of my head, there was a freshman PF at UNC, one of the years they won the title, Marvin Williams, I think it was. He wasn't even a starter, but he was bouncy and he was a freshman, and he wound up going I think 2nd in the draft. That should be a franchise player. He's still in the NBA, I think, but he's just a journeyman.

People could say the same thing about Dion, or Jonny Flynn. Those teams got so much publicity (Flynn for the 7 OT game), and Flynn was the #6 pick and Dion #4. Were they really that good, or did some big time TV games sway the opinion of the sports media, draft projections and ultimately NBA GMs? Wes Johnson, where did he go again? 6th overall? And that's just our team.

Pervis Ellison. Never Nervous Pervis went after Louisville won the NCAA his freshman year. He went #1 overall. Don't you think the hype of winning the NCAA had a lot to do with that? And what about Malachi? Was he really that good a prospect, or did the Virginia game change some people's minds? Remember, it only takes 1 GM for you to get drafted.
That just brings them to the public's attention, not the NBA's. Your position that the NBA invests millions in kids based upon the NCAA tourney is wrong
 
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That just brings them to the public's attention, not the NBA's. Your position that the NBA invests millions in kids based upon the NCAA tourney is weong

You're entitled to your opinion. You may think mine is wrong, but it's accurate. College coaches do the same thing, and base much of their recruiting on how kids do head-to-head at these AAU showcase events. NCAA players who blow up in the tournament often see their draft stock rise. I don't see how you can debate this, really.

Michael Kidd-Gilchrist went 2nd in the 2012 NBA draft, off the strength of Kentucky's national championship.

Kemba Walker went ahead of Klay Thompson and Kawhi Leonard in the 2011 draft. Do you think UConn's national championship had anything to do with a little guard like him being drafted so high?

Do you think Frank Kaminsky was helped by Wisconsin making the Final Four his junior and senior year? He's a 7 footer in the NBA who only averages 4 rebounds a game and shoots 40% from the floor. For a big man. He was a top 1o pick.

Did the 2013 Final Four appearance push Trey Burke into a top 10 pick, or MCW to 11th? MCW can't really shoot. Should he have gone so high?

I could keep going, but I have work to do right now.
 
You're entitled to your opinion. You may think mine is wrong, but it's accurate. College coaches do the same thing, and base much of their recruiting on how kids do head-to-head at these AAU showcase events. NCAA players who blow up in the tournament often see their draft stock rise. I don't see how you can debate this, really.

Michael Kidd-Gilchrist went 2nd in the 2012 NBA draft, off the strength of Kentucky's national championship.

Kemba Walker went ahead of Klay Thompson and Kawhi Leonard in the 2011 draft. Do you think UConn's national championship had anything to do with a little guard like him being drafted so high?

Do you think Frank Kaminsky was helped by Wisconsin making the Final Four his junior and senior year? He's a 7 footer in the NBA who only averages 4 rebounds a game and shoots 40% from the floor. For a big man. He was a top 1o pick.

Did the 2013 Final Four appearance push Trey Burke into a top 10 pick, or MCW to 11th? MCW can't really shoot. Should he have gone so high?

I could keep going, but I have work to do right now.

Very good post with solid examples. Kemba prime prime example
 
Very good post with solid examples. Kemba prime prime example

Ok. So you are saying the teams that drafted them never scouted any of their other games, never talked to their coaches, never watched film and never had them in for workouts.
That based upon an NCAA tournament, they got drafted in the first round?
In your world, the tourney MOP would be picked first, followed by the regional MOPs. Wow. Why even pay scouts and GMs. The owners could just watch the tournament and decide who to draft.
That position is so illogical and beyond comprehension, that I just can't fight it anymore.
guy-talking-to-brick-wall.jpg
 
Ok. So you are saying the teams that drafted them never scouted any of their other games, never talked to their coaches, never watched film and never had them in for workouts.
That based upon an NCAA tournament, they got drafted in the first round?
In your world, the tourney MOP would be picked first, followed by the regional MOPs. Wow. Why even pay scouts and GMs. The owners could just watch the tournament and decide who to draft.
That position is so illogical and beyond comprehension, that I just can't fight it anymore.
View attachment 110848

Merely stating an opinion that his performance in the NCAA tourney elevated his stock to a much higher level . They knew of him of course.
 
Very good post with solid examples. Kemba prime prime example

Kemba walker averages 20 points a game in the NBA and averaged 23 points a game his junior year in college while showing beyond elite speed at the point guard position.

Please tell me how he's a prime prime example. That is 100% false.
 

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