Class of 2017 A smidge surprised we haven’t

[JrodCuse]

I agree whitey, but you can't just look at recruiting without looking at everything else. It's hard to get "big time" recruits (high 3* and up) to come to a down program that is lagging behind the competition in several key sectors. Having lots of hall of famers and all time winning pct and being a top 10 all time program is awesome for us as fans and the university, but doesn't move the needle much for kids who are 16-17. Gotta control the controllables and that's our facilities, coaches and offensive identity. We've fixed all of those on paper, so now we should start truly seeing an uptick in recruiting over the next 2-5 years as barbers becomes an established coach at SU and can point to a history beyond D2 and MAC programs.

 

[TheCusian]

It's obvious we need to recruit at a higher level. Rankings are fallible but there is something to recruiting kids with offers from other programs both at our level and above. Looking for diamonds in the rough is what got us where we are.

That's not the point.

1. Baber's system on O will get us W's and hopefully more crowd support. That will get us better recruits.

2. We've beaten tons of schools at our level and snagged a few from above with Shafer and late recruiting season with Babers.

3. Dungey was a diamond in the rough. Losing got us to where we are.

 

[Cusefan69]

Just my opinion folks but it's only April...lots of time...this is not a sprint...let's see where things stand in November/December...plenty of time to reel in players and steal them from others once they see the high octane offense perform better then people probably think with the better weapons Baber did not think he probably had going in...I think we give teams some headaches this year...

 

[rackman18]

It may be be a weird time to bring this up but does anyone know much about out DC Coach Ward? Im sorry but I'm not seeing or hearing a lot about him from recruits or any one else. I know I watched his Defense in their last bowl game and they couldn't stop Georgia Southern if they had a bulldozer. I also check out their schedule from last year and the offense did well , but some of those scores were not much of a Defensive gem. We are going to have to score a bunch if we are to win game with his defense. Just saying.

 

[rrlbees]

It may be be a weird time to bring this up but does anyone know much about out DC Coach Ward? Im sorry but I'm not seeing or hearing a lot about him from recruits or any one else. I know I watched his Defense in their last bowl game and they couldn't stop Georgia Southern if they had a bulldozer. I also check out their schedule from last year and the offense did well , but some of those scores were not much of a Defensive gem. We are going to have to score a bunch if we are to win game with his defense. Just saying.

It's my biggest worry for this team and I've said that before.

 

[PhatOrange]

DC and Defensive plan of the Tampa 2 are my biggest worry. But that's a discussion for the football board.

 

[TheCusian]

It may be be a weird time to bring this up but does anyone know much about out DC Coach Ward? Im sorry but I'm not seeing or hearing a lot about him from recruits or any one else. I know I watched his Defense in their last bowl game and they couldn't stop Georgia Southern if they had a bulldozer. I also check out their schedule from last year and the offense did well , but some of those scores were not much of a Defensive gem. We are going to have to score a bunch if we are to win game with his defense. Just saying.

The guy was recognized as one of the best young coaches nationally in 2009. I think we should afford him space to get the job done before we worry too much. Hasn't coached a down here. Had one season to implement his system at BGSU and they improved.

I don't think this has sunk in yet... But we're going to score a bunch anyways. We're giving the other team lots of extra opportunities due to how fast we'll play on O. They'll be taking chances because they'll know they have to keep up (or that no lead is safe). It would be the same story if Shafer was DC.

That's why BGSU D's stats don't look as good as teams that play it safe and slow (like a lot of our teams in the past). Just think how much worse our D from last year would look if we gave the other team 4-5 more possessions!?

 

[PAcuse]

The days of having a top 25 Defense are long gone. It will be replaced with a top 10 offense sooner then later. The defense will go through some growing pains and it might look bad giving up 35 plus a game, but when your offense scores 40 plus a game does it really matter?

 

[kcsu]

It is a rare bird in college or pro football that has both a great O and D. I think that Ward has the chops to do what needs to be done. The fact that Dino trust him is enough for me.

 

[orangefog]

It is a rare bird in college or pro football that has both a great O and D. I think that Ward has the chops to do what needs to be done. The fact that Dino trust him is enough for me.

Agreed, these guys are about winning.

 

[Orijinal]

uh, winning.

 

[Whitey23]

That's not the point.

1. Baber's system on O will get us W's and hopefully more crowd support. That will get us better recruits.

2. We've beaten tons of schools at our level and snagged a few from above with Shafer and late recruiting season with Babers.

3. Dungey was a diamond in the rough. Losing got us to where we are.

Whats not the point? I was referring to the fact that I don't think focusing on unranked kids without offers is a successful strategy.

 

[TheCusian]

Whats not the point? I was referring to the fact that I don't think focusing on unranked kids without offers is a successful strategy.

That talent is the issue isn't in question. How to improve on the field with the talent we have is the point. Babers and his offense is how we leverage the talent we have to get the talent we need.

That's the point.

 

[bnoro]

It may be be a weird time to bring this up but does anyone know much about out DC Coach Ward? Im sorry but I'm not seeing or hearing a lot about him from recruits or any one else. I know I watched his Defense in their last bowl game and they couldn't stop Georgia Southern if they had a bulldozer. I also check out their schedule from last year and the offense did well , but some of those scores were not much of a Defensive gem. We are going to have to score a bunch if we are to win game with his defense. Just saying.

They played their bowl game without Dino as HC and Ward was acting HC rather than DC. The bowl game was not an accurate representation.

Our defense was atrocious last year. It can't be worse this season.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

The days of having a top 25 Defense are long gone. It will be replaced with a top 10 offense sooner then later. The defense will go through some growing pains and it might look bad giving up 35 plus a game, but when your offense scores 40 plus a game does it really matter?

No it doesn't matter, I agree and some still want to fight this, IMO. and when we had a good defense and our offense was scoring 17 a game and losing, that sucks too. The goal is to win games regardless of what the score is. The problem is in today's game, your odds are much better with a great offense/ bad defense than vice versa. That said, if we can get the defense to around average, look out in 2-3 years. Look out

 

[TheCusian]

No it doesn't matter, I agree and some still want to fight this, IMO. and when we had a good defense and our offense was scoring 17 a game and losing, that sucks too. The goal is to win games regardless of what the score is. The problem is in today's game, your odds are much better with a great offense/ bad defense than vice versa. That said, if we can get the defense to around average, look out in 2-3 years. Look out

Yards per play on defense will help folks understand how good it actually is. National rankings should be thrown out or at least taken with a grain of salt.

 

[jr4750]

Dino Babers has made Syracuse football more fun to follow. I am not expecting 4 * recruits to be committing before we win. A lot of these peer schools have more recruits in their backyards which are easier to recruit.

I don't want kids to commit just to commit. I don't mind waiting till late to recruit these unranked kids with no major offers. Our new staff has me giddy and recruiting will take care of itself.

agreed. I look at Duke an are astonished at their recruiting given their relative recent success. They are pulling kids from all over, certainly due to the Duke name and pedigree, and most are high 3/4 star caliber. No reason we can't be a lot more like them then BC/Rutgers if we start to win games and score points.

 

[SUFan44]

Faith is belief without evidence. I learned that a few months ago.

Some here should try it! I'm willing to.

I think our defense up the middle on the first two levels could be pretty decent (Clark/Samuels/Franklin). It's the edges and the secondary that is the biggest concern in my mind.

But when you recruit the players with the body types that we currently have in those positions, it's going to be tough to go against bigger, faster offenses.

I truly believe in 2-3 years we will be fine on both sides of the ball. We may give up more points than we did during the Shafer DC years, but we'll also be kicking the ball off to opponents much more often, too.

 

[rrlbees]

No it doesn't matter, I agree and some still want to fight this, IMO. and when we had a good defense and our offense was scoring 17 a game and losing, that sucks too. The goal is to win games regardless of what the score is. The problem is in today's game, your odds are much better with a great offense/ bad defense than vice versa. That said, if we can get the defense to around average, look out in 2-3 years. Look out

Tis more important to have a great offense vs a great defense. But that doesn't have to mean neglect defense. To really be a very good program we still have to play good defense. Winning 45-42 only lasts so long. We know with the fast high powered offense we'll score quicker thus the other team will get more possessions too. So looking at stats like yards per game or points per game will be deceiving. So I'll be following things like yards per play. I just don't see why some here think just because we might have a great offense we should accept bad defense. You can't be great at both because where recruits/athletes are placed plays a big role, but we can be adequate on defense with a good system and good coaching.

 

[TheCusian]

Tis more important to have a great offense vs a great defense. But that doesn't have to mean neglect defense. To really be a very good program we still have to play good defense. Winning 45-42 only lasts so long. We know with the fast high powered offense we'll score quicker thus the other team will get more possessions too. So looking at stats like yards per game or points per game will be deceiving. So I'll be following things like yards per play. I just don't see why some here think just because we might have a great offense we should accept bad defense. You can't be great at both because where recruits/athletes are placed plays a big role, but we can be adequate on defense with a good system and good coaching.

Agree 100%. I don't think we need to accept bad defense so much as we need to understand that the tools we use to measure it should be switched from yards per game/points per game to YPP.

I do believe that deferring to your offense's pace can put your defense at an advantage - and - that is the best way to build a team up in our scenario.

 

[SUFan44]

Tis more important to have a great offense vs a great defense. But that doesn't have to mean neglect defense. To really be a very good program we still have to play good defense. Winning 45-42 only lasts so long. We know with the fast high powered offense we'll score quicker thus the other team will get more possessions too. So looking at stats like yards per game or points per game will be deceiving. So I'll be following things like yards per play. I just don't see why some here think just because we might have a great offense we should accept bad defense. You can't be great at both because where recruits/athletes are placed plays a big role, but we can be adequate on defense with a good system and good coaching.

I also think it's going to be unfair to strictly judge the DC on the next two years - the cupboard isn't exactly stocked with enough defensive talent to build an adequate defense.

 

[Sudano]

I also think it's going to be unfair to strictly judge the DC on the next two years - the cupboard isn't exactly stocked with enough defensive talent to build an adequate defense.

We can also blame Q.Sheppard and A.Ealey. They would have helped immensely as outside rushers. We're solid at DT and decent at LB but DE is bare.

 

[AAM62]

We can also blame Q.Sheppard and A.Early. They would have helped immensely as outside rushers. We're solid at DT and decent at LB but DE is bare.

#Early

 

[Sudano]

#Early

Ealey

 

[rackman18]

DE, We may not be as desperate as it was a few months back. Ruff, Pickard, Sherrod, Plus thes new 2016 kids, Josh Black 6'-5" @265 , Jaquwan Nelson, Kendall Coleman, and maybe Mckinley Williams. I'm sure a couple may be able to help out some. They just need more experience and get in shape.