Are we done with adding players for 2024-25?

[kcsu]

I think he’s a great defender outside of 8’ and at least adequate inside 8’ on most forwards. I don’t disagree that he couldn’t handle the bigger stronger post guys in close. I honestly can’t remember which post or posts triggered what you quoted. I read a bunch of posts and felt like one or two of them was saying minus his steals and deflections he’s not a good defender.

Brown is the classic tweener. If he was 3 to 4 inches taller he would be a star. He did his best given his limitations. I only see him starting on a team that needs a Rodman type player. Hustle, good bball IQ, rebound and defend. Unfortunately his offensive game is extremely limited.
Great role player. Sucks to lose him but he's not starting material on our roster as it's shaping up.

 

[atlanticuse]

Brown is the classic tweener. If he was 3 to 4 inches taller he would be a star. He did his best given his limitations. I only see him starting on a team that needs a Rodman type player. Hustle, good bball IQ, rebound and defend. Unfortunately his offensive game is extremely limited.
Great role player. Sucks to lose him but he's not starting material on our roster as it's shaping up.

if I were 3-4 inches taller I'd be a star.

 

[Consigliere]

I think he’s a great defender outside of 8’ and at least adequate inside 8’ on most forwards. I don’t disagree that he couldn’t handle the bigger stronger post guys in close. I honestly can’t remember which post or posts triggered what you quoted. I read a bunch of posts and felt like one or two of them was saying minus his steals and deflections he’s not a good defender.

Basically I was disputing a post that felt we would be much worse overall defensively next year. I felt that Maliq’s defensive accolades were largely due to his incredibly quick hands and high number of steals but our interior defense was abysmal. And it was just bigs that we struggled with. Opponents had free rein driving to the basket once they got by our guards.
Loved what Brown brought to the team. I will miss him. But to think we will be worse defensively than a team that gave up 79 ppg in conference, well over 80 the last six weeks, primarily because he left doesn’t work for me.

 

[Sbucketball]

Say we're done adding transfers or starting caliber transfers. Who starts: Carlos or Westry?

 

[billsin01]

eh

you couldnt pass the ball to brown in the post and get bucket...he scored when he was already open. did he ever do a post move? did he ever score 1 on 1 face up? off the dribble?

did he ever shoot a jump shot? a 10 footer? very occasionally

i mean these are all PRIME methods of scoring for a big ...and brown did none of them!


most of his points he dunked or shot an occasional wide open 3

you couldnt run the offense through him but he did get the occasional assist...he was no facilitator...lets stop the exaggeration...

he was part of the reason the offense was iso based...limited with what he could do with the ball...very easy to guard for a team with good bigs. he didnt stop the ball because he couldnt do much with it when he got it. it wasnt some decision he made. he wisely knew this but that understanding of his own limitation is not soemthig to sing about.

he didnt take shots ...he didnt assert himself...i think he couldve done more but he deferred. very passive on offense ...which was a liability not an asset.

the offense will be so much better without the ball stoppers. just wait.

So this is an interesting discussion because we clearly view Brown through two very different lenses. I don't really disagree with much of what you point out. The only quibble I have is that he absolutely was a facilitator when our offense was clicking in Feb/early March. He averaged 3.0 assists/game from Feb. on (11 games) and we ran a lot of high-ball screen, short roll action in that stretch. He wasn't a point forward, per se, but that's not an occasional assist. We rarely have 2-guards who average that many assists (JJ would kill for those numbers, for example).

The only other point I'd make is that you don't average 10 ppg on dunks/layups unless you are getting to good spots. It's not simply standing there and putting the ball in the basket now and then.

That said, I get what you're saying about generating his own offense. The question of whether he is capable of that or not is moot, since he's no longer here, but you are right -- very few jumpers, no low-post scoring, no face-up scoring.

But, Brown did so many other things on the floor. His usage rate was miniscule and his fg attempts were paltry, yet he still produced points and assists. He was a really tough defender all year, he was tough on the glass and even if you don't love the advanced metrics, he graded out high on all of them. I also believe he has the ability and work ethic to improve. He had not hit his ceiling as a player.

So, I doubt we're going to land in the same place on how we view Brown, but replacing him is going to be difficult. And, important to note here, all those things you say Brown couldn't do, are things players do when the stop the ball. Iso scoring, post-up offense, bigs with face-up games -- those aren't cuts, screens, rim runs, transition, rolls, passing, etc. So you're saying our offense will be great without ball stoppers, but the guy who never stopped the ball but managed to produce anyway is the guy you don't care about losing? Just not sure i see the logic there.

 

[billsin01]

Basically I was disputing a post that felt we would be much worse overall defensively next year. I felt that Maliq’s defensive accolades were largely due to his incredibly quick hands and high number of steals but our interior defense was abysmal. And it was just bigs that we struggled with. Opponents had free rein driving to the basket once they got by our guards.
Loved what Brown brought to the team. I will miss him. But to think we will be worse defensively than a team that gave up 79 ppg in conference, well over 80 the last six weeks, primarily because he left doesn’t work for me.

The elephant in the room here is defensive system and structure as well as who replaces Brown. For the Brown piece of things, losing a good defender won't help a bad defense be any better. So if his minutes go to McLeod and Lampkin -- sure there's a good chance we're a bit tougher and bigger inside, but how do we defend in switches on the perimeter? My guess is there's a chance that's a mess.

As far as the system, we spent a good 1/2 the season struggling to figure out how to defend a high ball screen, which is the basic staple of about 99% of college offenses. We weren't great with help as it was, but when someone did help, we struggled with secondary slides. We had guards chasing plays from behind far too often when an opposing guard curled off a screen on the wing (god help us if a team also had a screen ready at the top of the key. If that happened the challenge for the opponent was deciding whether to take the wide open three or the wide open layup.).

I thought Red might go out and try to find longish athletes and build an identity as a disruptive M2M team. We didn't do that. That's fine, but with the potential of Bell, Lampkin and Starling playing big minutes ... I certainly hope our defensive approach is adjusted significantly. Otherwise, yes there's a chance we could actually be worse defensively.

 

[billsin01]

Judah and Copeland were probably the most skilled. Unfortunately, they were also the most uncoachable. So while you can say it’s hard to replace talent, you can make it up in other ways.

If you could get 100% out of their abilities, they would be tough to replace, but given their net total…not all that hard to replace.

I always respect your hoops take but I don't know that I'm on board with this one. Judah's inconsistent defensive effort and overdribbling was an issue (the overdribbling moreso in the first half of the year). But, at the end of the day, Judah carried a brutal offensive group for long stretches early (he played a ton of minutes early with Taylor/McLeod/JJ when he was struggling), still wound up with an OK assist number, didn't turn the ball over a lot, and I thought played pretty well offensively when we started to score in bunches in Feb. Even defensively, when he decided to play, he was pretty good.

Q may have been a lockerroom/off-court problem, I get it. But the dude had to be fun to play with. Every time he stepped onto the floor our energy and activity improved and our offense flowed better. Yeah, turnovers and undisciplined play for sure, but that's a lot of creativity and energy to replace.

I hope the collective is more cohesive and that yields good things. Don't think that's impossible, but I struggle to quite see how that's going to happen at the moment outside of a major splash from one or both of Freeman or Westry.

 

[orangejunkie]

Interesting discussion. Not sure how our defense will play out but as always with the Orange, I start the season optimistically. I don't think we'll be bullied inside like we've been in recent years. We haven't had a center like Lamkin since Arinze Onuaku.

I do think the offense will be better. Having a low post presence that guards can dump the ball to, which is likely to draw double teams, will likely open things up for our 3 point shooters. We haven't had that kind of post up threat for awhile, Lampkin may not be a shot blocking threat but his nimble footwork in the paint is impressive. It will be fun to see that part of our offense evolve during the season.

 

[Orangezoo]

The elephant in the room here is defensive system and structure as well as who replaces Brown. For the Brown piece of things, losing a good defender won't help a bad defense be any better. So if his minutes go to McLeod and Lampkin -- sure there's a good chance we're a bit tougher and bigger inside, but how do we defend in switches on the perimeter? My guess is there's a chance that's a mess.

As far as the system, we spent a good 1/2 the season struggling to figure out how to defend a high ball screen, which is the basic staple of about 99% of college offenses. We weren't great with help as it was, but when someone did help, we struggled with secondary slides. We had guards chasing plays from behind far too often when an opposing guard curled off a screen on the wing (god help us if a team also had a screen ready at the top of the key. If that happened the challenge for the opponent was deciding whether to take the wide open three or the wide open layup.).

I thought Red might go out and try to find longish athletes and build an identity as a disruptive M2M team. We didn't do that. That's fine, but with the potential of Bell, Lampkin and Starling playing big minutes ... I certainly hope our defensive approach is adjusted significantly. Otherwise, yes there's a chance we could actually be worse defensively.

The guard mtm play was bad across the board outside of occasional good stretches from Judah and Quadir and then mostly good from Cuffe.

Judah gambled or let his man get by him as early as half court, Quadir let guys drive him into the paint constantly backing off the defender and JJ had similar struggles to both above. Positioning was poor before trying to properly handle the high ball screens. The entire backcourt struggled with getting back in transition on D whether due to getting too deep, Judah falling or someone yapping at the refs. Good points on the X’s and O’s but the basics around defensive discipline were a problem last year and that makes it really hard to deploy any defensive philosophy.

All that before we even begin to talk about rebounding issues. So I think we have to be level on the combination of factors at play. Next year rebounding should be in a much better spot, and hopefully commitment to the defensive philosophy along with not abandoning the fundamentals will help the cause a great deal. It’s an unknown for certain - a guy like Westry is a major bump for the defense and McLeod if healthy for stretches and matchups would be too.

A lot has to improve but individual performance of players that have moved on in the backcourt certainly made the defense weaker than it should have been.

 

[CardiacCuse]

So this is an interesting discussion because we clearly view Brown through two very different lenses. I don't really disagree with much of what you point out. The only quibble I have is that he absolutely was a facilitator when our offense was clicking in Feb/early March. He averaged 3.0 assists/game from Feb. on (11 games) and we ran a lot of high-ball screen, short roll action in that stretch. He wasn't a point forward, per se, but that's not an occasional assist. We rarely have 2-guards who average that many assists (JJ would kill for those numbers, for example).

The only other point I'd make is that you don't average 10 ppg on dunks/layups unless you are getting to good spots. It's not simply standing there and putting the ball in the basket now and then.

That said, I get what you're saying about generating his own offense. The question of whether he is capable of that or not is moot, since he's no longer here, but you are right -- very few jumpers, no low-post scoring, no face-up scoring.

But, Brown did so many other things on the floor. His usage rate was miniscule and his fg attempts were paltry, yet he still produced points and assists. He was a really tough defender all year, he was tough on the glass and even if you don't love the advanced metrics, he graded out high on all of them. I also believe he has the ability and work ethic to improve. He had not hit his ceiling as a player.

So, I doubt we're going to land in the same place on how we view Brown, but replacing him is going to be difficult. And, important to note here, all those things you say Brown couldn't do, are things players do when the stop the ball. Iso scoring, post-up offense, bigs with face-up games -- those aren't cuts, screens, rim runs, transition, rolls, passing, etc. So you're saying our offense will be great without ball stoppers, but the guy who never stopped the ball but managed to produce anyway is the guy you don't care about losing? Just not sure i see the logic there.

losing brown hurts...didnt want to lose him.

the thought of him going to duke to be a bench utility big instead of the exact same role at syracuse is nauseating.

having a BACKUP big who can do what he did to fill out the roster would be great, imo

i just see him for what he is - a tweener...not a center...not an offensive threat on offense...a defensive power forward...who can finish when open but cant do much when guarded. who also got abused by quite a few bigs in ACC despite also being great at deflections, steals, etc...clemson va tech, lousiville duke unc all had their way down low on brown's watch ...but people are just conveniently forgetting that for whatver reason...baffles me

he did get a bit better at passing the ball...there were games in feb march where he had some good passing BUT he simply isnt a player that can facilitate offense from the post.

clemson ABUSED him SO badly in a MUST WIN game...last game of the season. i mean, I dont want to hate on him...but I just think we need to look at him for what he is...and not overglorify what he did and was capable of.

I start both freeman and lmapkin over him. now if freeman shows to not be ready ...then I would reconsider, and start brown...

BUT...

and this is MY MAIN point

im so tired of the profiles of players that JB sought out...

bigs who can barely do anything on offense...can barely dribble pass etc..incapable on offense...who were guided to just hustle play d and stay near the hoop...paired with ball dominant iso guards...I hate that style of roster and the basketball it breeds

i hate watching offense by syracuse when they have 3 players that can do anything with the ball on offense...and watching how good teams clamp down those 3 players accordingly and the entrie offense grinds to a halt

now brown...was a bit better than incompetent on offense...but only slightly so

i hear your point about iso moves and having them creates waht I complained about but IMPORTANTLY it is about what the defense can do scheme wise - same way having a shooter gives space...having a big that can finish when guarded opens up everything on offense for the guards etc...

judging on reds portal add...i think he sees the same

hes picked up 3 good passers - he will have a team next year that can pass the ball

all 3 portal adds can pass assist and score...all 3 averaged double digit scoring last year, too

I MUCh prefer this approach.

im tired of the chukwus and taylors of the world who literally cannot do anything with the ball and hide in the offense etc

soooo tired of watching the orange try to play 3 or 4 on 5 on offense

brown is not quite that - but like I said ...I think people are inflating his skillset and abilities now that he left.


i expect him to be a defensive sub forward next year for duke...and I think its actually kinda silly of him to want that for himself but to each his own

and with that said...I want the coaches to add a defensive big that can do a lot of what brown did...and newsflash...it wont be hard to find someone like that (maybe not quite as good...but no matter)

the percentage of bigs who can play defense is much higher than the percentage who can play offense...so replacing a defensive big isnt really that serious of an issue, imo

 

[baggerbob]

Interesting discussion. Not sure how our defense will play out but as always with the Orange, I start the season optimistically. I don't think we'll be bullied inside like we've been in recent years. We haven't had a center like Lamkin since Arinze Onuaku.

I do think the offense will be better. Having a low post presence that guards can dump the ball to, which is likely to draw double teams, will likely open things up for our 3 point shooters. We haven't had that kind of post up threat for awhile, Lampkin may not be a shot blocking threat but his nimble footwork in the paint is impressive. It will be fun to see that part of our offense evolve during the season.

We haven't had a 6-10 player who can score inside out in a while, and Freeman gives us a shot at that.
If he can beat his man off the dribble a few times, it will open up the floor for everyone.

 

[billsin01]

losing brown hurts...didnt want to lose him.

the thought of him going to duke to be a bench utility big instead of the exact same role at syracuse is nauseating.

having a BACKUP big who can do what he did to fill out the roster would be great, imo

i just see him for what he is - a tweener...not a center...not an offensive threat on offense...a defensive power forward...who can finish when open but cant do much when guarded. who also got abused by quite a few bigs in ACC despite also being great at deflections, steals, etc...clemson va tech, lousiville duke unc all had their way down low on brown's watch ...but people are just conveniently forgetting that for whatver reason...baffles me

he did get a bit better at passing the ball...there were games in feb march where he had some good passing BUT he simply isnt a player that can facilitate offense from the post.

clemson ABUSED him SO badly in a MUST WIN game...last game of the season. i mean, I dont want to hate on him...but I just think we need to look at him for what he is...and not overglorify what he did and was capable of.

I start both freeman and lmapkin over him. now if freeman shows to not be ready ...then I would reconsider, and start brown...

BUT...

and this is MY MAIN point

im so tired of the profiles of players that JB sought out...

bigs who can barely do anything on offense...can barely dribble pass etc..incapable on offense...who were guided to just hustle play d and stay near the hoop...paired with ball dominant iso guards...I hate that style of roster and the basketball it breeds

i hate watching offense by syracuse when they have 3 players that can do anything with the ball on offense...and watching how good teams clamp down those 3 players accordingly and the entrie offense grinds to a halt

now brown...was a bit better than incompetent on offense...but only slightly so

i hear your point about iso moves and having them creates waht I complained about but IMPORTANTLY it is about what the defense can do scheme wise - same way having a shooter gives space...having a big that can finish when guarded opens up everything on offense for the guards etc...

judging on reds portal add...i think he sees the same

hes picked up 3 good passers - he will have a team next year that can pass the ball

all 3 portal adds can pass assist and score...all 3 averaged double digit scoring last year, too

I MUCh prefer this approach.

im tired of the chukwus and taylors of the world who literally cannot do anything with the ball and hide in the offense etc

soooo tired of watching the orange try to play 3 or 4 on 5 on offense

brown is not quite that - but like I said ...I think people are inflating his skillset and abilities now that he left.


i expect him to be a defensive sub forward next year for duke...and I think its actually kinda silly of him to want that for himself but to each his own

and with that said...I want the coaches to add a defensive big that can do a lot of what brown did...and newsflash...it wont be hard to find someone like that (maybe not quite as good...but no matter)

the percentage of bigs who can play defense is much higher than the percentage who can play offense...so replacing a defensive big isnt really that serious of an issue, imo

I get the frustration but I don’t see brown as part of that. You see him as a tweener. I see him as a basketball player. I’m not sure how many of those we have right now. Either way, it will be interesting to watch Brown at Duke.

 

[CLTCuse]

I don’t care about stats, I don’t care about metrics, at this point it is all about making the tournament.

I think the staff took a very unorthodox approach to the roster construction, it was all about Leffew, until they couldn’t land him and now it’s we love Carlos, why would we need another guard. Meanwhile there were a dozen+ better guards they showed no public interest in.

Obviously Red knows how critical this offseason is, if we don’t take another step forward, he isn’t meeting the “Orange Standard” that HE preaches. I don’t think this roster makes the tournament, I hope I am absurdly wrong.

Not to mentioned wasting our one year with Donnie Freeman would be criminal.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

 

[FrancoPizza]

I believe we are better at the 2 position with JJ getting better and Moore.

We are different but possibly better at the 1 with Carlos as he shoots better passes better and defends better.

This talk reminds me of the Dino years when 1) we would talk ourselves into believing these unheralded transfers were going to save us, and 2) that mediocre players would become difference makers just because they’re older. At the end of the day, you just need to look at who we’re competing against for these kids. Outside of freeman, it’s a very unremarkable group.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Mahaney, Smith and Coward are the guys I'd take take probably in that order. Kadary isn't happening and the rest are mehhhh.

 

[Nicknack]

I think the staff took a very unorthodox approach to the roster construction, it was all about Leffew, until they couldn’t land him and now it’s we love Carlos, why would we need another guard. Meanwhile there were a dozen+ better guards they showed no public interest in.

Obviously Red knows how critical this offseason is, if we don’t take another step forward, he isn’t meeting the “Orange Standard” that HE preaches. I don’t think this roster makes the tournament, I hope I am absurdly wrong.

Not to mentioned wasting our one year with Donnie Freeman would be criminal.

I don't really see how it has been unorthodox. I think Red needed to replace some guys and put guys in positions that best suit them. I think we did that with the Lampkin acquisition. We also got Jyare as what should be a good back up player to Freeman. Last year's roster became a mess - now we have a true center and what could be a star (freeman) at the 4. Bell is perfectly suited for the 3 (hoping he can do some additional things this year though). JJ is a natural fit at the 2.

Yes, we struck out on Leffew, which stinks. He and Carlos replacing Judah is one thing. Only having Carlos is a bit concerning. It is a little disappointing that we may not even get another PG in the portal when there have been guys out there to be had. Regardless, I think Red has done a good job overall with reconstructing the roster. I just wish he could have struck gold where we really needed it the most (pg).

 

[CLTCuse]

I would say it is unorthodox in the following ways:

1. Not bringing in an acc caliber PG, when that was obviously the biggest area of need.

2. It’s my opinion that they lost more talent than they replaced, if you disagree so be it. Not a traditional approach when you weren’t even on the bubble the year before. The team needed a major upgrade in talent, the portal allows that, didn’t happen.

3. They do not seem particularly interested in trying to add any more impact players despite scholarships available.

4. The staff appears uninterested in or unable to pursue top tier transfer players. Just last year to this year is seems like we are pursuing and landing a significantly lower level of player.

I don’t think it is Red’s fault but it certainly gives the impression they don’t have the resources available to compete for the top of the ACC and maybe we need to be more realistic about what the goals actually are.

 

[FrancoPizza]

I don’t think it is Red’s fault but it certainly gives the impression they don’t have the resources available to compete for the top of the ACC and maybe we need to be more realistic about what the goals actually are.

I believe SU has untapped resources given its long history of success and its very large fan base which includes many successful almuni. It’s hard to say where the true fault lies without knowing the inside story, but if donors are withholding NIL because they have not been persuaded or bought in to Red’s vision or appeals, then I’d say that’s a major concern moving forward. Nobody likes this, but the ability to fundraise NIL is literally one of the most important skills we need from our head coach. We know Red was hired for continuity- but the NIL part of the equation seems to have been overlooked.

 

[Nicknack]

I would say it is unorthodox in the following ways:

1. Not bringing in an acc caliber PG, when that was obviously the biggest area of need.

2. It’s my opinion that they lost more talent than they replaced, if you disagree so be it. Not a traditional approach when you weren’t even on the bubble the year before. The team needed a major upgrade in talent, the portal allows that, didn’t happen.

3. They do not seem particularly interested in trying to add any more impact players despite scholarships available.

4. The staff appears uninterested in or unable to pursue top tier transfer players. Just last year to this year is seems like we are pursuing and landing a significantly lower level of player.

I don’t think it is Red’s fault but it certainly gives the impression they don’t have the resources available to compete for the top of the ACC and maybe we need to be more realistic about what the goals actually are.

Again, I don't see anything unorthodox about Coach Red's approach. If you don't like what has been done thus far, fair enough. However, you're making a lot of assumptions here that I don't believe are based in reality.

 

[CLTCuse]

The great thing is that what I think doesn’t matter, just off-season speculation.

The results will speak for themselves one way or another. I hope I’m wildly, laugh out loud wrong. Maybe I’m over correcting from last year, I really thought we hard the firepower to make and win games in the tournament. Injuries and Benny went a long way toward derailing that and all things considered, pretty impressed with Red’s first year.

Maybe they are still looking to add an impact player, but those is the know don’t seem to think so. I have a hard understanding that and only adding Carlos to replace Judah. A lot of next year will turn on Freeman, Westry and Carlos, three huge unknowns.

 

[OrangeFoo]

The great thing is that what I think doesn’t matter, just off-season speculation.

The results will speak for themselves one way or another. I hope I’m wildly, laugh out loud wrong. Maybe I’m over correcting from last year, I really thought we hard the firepower to make and win games in the tournament. Injuries and Benny went a long way toward derailing that and all things considered, pretty impressed with Red’s first year.

Maybe they are still looking to add an impact player, but those is the know don’t seem to think so. I have a hard understanding that and only adding Carlos to replace Judah. A lot of next year will turn on Freeman, Westry and Carlos, three huge unknowns.

Stayed away from this thread because my hope is the answer is "no, we are not done adding".

But if we are truly done adding players I think we will be a nit bubble team yet again next year.

 

[djcon57]

I would say it is unorthodox in the following ways:

1. Not bringing in an acc caliber PG, when that was obviously the biggest area of need.

2. It’s my opinion that they lost more talent than they replaced, if you disagree so be it. Not a traditional approach when you weren’t even on the bubble the year before. The team needed a major upgrade in talent, the portal allows that, didn’t happen.

3. They do not seem particularly interested in trying to add any more impact players despite scholarships available.

4. The staff appears uninterested in or unable to pursue top tier transfer players. Just last year to this year is seems like we are pursuing and landing a significantly lower level of player.

I don’t think it is Red’s fault but it certainly gives the impression they don’t have the resources available to compete for the top of the ACC and maybe we need to be more realistic about what the goals actually are.

I think 1,2, and 4 are valid.

But 3 is an assumption. I think they are seeing what they can get.

 

[Knicks411]

Nope, which is why you look at other metrics like Defensive Rating, Defensive Win Shares, Stl %, etc. in conjunction with the standard metrics like steals per game...in addition to eye test, what other players/coaches say...to make an educated opinion on a player.

Hence, why I feel comfortable suggesting Maliq Brown is a great defensive player.

I don't know about great.

We were 85th in overall defensive efficiency last year, and particuarly bad in a few of the stats the big men are more likely to influence; 308th in defensive rebounding and 306th in 2 point FG%. We were really good in steals, and Brown was a huge contributor to that, but it was very easy to A) get offensive rebounds and B) make 2 point shots, and when I think of a great defensive big man I usually don't expect to see that

 

[djcon57]

I don't know about great.

We were 85th in overall defensive efficiency last year, and particuarly bad in a few of the stats the big men are more likely to influence; 308th in defensive rebounding and 306th in 2 point FG%. We were really good in steals, and Brown was a huge contributor to that, but it was very easy to A) get offensive rebounds and B) make 2 point shots, and when I think of a great defensive big man I usually don't expect to see that

Our power forward was Justin Taylor. There’s only so much he can do