Are we done with adding players for 2024-25?

[billsin01]

gerry was a chucker. his records are mostly the results of sheer volume and not necessarily accuracy.

Had GMac gone to a place like Duke that would have created good looks for him with movement and ball movement he would have shot 40% or close to it. Here, he was the point guard and creator and main offensive threat. And he’s doing that 40 mpg. He’s not stepping into open threes all season.

He’s probably a bit overrated as a shooter but when you hit as many big ones as he did, you just have to tip your cap.

 

[billsin01]

Because one is a former McDonalds All American (which means he likely has a high upside, even if he hasn’t reached it yet) and will now be a junior. Moore is a freshman. He seems to be an elite shooter, so that’s promising, but how fast will that translate to production as a freshman is an open question. I’m not banking on it. Who knows, maybe he’ll be a big surprise. For Starling, cherry-picking a handful of poor shooting games in February isn’t going to convince me of anything. I expect Starling to be much better next year. If he’s not, I don’t think we’ll be very good at all. Red and the staff need to work hard with him this offseason. He has the athletic tools. Now he has to make progress and get better this offseason on his shooting, passing and defense.

A lot of debate about starling’s shooting, understandably. For me, though, I want to see his athleticism translate to the basketball floor. He’s like a baseball prospect with raw power in the cage but you don’t see the home runs in games.

JJ is a very athletic kid with solid size and skill, yet he was largely a spot up shooter and below average defender.

Don’t get me wrong — he played well enough to help us win a bunch of games, and maybe Judah’s ball dominance hurt him. He’s got to be better getting into the paint, getting to the line, getting out in transition, getting his hand on the ball defensively, shooting passing lanes — just generally creating problems for other teams. We’ll see if that happens but at least he has athleticism and has shown a few glimpses.

 

[djcon57]

Had GMac gone to a place like Duke that would have created good looks for him with movement and ball movement he would have shot 40% or close to it. Here, he was the point guard and creator and main offensive threat. And he’s doing that 40 mpg. He’s not stepping into open threes all season.

He’s probably a bit overrated as a shooter but when you hit as many big ones as he did, you just have to tip your cap.

I would guess his percentage was close to that when he was on the court with Billy E here

 

[Knicks411]

Not comparably. Gerry was the only shooter on those teams. Both he and Buddy forced shots. JJ is a lot more open than both shooting that percentage. Maybe he will improve and prove me wrong.

To add some context, JJ took 4.9 3's per 40 minutes last season (6.8 per 100 possessions). Gerry for his career took 9.4 3's per 40 minutes (Bbref doesnt have per 100 numbers going that far back, but I am going to estimate it at around 15 3's per 100 possessions). Gerry took a ton more 3's than Starling did. Obviously its a lot harder to carry a higher percentage the more you take. Buddy took about 12.5 3's per 100 possessions.

I took a look at all player basketball reference had coded as guards who made at least 30 3's last year (JJ was 46). There were 964 players who showed up in my search. JJ was 784th among them in 3 pointers attempted per 36. If you looked at all the guys who were within 1 3PA per 40 of him (IE, anyone who took between 4.5 and 5.5 3's per 40, the average % of that group (168 players) was 35.2%. That's just the simple average, not weighted by attempts.

Consider this all a long way of saying considering his volume, I dont think you can argue his shooting% from 3 was good at all.

Another note on Gerry; it 2005 he took 63.1% of our 3 pointers. I dont know an easy way to compare that, but I have to imagine that is very close to the highest percentage of team 3PA one guy is responsible for this century. He lead the country in 3PA that season, just going quickly through the rest of the top 5 this is the % of team 3PA they were responsible for

2) Pat Carroll, St Joes, 41.9%
3) JJ Redick, you know where, 39.3%
4) Keydren Clark, St. Peters, 46.3%,
5) Brendan Plavich, Charlotte, 46.7%

One final piece of context, the rest of our roster in 2005 took 184 3PA all season. There were 59 players during the 2005 season who took at least 184 3PA on their own.

 

[IthacaMatt]

To add some context, JJ took 4.9 3's per 40 minutes last season (6.8 per 100 possessions). Gerry for his career took 9.4 3's per 40 minutes (Bbref doesnt have per 100 numbers going that far back, but I am going to estimate it at around 15 3's per 100 possessions). Gerry took a ton more 3's than Starling did. Obviously its a lot harder to carry a higher percentage the more you take. Buddy took about 12.5 3's per 100 possessions.

I took a look at all player basketball reference had coded as guards who made at least 30 3's last year (JJ was 46). There were 964 players who showed up in my search. JJ was 784th among them in 3 pointers attempted per 36. If you looked at all the guys who were within 1 3PA per 40 of him (IE, anyone who took between 4.5 and 5.5 3's per 40, the average % of that group (168 players) was 35.2%. That's just the simple average, not weighted by attempts.

Consider this all a long way of saying considering his volume, I dont think you can argue his shooting% from 3 was good at all.

Since JJ shot 32.4% from three, and the average of those 168 guys was 35.2%, you're judging good vs. bad three point shooting on the basis of 4 more threes made over the course of the entire season. That's less than 1 extra three made every seven games. I don't see that as statistically significant.

 

[two3zone]

Since JJ shot 32.4% from three, and the average of those 168 guys was 35.2%, you're judging good vs. bad three point shooting on the basis of 4 more threes made over the course of the entire season. That's less than 1 extra three made every seven games. I don't see that as statistically significant.

So what's the point at looking at 3pt% to judge a player if its just a couple that went in and out?

 

[Knicks411]

Since JJ shot 32.4% from three, and the average of those 168 guys was 35.2%, you're judging good vs. bad three point shooting on the basis of 4 more threes made over the course of the entire season. That's less than 1 extra three made every seven games. I don't see that as statistically significant.

For sure, if he just made 3 more 3's over the course of the season he would be basically right at the average. But I wouldnt say 35.2% was good, I would say it was the average (to be clear, average among relatively low volume shooters.) If he made a few more 3's than among the guys who dont take that many he would be average. I dont see that as something to be targeting as a goal

His outside shooting numbers have not been good, either last year or for his career. Maybe he will be better next season. I hope so! The raw number of 3's he takes is low enough to where maybe variance is wiping out most of the skill and we're just guessing. But I am just trying to add context to the % that he shot, if you don't account for the volume you lose some context.

 

[Sherman20]

For sure, if he just made 3 more 3's over the course of the season he would be basically right at the average. But I wouldnt say 35.2% was good, I would say it was the average (to be clear, average among relatively low volume shooters.) If he made a few more 3's than among the guys who dont take that many he would be average. I dont see that as something to be targeting as a goal

His outside shooting numbers have not been good, either last year or for his career. Maybe he will be better next season. I hope so! The raw number of 3's he takes is low enough to where maybe variance is wiping out most of the skill and we're just guessing. But I am just trying to add context to the % that he shot, if you don't account for the volume you lose some context.

Lampkin, if he comes, will make a big difference, because it will give us a legit post presence that will open up the perimeter for JJ, Bell, Jyare, Cuffe and Choppa. I expect JJ’s 3-point shooting numbers to be improved. Probably high 30s.

 

[djcon57]

So what's the point at looking at 3pt% to judge a player if its just a couple that went in and out?

Yeah...If Maliq Brown made 1 more 3 every 3 games, he would have shot 100% from 3.

It's not like multiple games throughout the year are won and lost by less than 3 pts.

 

[IthacaMatt]

So what's the point at looking at 3pt% to judge a player if its just a couple that went in and out?

Well, if you’re saying that guys are “better” or “worse” based on a couple percentage point difference, I’m saying that we should be wary of sweeping generalizations. Shooting percentages matter, but small differences shouldn’t carry too much weight.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Over two seasons JJ is 70 of 224 for 31.4%. That's a pretty large sample size. His Free throw % also is only 68% for his career.

 

[baggerbob]

Well, if you’re saying that guys are “better” or “worse” based on a couple percentage point difference, I’m saying that we should be wary of sweeping generalizations. Shooting percentages matter, but small differences shouldn’t carry too much weight.

One variable not counted in this discussion. I remember many times in the season where JJ, and others got a bailout pass from Judah with almost no time left on the clock. Then they had to force up a bad shot, which affects their overall Pct.
As someone stated about Gerry, when Billy was playing, he got the ball on time in better position to shoot.

 

[jdubs30]

JJ did shoot 36% from 3 in ACC play and 23% from 3 out of conference.

91% of JJs 3s last year came via the assist

 

[dasher]

One variable not counted in this discussion. I remember many times in the season where JJ, and others got a bailout pass from Judah with almost no time left on the clock. Then they had to force up a bad shot, which affects their overall Pct.
As someone stated about Gerry, when Billy was playing, he got the ball on time in better position to shoot.

I think that is what they are hoping for with Carlos at the pt. That he will get the ball to guys at the right time. And they are counting on Lampkin to attract attention down low that will help guys get open shots.

 

[littlereg]

There’s a new excuse or cherry picked stat for JJ every day it seems. Now that we know it was Judah and everyone else’s fault JJ couldn’t play defense or shoot the three. What’s next?

 

[Sherman20]

Over two seasons JJ is 70 of 224 for 31.4%. That's a pretty large sample size. His Free throw % also is only 68% for his career.

You’re using that year at ND when he was injured and that drags down his percentages. He was also clearly feeling his way back from the shoulder issue at the beginning of last season. He looked much better the second half of the season. He shot 84 percent from the free throw line at La Lumiere. He can be a good free throw shooter and a decent 3-point shooter.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Over two seasons JJ is 70 of 224 for 31.4%. That's a pretty large sample size. His Free throw % also is only 68% for his career.

And he was hurt the first year with a shoulder injury. So, there's that, too.
I would peg him for 34-35% from three for this upcoming season. That will be fine.

 

[SpringsCuse]

So what's the point at looking at 3pt% to judge a player if its just a couple that went in and out?

Arbitrarily adding made field goals without increasing attempts makes no sense. It’s like saying a player played an extra game where he went 3-0 (3 made threes without any attempts). Any stat can be manipulated to demonstrate any poin.

 

[CardiacCuse]

has the staff even been rumored with anyone lately?

seems like its been weeks of crickets now

 

[Sbucketball]

has the staff even been rumored with anyone lately?

seems like its been weeks of crickets now

Portal is quieting down, and I have the feeling any additional commitments are going to seem very random and we won't know until it's public. Just a guess.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

I’ll take another “smoke ‘em if you’ve got ‘em” do it all Euro.

 

[JarHeadJim]

Bump

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Bump

 

[tbonezone]

still raw but tall.

cover the zone corner jumper... NAH. but neither can eddie.

 

[Orangezoo]

ETA?