Are we playing big time football in 20 years?

[syrBossHogg]

How worried were fans after VT, Miami, and BC left for the ACC? It's interesting to compare IMO since we're approaching the near 20th anniversary of that expansion

 

[Scooch]

Have had 2 conversations recently with Patriot and Ivy league alums with family of some rank at the schools, who both hinted that there is smoke that member schools in both leagues would love to drop down but nobody wants to drop first.

Got me thinking about our program and the change$ ahead - how convinced are we as fans that we stay in the game once the new era begins? Culturally, fiscally...our climb is going to get a ton steeper, wonder if we have the ability or interest in staying in when everything shakes out.

Why would the Ivies need to drop divisions? They already really exist in their own unique place, and they can certainly afford to fund their current situation.

 

[TheCusian]

Limit scholarships to 65-70 a team. No more redshirting. Spread the talent around and more teams will be competitive.

Same number of scholarships, every player gets 5 years of eligibility

 

[TheCusian]

This should be heartening - and not so rare

 

[bnoro]

I truly believe NIL will make a bigger difference at SU than a lot of college programs in the NE. Mainly because we are the "pro sports" for all of upstate NY. There is a ton of potential with ad deals, etc with SU compared to a BC, a Pitt, or even a Rutgers.

 

[syracuse95]

I truly believe NIL will make a bigger difference at SU than a lot of college programs in the NE. Mainly because we are the "pro sports" for all of upstate NY. There is a ton of potential with ad deals, etc with SU compared to a BC, a Pitt, or even a Rutgers.

NIL does have potential to help SU, as long as it stops there. If it gets to the point where institutions are actually making cash payments to players above and beyond academic expenses, I'm not sure I see Syracuse electing to participate in that to a high degree.

 

[dasher]

Have had 2 conversations recently with Patriot and Ivy league alums with family of some rank at the schools, who both hinted that there is smoke that member schools in both leagues would love to drop down but nobody wants to drop first.

Got me thinking about our program and the change$ ahead - how convinced are we as fans that we stay in the game once the new era begins? Culturally, fiscally...our climb is going to get a ton steeper, wonder if we have the ability or interest in staying in when everything shakes out.

I'll be dead. Good luck to you guys that are still alive.

 

[dasher]

I'll probably be dead by then, so I don't know and won't care at the point.

I just wrote the same thing without seeing your post. Great minds. Also, old minds.

 

[UpstateSM]

We’re playing big time football now?

 

[dasher]

We’re playing big time football now?

We play good teams.

 

[Dcuse]

Shove this thread, especially the post that started it.

 

[bnoro]

NIL does have potential to help SU, as long as it stops there. If it gets to the point where institutions are actually making cash payments to players above and beyond academic expenses, I'm not sure I see Syracuse electing to participate in that to a high degree.

No chance the schools can afford that. Boosters, yes.

A public university couldn't justify that in the budget.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Have had 2 conversations recently with Patriot and Ivy league alums with family of some rank at the schools, who both hinted that there is smoke that member schools in both leagues would love to drop down but nobody wants to drop first.

Got me thinking about our program and the change$ ahead - how convinced are we as fans that we stay in the game once the new era begins? Culturally, fiscally...our climb is going to get a ton steeper, wonder if we have the ability or interest in staying in when everything shakes out.

I don’t think colleges will be in the sports business in 20-30 years. It will be a soccer model of clubs for serious athletes.

 

[bnoro]

I don’t think colleges will be in the sports business in 20-30 years. It will be a soccer model of clubs for serious athletes.

I'd be surprised, teams in the north and west would have a significant disadvantage with the talent pool available. But it's an interesting thought.

 

[Eric15]

IMO, College football is at a crossroads. Quite frankly the product is awful with only a handful of teams having a realistic chance at winning the entire thing. Hopefully the expansion of the playoff will make it more competitive. But with only a handful of teams getting the best players and the money gap of these programs, how will smaller schools in the P5 compete, especially once you can start paying players for their likeness, etc. I’m not sure what will happen in 20 years, but I think we will still Be around playing at the highest level.

To each their own but I think college football is as good right now as it's ever been. The 4 team playoff (while still having room for expansion) is light years better than the BCS and everything that came before it and results in exponentially more regular season games down the stretch having title implications.

If it wasn't for a miracle play in the Bama/Georgia title game we would have had different champions the past four seasons.

If you look at any time in college football history, there were always 5-6 teams dominating at a given time. Bama and Clemson won't be on top forever just like Florida/FSU/Miami/USC all had down periods seemingly out of nowhere.

 

[Briancuse]

Yes can't say we will be playing it well but in 20 years we will be in a big conference.

 

[David321]

I think with us being in the ACC all but assured that we will continue to be in the P5 for the rest of our lifetimes.

 

[storange]

Dasher, Texascpa, I guess it’s time for us old guys to get busy living or get busy dying.

 

[NJCuse97]

I think there is a ton of merit to the OP question. As recently as about 3 years ago, Princeton was considering dropping football. Not a division, but the sport. Between CTE and pay for play, it was losing the mission of the school and the appeal of true amateur athletics. It is not really a revenue generator for them, and maintenance of their academic integrity is far more valuable to them. They needed room for campus expansion, and the spot where the current stadium is continues to be appealing, mostly because it is on the somewhat land locked campus. The prospect of wasting money on a new stadium that nobody would attend seemed to be throwing good money at bad. It is my understanding they continue to debate this and if they were to build new, they would likely build much smaller. This from the second team to ever play the game.

I don’t think it is a question of governance. It is a question of mission and model. Academic institutions are not in the business of running professional sports franchises. Big time college athletics is headed there faster every day. Bigger revenues begets bigger budgets and financial demands (risks) and makes it harder for schools to allocate funds to the academic mission. This forces them to look harder at alternative revenue streams like research grants and medical schools (sound familiar Cuse fans?). This is why the BigTen is so robust with engineering research, and many of the ACC schools have academic medical centers. SU has little to none of both comparatively.

Once schools have that, the athletics are secondary, or stand alone. As a stand alone, many schools will lose interest in trying to maintain their program if it takes financial and administrative attention away from their new revenue streams. Look at Duke, WF, or even BC as schools that seem to have already bumped into this. Duke and Wake both have large and rapidly expanding medical research programs, but no new stadium expansion in sight. BC has recently committed money and real estate to athletics, because I don’t think they see much room for any other substantive building expansion and the academic medical/research market is already saturated in Boston with Tufts, MIT, Harvard, BU, Northeastern, etc. but they value their academic reputation above athletics. Pitt has an enormous med/research program, and has minimized their spending by partnering with the Steelers organization for facilities. Notre Dame seems to agree that it is about mission by turning down higher football revenue and maintaining their independence. In other conferences, I look at Purdue or more so Northwestern as examples and I’ll wait to see it first, but I believe the resident of Michigan said they would drop football before paying players.

In my opinion, if we can’t turn it around, and Syverud gets his wish for a genuine med school, SU is just as likely to abandon big time football as it is to double down on it in the next 10-20 years.

 

[jr4750]

I think there is a ton of merit to the OP question. As recently as about 3 years ago, Princeton was considering dropping football. Not a division, but the sport. Between CTE and pay for play, it was losing the mission of the school and the appeal of true amateur athletics. It is not really a revenue generator for them, and maintenance of their academic integrity is far more valuable to them. They needed room for campus expansion, and the spot where the current stadium is continues to be appealing, mostly because it is on the somewhat land locked campus. The prospect of wasting money on a new stadium that nobody would attend seemed to be throwing good money at bad. It is my understanding they continue to debate this and if they were to build new, they would likely build much smaller. This from the second team to ever play the game.

I don’t think it is a question of governance. It is a question of mission and model. Academic institutions are not in the business of running professional sports franchises. Big time college athletics is headed there faster every day. Bigger revenues begets bigger budgets and financial demands (risks) and makes it harder for schools to allocate funds to the academic mission. This forces them to look harder at alternative revenue streams like research grants and medical schools (sound familiar Cuse fans?). This is why the BigTen is so robust with engineering research, and many of the ACC schools have academic medical centers. SU has little to none of both comparatively.

Once schools have that, the athletics are secondary, or stand alone. As a stand alone, many schools will lose interest in trying to maintain their program if it takes financial and administrative attention away from their new revenue streams. Look at Duke, WF, or even BC as schools that seem to have already bumped into this. Duke and Wake both have large and rapidly expanding medical research programs, but no new stadium expansion in sight. BC has recently committed money and real estate to athletics, because I don’t think they see much room for any other substantive building expansion and the academic medical/research market is already saturated in Boston with Tufts, MIT, Harvard, BU, Northeastern, etc. but they value their academic reputation above athletics. Pitt has an enormous med/research program, and has minimized their spending by partnering with the Steelers organization for facilities. Notre Dame seems to agree that it is about mission by turning down higher football revenue and maintaining their independence. In other conferences, I look at Purdue or more so Northwestern as examples and I’ll wait to see it first, but I believe the resident of Michigan said they would drop football before paying players.

In my opinion, if we can’t turn it around, and Syverud gets his wish for a genuine med school, SU is just as likely to abandon big time football as it is to double down on it in the next 10-20 years.

I think your reasoning is right, but perhaps timeline is slightly off. We’re committed financially to fielding football into the 2030s at least with our ACC contract. Even if long term we agree the game is not worth the risk, I don’t see how we would or could walk away from that income stream until it dries up. We also just made and will continue to make investments into the dome. I believe that cements us fielding a team for the foreseeable 20-30 year future at least. Certainly could be wrong though and to your other point, SU desperately needs to expand research opportunities. The lack of a medical school is definitely something that could and should be created to benefit the long term health and viability of the school.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Some big development in helmets' concussion protection and/or significant improvement in concussion treatment will occur within 20 years.

The kids will all be playing with those padded helmets within 5 years.
They already should be using them, if you ask me.

 

[IthacaMatt]

We’re playing big time football now?

We'll find out in September...

 

[storange]

- During the 70s I was assured that Major College football was finished at Syracuse.
- When Syracuse missed the first boat to ACC ville I was assured SU football was a goner.
- Likewise during the Grob years.
- Doubt seriously that SU football is in any peril.

Of course 20 years anything could happen. Maybe 30 years , how about 80 years ?

 

[OrangeXtreme]

- During the 70s I was assured that Major College football was finished at Syracuse.
- When Syracuse missed the first boat to ACC ville I was assured SU football was a goner.
- Likewise during the Grob years.
- Doubt seriously that SU football is in any peril.

Of course 20 years anything could happen. Maybe 30 years , how about 80 years ?

I was told that by 2020, we'd all have cars that turn into briefcases.

 

[Dick_in_MI]

It is an interesting question, at least in part because we can't envision what "bigtime" football will look like in 20 years. Things are changing very rapidly and who knows what the eventual ramifications will be.

There was a time when Ivy League schools and Army were a big deal in the football world. That changed. At some point, schools (like SU) transitioned from football being an overblown extra-curricular activity to the cornerstone of the school's "entertainment division." Depending upon what "bigtime" football evolves into, SU may or may not choose to go along for the ride.

At this point, we can speculate on what bigtime football will be in 20 years but the truth is that nobody really knows and in fact, it is likely to be different that what we imagine.