big east charade

[tipphill]

omg!!! have they not learned a thing? how long will they keep up the charade. bailey speaks and says the same things as the previous 3 comish.they are so pathetically slow to respond to landscape or better yet, have basic visionary ability,i can only assume that mass defections are on the horizon. interim commish,consultants,wheel spinning,etc. all members must be so sick of this, and potential new members(boise) will probably be the next tcu. ville,uconn and ru have it right, and keep working at bailing out. there will be no east in the big east.

 

[Townie72]

I think just about everyone has been and continues to be way too hard on Big East management.

Given the cards that had been dealt to them at almost every step since the late 1990's --- when Swofford started to hatch his scheme --- the Big East management has done a reasonable job.

This business about allowing PSU to slip in to the Big 10 is only for those who weren't around when that happened and don't know or remember what the environment was. Bending over for Joe Pa's All-Sports Conference wasn't going to happen.

The great failure was to not do what Swofford and the ACC did before Swofford and the ACC did it. And selling that to the Big East and its many different member Presidents would have been a Herculean task.

BC left after Fr. Leahy said that BC was not interested in a 16 team hybrid conference. He looks pretty smart in hindsight.

 

[tipphill]

I think just about everyone has been and continues to be way too hard on Big East management.

Given the cards that had been dealt to them at almost every step since the late 1990's --- when Swofford started to hatch his scheme --- the Big East management has done a reasonable job.

This business about allowing PSU to slip in to the Big 10 is only for those who weren't around when that happened and don't know or remember what the environment was. Bending over for Joe Pa's All-Sports Conference wasn't going to happen.

The great failure was to not do what Swofford and the ACC did before Swofford and the ACC did it. And selling that to the Big East and its many different member Presidents would have been a Herculean task.

BC left after Fr. Leahy said that BC was not interested in a 16 team hybrid conference. He looks pretty smart in hindsight.

respectably disaggree. prior to the first raid when the be had something to sell powerhouse wise, we should have been advocating for more more media money as well as expansion. had we had a better media contract no one would have left to begin with. we did not and swofford had the vision to do it.moeny makes everyone content . they allowed hoops to be in control and the so called defectors at the time----saw the greener pasture

 

[tipphill]

I think just about everyone has been and continues to be way too hard on Big East management.

Given the cards that had been dealt to them at almost every step since the late 1990's --- when Swofford started to hatch his scheme --- the Big East management has done a reasonable job.

This business about allowing PSU to slip in to the Big 10 is only for those who weren't around when that happened and don't know or remember what the environment was. Bending over for Joe Pa's All-Sports Conference wasn't going to happen.

The great failure was to not do what Swofford and the ACC did before Swofford and the ACC did it. And selling that to the Big East and its many different member Presidents would have been a Herculean task.

BC left after Fr. Leahy said that BC was not interested in a 16 team hybrid conference. He looks pretty smart in hindsight.

bending over for jopa/ you're right that was the climate at the time iwas around and agree.instead we eventually choose to bend over to nd. in all honesty as far as the east is concerned, psu WOULD hae joined enhancing the conference ---unlike nd who would never join in total--and enhance nothing. again, how has that worked out for us? psu in the conference would had worked out great.

 

[Townie72]

million

respectably disaggree. prior to the first raid when the be had something to sell powerhouse wise, we should have been advocating for more more media money as well as expansion. had we had a better media contract no one would have left to begin with. we did not and swofford had the vision to do it.moeny makes everyone content . they allowed hoops to be in control and the so called defectors at the time----saw the greener pasture

Tipp, I don't know what the answer could have been. You are right. If the Big East had made a lot more money, it would have been able to prevent some or all of the losses.

But TV networks can't charge advertisers more for spots on an event than the advertisers are willing to pay. And if they can't sell ads at the prices the Conferences would like to have plus the Networks gross margin, it doesn't work.

And the Networks compete with one another for advertisers business. If NBC wants $1 million for a 60-sec ad for a NFL game, it's unlikely CBS can get $2 million (assuming the number of viewers is about the same).

So the Big East just couldn't raise their prices to the networks. It doeesn't work like that.

 

[Upstate]

More than anything, it shows how stupid the P12, B12 are for not having added Boise. There are not many people who actively root against Boise; I feel that they're kind of a lot of people's second favorite team.

 

[tipphill]

million

Tipp, I don't know what the answer could have been. You are right. If the Big East had made a lot more money, it would have been able to prevent some or all of the losses.

But TV networks can't charge advertisers more for spots on an event than the advertisers are willing to pay. And if they can't sell ads at the prices the Conferences would like to have plus the Networks gross margin, it doesn't work.

And the Networks compete with one another for advertisers business. If NBC wants $1 million for a 60-sec ad for a NFL game, it's unlikely CBS can get $2 million (assuming the number of viewers is about the same).

So the Big East just couldn't raise their prices to the networks. It doeesn't work like that.

and you are right----how about notre dame is either shut out of all conferences as many exist just fine w/o them or a real pipe dream is to offer them to join for all sports for 5years (arbitrary time frame)with the option to leave after 5 years or sign on for another 5(or something to that effect)---i would love to live to see a national boycott of nd---if they don't join somewhere ---i wonder what nbc would think of that and their contract

 

[Townie72]

bending over for jopa/ you're right that was the climate at the time iwas around and agree.instead we eventually choose to bend over to nd. in all honesty as far as the east is concerned, psu WOULD hae joined enhancing the conference ---unlike nd who would never join in total--and enhance nothing. again, how has that worked out for us? psu in the conference would had worked out great.

Tipp - We are talking about two different things. In my memory banks I cannot recall a deal in which PSU was going to join the Big East when the Big East had a football conference as part of it.

1. There was a move to include PSU in the Big East basketball conference that was defeated in a vote. There was no Big East football conference at that time.

2. Joe Pa proposed an All Sports Conference that would have required SU and BC and others to leave the Big East basketball conference and join the PSU All Sports conference (in which the basketball money was shred and the football money was not shared.)

 

[Townie72]

and you are right----how about notre dame is either shut out of all conferences as many exist just fine w/o them or a real pipe dream is to offer them to join for all sports for 5years (arbitrary time frame)with the option to leave after 5 years or sign on for another 5(or something to that effect)---i would love to live to see a national boycott of nd---if they don't join somewhere ---i wonder what nbc would think of that and their contract

Tipp --- could it be that you are from Tipperary Hill and are not RC? Because if you are RC --- and you have uncles, cousins, neighbors and school mates --- you know a national boycott of ND is not going to happen.

The more pressure you put on ND the more its Catholic fan base will rally around the school. Nothing brings out the fight in the Irish than a little attempted intimidation.

I have been to Ireland a number of times. I find it the most relaxing place on Earth. Its climate is mild, its scenery is sublime and its people are friendly, optimistic and tremendouly interested in sports. I have never been able to understand how that place was able to produce a race of people so willing to fight and so unable to forgive.

 

[longtimefan]

bending over for jopa/ you're right that was the climate at the time iwas around and agree.instead we eventually choose to bend over to nd. in all honesty as far as the east is concerned, psu WOULD hae joined enhancing the conference ---unlike nd who would never join in total--and enhance nothing. again, how has that worked out for us? psu in the conference would had worked out great.

I believe that, even if a compromise were reached in the '90's and SU, Pitt, BC, etc. had joined with PSU, the Nits would have headed west when the Big 10 came calling.

 

[OrangeHeel]

Tipp --- could it be that you are from Tipperary Hill and are not RC?
I have been to Ireland a number of times. I find it the most relaxing place on Earth. Its climate is mild, its scenery is sublime and its people are friendly, optimistic and tremendouly interested in sports. I have never been able to understand how that place was able to produce a race of people so willing to fight and so unable to forgive.

Being half-Irish I believe your answer lies in the fact that historically the folks who voluntarily or involuntarily emmigrate are of a different breed than those who remain behind. It's like when Castro emptied the jails and let the criminal and insane leave. It the Darwinian version of "taking out the trash". (All of which is said proudly as a descendant of that "trash" -- LOL.)

 

[Townie72]

Being half-Irish I believe your answer lies in the fact that historically the folks who voluntarily or involuntarily emmigrate are of a different breed than those who remain behind. It's like when Castro emptied the jails and let the criminal and insane leave. It the Darwinian version of "taking out the trash". (All of which is said proudly as a descendant of that "trash" -- LOL.)

Then how do you explain the Irish Republican Army? Trash that couldn't get a spot on one of the boats?

 

[tipphill]

Tipp --- could it be that you are from Tipperary Hill and are not RC? Because if you are RC --- and you have uncles, cousins, neighbors and school mates --- you know a national boycott of ND is not going to happen.

The more pressure you put on ND the more its Catholic fan base will rally around the school. Nothing brings out the fight in the Irish than a little attempted intimidation.

I have been to Ireland a number of times. I find it the most relaxing place on Earth. Its climate is mild, its scenery is sublime and its people are friendly, optimistic and tremendouly interested in sports. I have never been able to understand how that place was able to produce a race of people so willing to fight and so unable to forgive.

nah townie,12yrs st.patricks school,alter boy the whole 9yrds, there were no non rc in tipphill (laugh). i may be wrong but the non alum diehards rc supporters of nd are mostly gone(the ones that you think would rally round them). many tipphill folks had it in for nd when they scewed su out the win years ago----i believe the times for nd have changed and many may care but not enough to really come out for them ---oh they would vocal but that woud be as far as it goes for the general public---just a guess

 

[Townie72]

nah townie,12yrs st.patricks school,alter boy the whole 9yrds, there were no non rc in tipphill (laugh). i may be wrong but the non alum diehards rc supporters of nd are mostly gone(the ones that you think would rally round them). many tipphill folks had it in for nd when they scewed su out the win years ago----i believe the times for nd have changed and many may care but not enough to really come out for them ---oh they would vocal but that woud be as far as it goes for the general public---just a guess

Tipphill, I thought that was the ethnic composition of a place that insisted the traffic lights be mounted upside down so that the green light was above the orange light. I dated a girl whose family lived on Maple Rd in Westvale so I have been up that hill many times.

I know the strength of the so-called ND subway alumni isn't what it once was ... but ethnic identification is still pretty strong lots of places.

At St. Paul's School in Princeton, NJ where I went, the nuns would remind us on Fridays to pull for Notre Dame that weekend.

And on Notre Dame ... about half the people who tune in to their games hate them and are dying to see them lose. But they still tune in and they still see the advertisements. The networks don't care. Just so you watch.

 

[ForCuseSake]

I have been to Ireland a number of times. I find it the most relaxing place on Earth. Its climate is mild, its scenery is sublime and its people are friendly, optimistic and tremendouly interested in sports. I have never been able to understand how that place was able to produce a race of people so willing to fight and so unable to forgive.

You can thank the British for that - 800 years of being shat upon tends to do that to any group of people.

 

[Orangemen]

More than anything, it shows how stupid the P12, B12 are for not having added Boise. There are not many people who actively root against Boise; I feel that they're kind of a lot of people's second favorite team.

No one with any standards wants Boise St. It's a glorified diploma mill.

 

[tipphill]

Tipphill, I thought that was the ethnic composition of a place that insisted the traffic lights be mounted upside down so that the green light was above the orange light. I dated a girl whose family lived on Maple Rd in Westvale so I have been up that hill many times.

I know the strength of the so-called ND subway alumni isn't what it once was ... but ethnic identification is still pretty strong lots of places.

At St. Paul's School in Princeton, NJ where I went, the nuns would remind us on Fridays to pull for Notre Dame that weekend.

And on Notre Dame ... about half the people who tune in to their games hate them and are dying to see them lose. But they still tune in and they still see the advertisements. The networks don't care. Just so you watch.

princeton---great town have been there many times ---did grad work at rutgers, lived and worked in nj for 32yrs---ah yes maple rd out near ludden--have acouple friends that live in princeton.---duke university is modeled after princeton compliments of the duke's

 

[OrangeHeel]

Then how do you explain the Irish Republican Army? Trash that couldn't get a spot on one of the boats?

There are limits to what even rats on a shop will bear. But British policies towards Ireland created the conditions within which home grown rats could flourish. From the famine to the Black & Tans to the Troubles, you reap what you sow.


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