Buffalo Bills 2017 Why do I put myself through this season thread

[pattycuse]

Couple thoughts...

1) The next few weeks are going to teach us a great deal about this coaching staff. After two absolute defensive no-shows, a staff whose expertise is in defense needs to self-scout. The Chargers are not the Saints but they also have lost five games by less than 5 points...and should not be taken lightly, even on a road stadium that will have 27,000 Buffalo fans in it (the Ralph had 68K Bills fans yesterday and that didn't work out so great). I would like to see an inspired, solid effort from a defense that has been absolutely torn to shreds by a very good Saints team and a not-so-good Jets team. If there isn't SOME improvement that is going to be a huge red flag to me.

2) The offense is a tougher one to unwind. There are legitimate talent issues up and down the roster, from offensive line to quarterback to running back behind Shady. Where I truly struggle is how the talent is deployed and coached. We've all griped about Tolbert running wide...but how is it that neither the front office nor the coaching staff seem willing to address? With the current value assigned to running backs in the league, we can't find a serviceable backup? All I heard in the offseason is that Dennison was going to run an offense system that complimented Taylor's strengths (while masking his weaknesses). So what happened? What happened to a system that deployed a quarterback on the move? What happened to the league's #1 rushing attack? You guys know I don't think Tyrod is the answer long term, but for the life of me I don't understand what we're doing half the time on offense. Will McDermott be able to make the cold calculation necessary to make a change?

3) I'm not going to jump to any conclusions on Peterman's performance against backups in a prevent defense...but what I would say is that he appears to be a serviceable backup with good accuracy. 9 games into his rookie year, I'll take it.

Bottom line is that, as longislandcuse said, I don't know how you go from 5-2 to an absolute dumpster fire in two weeks. Was regression likely as the schedule toughened? Yes. But there better be some hard introspection at One Bills Drive this week...both in the locker room and the wings of the front office as to what is happening. Like with Dino and the Orange, I am all in on the process...but that doesn't mean there aren't concerns surrounding some of the decisions & outcomes.

 

[longislandcuse]

Couple thoughts...

1) The next few weeks are going to teach us a great deal about this coaching staff. After two absolute defensive no-shows, a staff whose expertise is in defense needs to self-scout. The Chargers are not the Saints but they also have lost five games by less than 5 points...and should not be taken lightly, even on a road stadium that will have 27,000 Buffalo fans in it (the Ralph had 68K Bills fans yesterday and that didn't work out so great). I would like to see an inspired, solid effort from a defense that has been absolutely torn to shreds by a very good Saints team and a not-so-good Jets team. If there isn't SOME improvement that is going to be a huge red flag to me.

2) The offense is a tougher one to unwind. There are legitimate talent issues up and down the roster, from offensive line to quarterback to running back behind Shady. Where I truly struggle is how the talent is deployed and coached. We've all griped about Tolbert running wide...but how is it that neither the front office nor the coaching staff seem willing to address? With the current value assigned to running backs in the league, we can't find a serviceable backup? All I heard in the offseason is that Dennison was going to run an offense system that complimented Taylor's strengths (while masking his weaknesses). So what happened? What happened to a system that deployed a quarterback on the move? What happened to the league's #1 rushing attack? You guys know I don't think Tyrod is the answer long term, but for the life of me I don't understand what we're doing half the time on offense. Will McDermott be able to make the cold calculation necessary to make a change?

3) I'm not going to jump to any conclusions on Peterman's performance against backups in a prevent defense...but what I would say is that he appears to be a serviceable backup with good accuracy. 9 games into his rookie year, I'll take it.

Bottom line is that, as longislandcuse said, I don't know how you go from 5-2 to an absolute dumpster fire in two weeks. Was regression likely as the schedule toughened? Yes. But there better be some hard introspection at One Bills Drive this week...both in the locker room and the wings of the front office as to what is happening. Like with Dino and the Orange, I am all in on the process...but that doesn't mean there aren't concerns surrounding some of the decisions & outcomes.

Defensive inefficiencies can be masked by scheme to a degree. If we're going to play Lorenzo Alexander, who struggles in space but is a good pass rusher, we better be able to uh, actually rush the passer. EJ Gaines being perpetually injured doesn't help much but, bottom line, when the QB can count to 5 Mississippi and there's still no Bills defender within 10 yards of him, doesn't matter much who you have in the secondary.

It's beginning to look like DE/DT/LB/LB/CB are needed in the offseason, but good defensive coaches should be able to work with what we have out there and not allow QBs 10 seconds to pass, soft zones wide open all over the field, all the while not stopping the run. Gotta be able to pick a struggle - Falling apart in all 3 defensive phases is a bit ridiculous.

On offense - I really want Taylor to be the guy but I watch other teams QBs drop back and let it go. Why we can't do that in his 3 years here reflects more on him than the WRs at this point. That dump off to Clay, down 21 that was always going to be short of the sticks on 3rd down was absolutely unacceptable. We have Benjamin, just throw a jump ball.

Dennison seriously is terrible. He always seems to make the wrong call and everyone, including the opposing defense knows what's coming. How we return the same offensive line as last year with Shady and can't run the ball is beyond me. If they want to give Tyrod a chance, let him throw the ball in non-throwing downs. Tyrod, if you want to be the QB, you have to actually throw the ball.

These last two games are unacceptable. One of them, ok, mulligan. Two, nah, that's not tolerable. Better not be 3 or McDermott might not want to visit the tailgates next home game.

Saddest thing is, 9-7 probably gets us in. If Miami loses to Carolina tonight, we own a WC heading into the back stretch. However, I feel 100x less hopeful in this team than I did running unrealistic machinations in the playoff calculator last year.

Oh, and also... ENOUGH OF TOLBERT! What the literal ****

 

[IthacaBarrel]

All valid points above but I just want to see a team play a game that looks like they can actually win a few coming in.. There is nowhere to go but up after yesterday, didn't think it could get worse than the jets game but it did. Can't believe how ugly that was, whole organization just flat out stunk after a game where they should have come out with a lot to prove.. Crazy year

 

[Alsacs]

The AFC playoffs are still there for Buffalo.

The Bills are 2 games up on Raiders with the tiebreaker making it 2.
The Ravens blow.
Bengals/Jets/Texans/Dolphins/Chargers/Broncos are all 3-6 or worse.

One of the Bills/Ravens/Raiders are making the playoffs.
Raiders have one of the toughest schedule remaining in the league. NE-KC-Philly-Dallas

Ravens look like an 8-8 team.
If Buffalo can go 2-2 with NE and Miami they will make the playoffs.
As a Red Sox fan who used to expect the worse I see why Bills fans are frustrated but this Chargers game could decide if the Bills can get to 9 wins.

 

[shandeezy7]

Defensive inefficiencies can be masked by scheme to a degree. If we're going to play Lorenzo Alexander, who struggles in space but is a good pass rusher, we better be able to uh, actually rush the passer. EJ Gaines being perpetually injured doesn't help much but, bottom line, when the QB can count to 5 Mississippi and there's still no Bills defender within 10 yards of him, doesn't matter much who you have in the secondary.

It's beginning to look like DE/DT/LB/LB/CB are needed in the offseason, but good defensive coaches should be able to work with what we have out there and not allow QBs 10 seconds to pass, soft zones wide open all over the field, all the while not stopping the run. Gotta be able to pick a struggle - Falling apart in all 3 defensive phases is a bit ridiculous.

On offense - I really want Taylor to be the guy but I watch other teams QBs drop back and let it go. Why we can't do that in his 3 years here reflects more on him than the WRs at this point. That dump off to Clay, down 21 that was always going to be short of the sticks on 3rd down was absolutely unacceptable. We have Benjamin, just throw a jump ball.

Dennison seriously is terrible. He always seems to make the wrong call and everyone, including the opposing defense knows what's coming. How we return the same offensive line as last year with Shady and can't run the ball is beyond me. If they want to give Tyrod a chance, let him throw the ball in non-throwing downs. Tyrod, if you want to be the QB, you have to actually throw the ball.

These last two games are unacceptable. One of them, ok, mulligan. Two, nah, that's not tolerable. Better not be 3 or McDermott might not want to visit the tailgates next home game.

Saddest thing is, 9-7 probably gets us in. If Miami loses to Carolina tonight, we own a WC heading into the back stretch. However, I feel 100x less hopeful in this team than I did running unrealistic machinations in the playoff calculator last year.

Oh, and also... ENOUGH OF TOLBERT! What the literal ****

He did that at least 3 or 4 times, down multiple scores. 6 yard passes to Clay or Tolbert when we needed 10-12 yards. I've been a pretty staunch Tyrod defender that last couple of years, but I think that I'm done. I get the sense that he isn't very good at reading defenses, both pre- and post-snap. There's a difference between being a game manager and being totally unwilling to throw the ball down the field and/or make anticipatory/tight throws. He'd also rather throw a ball 10 yards out of bounds down the sideline than give his guy a chance if it means the defender might have a chance at it as well.

The main reason I've been supporting Tyrod is because I think it's been a crapshoot on whether or not the Bills can actually find someone better (our track record with QB's since Jim Kelly says that we can't), but at this point, we clearly aren't going to win anything with Tyrod as the QB.

 

[longislandcuse]

He did that at least 3 or 4 times, down multiple scores. 6 yard passes to Clay or Tolbert when we needed 10-12 yards. I've been a pretty staunch Tyrod defender that last couple of years, but I think that I'm done. I get the sense that he isn't very good at reading defenses, both pre- and post-snap. There's a difference between being a game manager and being totally unwilling to throw the ball down the field and/or make anticipatory/tight throws. He'd also rather throw a ball 10 yards out of bounds down the sideline than give his guy a chance if it means the defender might have a chance at it as well.

The main reason I've been supporting Tyrod is because I think it's been a crapshoot on whether or not the Bills can actually find someone better (our track record with QB's since Jim Kelly says that we can't), but at this point, we clearly aren't going to win anything with Tyrod as the QB.

If we have KB, JM, ZJ and Clay for LAC and he can't do anything in the passing game, I'm ready for Peterman, and I mean during the game. This is a must win if we want playoffs without having to hope 10 teams lose at the end of the season.

Peterman literally can't do worse than Tyrod did against New Orleans. I thought Taylor was a lone bright spot, along with Zay, against the Jets but if we get down 2 scores with him, it's game over. Has always been, seems like it will always be.

Unfortunately, our OC is terrible and puts us in 3rd and long frequently while refusing to get the QB on the move so we need someone who can actually pass.

 

[BuffOrange]

Not sure what to say after two games like that. We stink. On both sides of the ball. But somehow we'll only have the 18th pick in the draft. Fitting, these 18 years are a joke.

I'm so jealous of the Rams. In 2014 we were mirror images - monster DLs and not much else. Now they have a young innovative offensive coach, a big young QB with all kinds of [some familiar] weapons. And we appear to have Dick Jauron II?
Maybe that is harsh. It does seem like the guy likes FG's and punts and hope the other team coughs it up. Like Rex, it's hard to understand what he brings to the table if the defense isn't going to play above its talent level. Take away a couple fumbles by Cincy & Tampa - they've really been carved up in 4 of the last 5 games (how bad must Oakland be?)

It's impossible not to think about the draft and next year's QB.

 

[MSOrange]

This is the first time in a long time I've been able to watch 3 games in a row and I was so disgusted I turned off the Jets and yesterday in the middle of the 3rd quarter. I don't have much to add other than I think this is a pretty good recap of many of the issues we've been discussing, particularly about Dennison, RB depth and the defense.

Saints march over Buffalo Bills: 2 reasons to be encouraged, 6 reasons to worry

 

[shandeezy7]

Not sure what to say after two games like that. We stink. On both sides of the ball. But somehow we'll only have the 18th pick in the draft. Fitting, these 18 years are a joke.

I'm so jealous of the Rams. In 2014 we were mirror images - monster DLs and not much else. Now they have a young innovative offensive coach, a big young QB with all kinds of [some familiar] weapons. And we appear to have Dick Jauron II?
Maybe that is harsh. It does seem like the guy likes FG's and punts and hope the other team coughs it up. Like Rex, it's hard to understand what he brings to the table if the defense isn't going to play above its talent level. Take away a couple fumbles by Cincy & Tampa - they've really been carved up in 4 of the last 5 games (how bad must Oakland be?)

It's impossible not to think about the draft and next year's QB.

Even the Oakland game, they were the beneficiary of passes slipping through receivers' hands and landing right in our laps.

 

[longislandcuse]

Not sure what to say after two games like that. We stink. On both sides of the ball. But somehow we'll only have the 18th pick in the draft. Fitting, these 18 years are a joke.

I'm so jealous of the Rams. In 2014 we were mirror images - monster DLs and not much else. Now they have a young innovative offensive coach, a big young QB with all kinds of [some familiar] weapons. And we appear to have Dick Jauron II?
Maybe that is harsh. It does seem like the guy likes FG's and punts and hope the other team coughs it up. Like Rex, it's hard to understand what he brings to the table if the defense isn't going to play above its talent level. Take away a couple fumbles by Cincy & Tampa - they've really been carved up in 4 of the last 5 games (how bad must Oakland be?)

It's impossible not to think about the draft and next year's QB.

I like McDermott but completely agree... if he's not bringing Carolinas defense here, what exactly is he bringing? Of course, it's his first year and they are in the process of churning over the roster but these past 2 weeks have been zero resistance on defense to a level that is rarely seen in the NFL.

 

[Alsacs]

I like McDermott but completely agree... if he's not bringing Carolinas defense here, what exactly is he bringing? Of course, it's his first year and they are in the process of churning over the roster but these past 2 weeks have been zero resistance on defense to a level that is rarely seen in the NFL.

Your passion and frustration is line with old Boston sports fans.
You deserve one championship season.
Who is your pro basketball team?

 

[longislandcuse]

Your passion and frustration is line with old Boston sports fans.
You deserve one championship season.
Who is your pro basketball team?

...Knicks

 

[Melancer46]

...Knicks

Have you considered expanding your fandom into other sports and maybe just pick a good team?

 

[longislandcuse]

Have you considered expanding your fandom into other sports and maybe just pick a good team?

Syracuse Basketball has been my best bet but I'm already preparing myself for this season mentally.

 

[Melancer46]

I like McDermott but completely agree... if he's not bringing Carolinas defense here, what exactly is he bringing? Of course, it's his first year and they are in the process of churning over the roster but these past 2 weeks have been zero resistance on defense to a level that is rarely seen in the NFL.

Obviously you're hoping that the Bills defense gets to the point where they're a top 10 or so defense, but the head coach is about more than just their former side of the ball. Take Marrone for example. He was an offensive coach, but he surrounded himself with good defensive coaches; he's now had an elite defense at both of his NFL stops as a head coach.

To me, being the head coach is all about the vision you lay out for the entire team. What we appear to be putting in place offensively is a serious, serious issue; I'm very concerned about it. But on the flipside, Buffalo appears to be a team where McDermott is inputting an offensive system that doesn't yet have the QB required for it. There's plenty of other issues; the WRs have simply been bad, there is no backup/3rd down RB, the OLine seems to have gotten worse. But based on the fact that Tyrod's biggest strength passing wise is his deep ball and McDermott/Beane let every deep threat Buffalo had walk/traded them away, you gotta assume that Tyrod is just a placeholder until they get the QB they actually want.

I think the defensive system is fine; Buffalo just has a really shitty front 7 right now. They need to get their (most likely poor man's) Kawann Short, Luke Kuechly, and Thomas Davis in place. It seems like the secondary is pretty much set.

Edit: One more thing regarding the offense. I think there's at least a chance that the system they're attempting to put in place will work. However, I do think Dennison is a truly terrible play-caller. If McDermott wants this offensive system that they appear to be building towards, I'm hesitant about it but I think it has a chance. But I don't think it has a chance with Dennison as the OC.

 

[longislandcuse]

Obviously you're hoping that the Bills defense gets to the point where they're a top 10 or so defense, but the head coach is about more than just their former side of the ball. Take Marrone for example. He was an offensive coach, but he surrounded himself with good defensive coaches; he's now had an elite defense at both of his NFL stops as a head coach.

To me, being the head coach is all about the vision you lay out for the entire team. What we appear to be putting in place offensively is a serious, serious issue; I'm very concerned about it. But on the flipside, Buffalo appears to be a team where McDermott is inputting an offensive system that doesn't yet have the QB required for it. There's plenty of other issues; the WRs have simply been bad, there is no backup/3rd down RB, the OLine seems to have gotten worse. But based on the fact that Tyrod's biggest strength passing wise is his deep ball and McDermott/Beane let every deep threat Buffalo had walk/traded them away, you gotta assume that Tyrod is just a placeholder until they get the QB they actually want.

I think the defensive system is fine; Buffalo just has a really shitty front 7 right now. They need to get their (most likely poor man's) Kawann Short, Luke Kuechly, and Thomas Davis in place. It seems like the secondary is pretty much set.

If they aren't going to change the offense for Tyrod, they need to change the QB. Peterman will at least attempt to move the ball down the field. We have actual weapons now, if the QB has McCoy in the backfield and Benjamin, Matthews, Jones and Clay to throw to (or even 3 of the 4), I don't want to hear that no one is open. There's no way every defense we play is All-World and can lock up all those players, every down.

 

[Alsacs]

Syracuse Basketball has been my best bet but I'm already preparing myself for this season mentally.

You are the type of fan I feel bad for.
Kids in New England where they don’t appreciate the Patriots run with Celtics and Red Sox competitive.

Bills really need this Chargers game.
Ravens at Green Bay and Oakland-New England in Mexico.

Are the Bills on Fox next week? Cause Patriots-Raiders is the national 4:25 game on CBS.

 

[Alsacs]

If they aren't going to change the offense for Tyrod, they need to change the QB. Peterman will at least attempt to move the ball down the field. We have actual weapons now, if the QB has McCoy in the backfield and Benjamin, Matthews, Jones and Clay to throw to (or even 3 of the 4), I don't want to hear that no one is open. There's no way every defense we play is All-World and can lock up all those players, every down.

This draft this year has a ton of QB prospects.
Rosen, Allen, Mayfield, Jackson, Rudolph, Finley and that is without Darnold.

Pederman is not a franchise QB.

The Bills will take a QB especially with that Chiefs pick in the late 20s.

 

[Melancer46]

If they aren't going to change the offense for Tyrod, they need to change the QB. Peterman will at least attempt to move the ball down the field. We have actual weapons now, if the QB has McCoy in the backfield and Benjamin, Matthews, Jones and Clay to throw to (or even 3 of the 4), I don't want to hear that no one is open. There's no way every defense we play is All-World and can lock up all those players, every down.

While you're probably right, stuff like this is greatly concerning to me:

3rd and 12 and the Saints can literally cover 3 of the receivers with 1 guy. Two guys are running to the sidelines where best case scenario, they catch the ball and probably run out of bounds 5 yards short and then one guy sits down in the middle of the field. The Saints end up having 6 or 7 players to defend 2 receivers running down the field.

 

[Melancer46]

This draft this year has a ton of QB prospects.
Rosen, Allen, Mayfield, Jackson, Rudolph, Finley and that is without Darnold.

Pederman is not a franchise QB.

The Bills will take a QB especially with that Chiefs pick in the late 20s.

I really hope so. I can't believe it's even up for debate, but literally every single draft expert appears to think Buffalo will just draft defense with their first 4 picks with maybe a RB mixed in.

 

[Alsacs]

I really hope so. I can't believe it's even up for debate, but literally every single draft expert appears to think Buffalo will just draft defense with their first 4 picks with maybe a RB mixed in.

How is New England likely taking a QB with that 49ers pick and draft experts don’t think Buffalo needs a QB.
Brady is 40 but he isn’t going to be done for another 2 years.

 

[Melancer46]

How is New England likely taking a QB with that 49ers pick and draft experts don’t think Buffalo needs a QB.
Brady is 40 but he isn’t going to be done for another 2 years.

I have no idea. It drives me nuts. It seems so obvious to me that they stockpiled all these picks to give themselves the option to move up for a QB if need be.

Walter from Walter Football:
23. Carlton Davis, CB
26. Taven Bryan, DT
54. Akrum Wadley, RB
60. Isaiah Wynn, G

Charlie from Walter Football:
23. Carlton Davis
26. Vita Vea, DT
54. Isaiah Wynn
60. Jaylen Samuels, FB/TE

Matt Miller:
JOSH ALLEN!!!!!
Ogbonnia Okoronkwo, DE

Connor Rogers:
Dre'Mont Jones, DT
Christian Kirk, WR

Albert Breer (not his personal opinion, just based on what he's hearing):
26. Dre'Mont Jones, DT
31. Damien Harris, RB

 

[Alsacs]

I have no idea. It drives me nuts. It seems so obvious to me that they stockpiled all these picks to give themselves the option to move up for a QB if need be.

Walter from Walter Football:
23. Carlton Davis, CB
26. Taven Bryan, DT
54. Akrum Wadley, RB
60. Isaiah Wynn, G

Charlie from Walter Football:
23. Carlton Davis
26. Vita Vea, DT
54. Isaiah Wynn
60. Jaylen Samuels, FB/TE

Matt Miller:
JOSH ALLEN!!!!!
Ogbonnia Okoronkwo, DE

Connor Rogers:
Dre'Mont Jones, DT
Christian Kirk, WR

Albert Breer (not his personal opinion, just based on what he's hearing):
26. Dre'Mont Jones, DT
31. Damien Harris, RB

If Bills don’t draft a QB with one of their first 2 picks and I was a fan I would pack it up.

They have an extra pick for a reason.

They could have had Deshaun Watson this past draft and didn’t believe in him.

 

[longislandcuse]

Phillip Rivers just entered concussion protocol. I look forward to the possibility of Kellen Clemmons murdering our defense.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Phillip Rivers just entered concussion protocol. I look forward to the possibility of Kellen Clemmons murdering our defense.

Must win, somehow someway. It starts with 1? read that somewhere, cant remember.. Oh it was on every other bumper on 90 East as I drove home Sunday... BRUTAL to say the least