Current assessment vs expectations

[OrlandoCuse]

If we were going to have a successful season we needed several players to improve. The reality is very few have improved and we’ve had far more busts and injuries to expect a successful season. Here’s the assessment of each player:

Mintz - needed him to make a big jump forward as a premier guard in college basketball. Reality is he’s largely the same player as last year
JJ - needed him to live up to McD AA hype. Reality is he’s struggled with his shot and has been woefully inconsistent
Bell - needed him to be more than just a shooter. Reality is he’s largely just a shooter, although he’s improved a bit
Taylor - needed him to be a consistent deep threat. Reality is he’s struggling as much as any starter in SU history. Massive bust so far
Brown - needed him to be a force down low. Reality is he’s lived up to expectations and is largely the reason we’ve won as many games as we’ve had
Cope - needed him to improve from last year. Reality is he has improved since last year, but needs to develop a consistent shot
McLeod - needed him to develop into a dominating center and rebounding force. Reality is he’s been a bust even before his injury
Cuffe - needed him to provide depth at guard and outside shooting. Reality is he’s been buried on the bench and hasn’t really made an impact
Westry - needed him to provide depth or even start at SF/SG. Reality is the guy is injured and we don’t know if he’ll ever be back
Hima - needed him to be a solid backup at center. Reality is he’s constantly injured and can’t play more than a minute at a time
Carey - needed him to show he can play at this level. Reality is it looks like he’s not cut out to play at this level
Patterson - needed him to redshirt and get stronger. Reality is he’s redshirting, who knows about the other stuff
Benny - needed him to finally make the jump to be a great college small forward like we all thought when he was recruited. Reality is he became one of the biggest bust in SU basketball history and ended up getting kicked off the team

Looking at that assessment I’m actually surprised we’ve won 15 games so far under Red. He’s got his work cut out for him to reshape the roster after this season. He’ll be challenged very early in his head coaching tenure. Let’s hope he figures it out and is able to bring in another 2 or 3 strong players to address the team’s issues. If guys like Hima and Westry are too injured they need to be medically retired. Guys that can’t improve or are not capable of playing at this level need to be asked to move on. The remaining players need to make a big leap forward to improve on their weaknesses. Next year is a critical year for Syracuse basketball. NCAA tournament is the expectation. It must happen or Wildhack has to end the JB succession plan and take the program in a different direction like he did with football.

 

[UpstateSM]

That only one guy (Maliq) made anything that you could argue is a sophomore leap isn't great

 

[OttoinGrotto]

That only one guy (Maliq) made anything that you could argue is a sophomore leap isn't great

Bell and Copeland are both better players.

 

[Mr. M]

That only one guy (Maliq) made anything that you could argue is a sophomore leap isn't great

All have improved to some extent, but I think nobody made “leaps” that were enough to make up for the fundamental flaws

 

[NorSyr66]

Bell and Copeland are both better players.

Totally agree with Otto. Both Bell and Copeland are much better than last year and are still trying to get better. Yes, they have their flaws but it appears they are listening to the coaches and working on getting better. That is the bottom line in college basketball. Grow and improve!

 

[SoBristol]

The players and team results have met my expectations - with two obvious exceptions. Center (McLeod/Hima) and forward (Benny/Taylor). Brown has improved more than any, but he needs much more help with inside scoring and inside defense. We get killed inside and then you can’t win unless Bell (or someone else) hits threes in bunches.

Bell, Copeland, JJ, Brown - can’t ask for anything more in their improvement. But they need a true center or power forward who can play.

 

[MikeSU02]

Bell and Copeland are both better players.

100%. Can argue how good they are and how good they need to be, but they are both better.

Also, Maliq is a baller and the coaches should some get credit there.

One other note, JJ is coming back from injury. He’s had a bad year, but I do give some leeway there since he clearly is re-learning how to shoot.

 

[Newhouser]

100%. Can argue how good they are and how good they need to be, but they are both better.

Also, Maliq is a baller and the coaches should some get credit there.

One other note, JJ is coming back from injury. He’s had a bad year, but I do give some leeway there since he clearly is re-learning how to shoot.

I think JJ is trending from bad year to decent. Think expectations were a little out of whack and he's settling in. He's not good but he's decent. Take another step next year with Q and Maliq. Secure impact portal guys and let's go.

 

[hoopsupstate]

People who suggest that Bell, Copeland, Brown, JJ and Carey haven’t improved during the year have not been watching. This core along with some additional pieces could be very good next year.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I think Bell and Copeland have improved, but I’m not sure either are starters on a top 25 team.

 

[Scooch]

People who suggest that Bell, Copeland, Brown, JJ and Carey haven’t improved during the year have not been watching. This core along with some additional pieces could be very good next year.

I think Bell and Copeland have improved, but I’m not sure either are starters on a top 25 team.

This is the key issue. We have a lot of decent guys. Players who have clear and distinct flaws.

On a top 25 team they’d all be role players getting minutes that match their ability to contribute. They’d be put in circumstances that’d accentuate their strengths and mask their deficiencies.

Unfortunately for this program they’re expected to play 28+ minutes a game.

It’s untenable

 

[OttoinGrotto]

This is the key issue. We have a lot of decent guys. Players who have clear and distinct flaws.

On a top 25 team they’d all be role players getting minutes that match their ability to contribute. They’d be put in circumstances that’d accentuate their strengths and mask their deficiencies.

Unfortunately for this program they’re expected to play 28+ minutes a game.

It’s untenable

The untenable part to me is if we need guys better than that, we probably can't get them unless those guys are gone, and those guys leaving doesn't guarantee we get guys that are better.

 

[ORANGE OATH]

Red needs one more recruiting class and Portal dive to be fairly judged. The early returns don't appear great, but not a large enough sample size to offer a verdict. I know Red bleeds orange, but that isn't enough obviously. He was dealt into a hand at a table that plays under completely different rules than on the day JAB took the reins at Syracuse in 1976. College Basketball is a swamp now. Top Players are now more focused on their own money making potential (our current team, a player whom shall go nameless) than winning for old (fill in the blank), or the opportunity for a great education. Yes, College Basketball has always had its outlaws, but nothing to compare to the Dodge City we now presently have exposed before our eyes. The NCAA is beyond a joke now, it functions as a wink and a nod excuse as a oversight entity. While never a shinning example of a blind shepherd of virtue of all that is good and worthy, it is now little short of laughable.
Nothing stays the same in life as we all know, certainly College Basketball has not.
I long for the days when the Dome truly rocked !

 

[OCESIP]

Kind of sad how the program has evolved over the years.

This time of year the discussion was how high our
seeding should be and what region would be our best
fit. That was a generation ago. The good old days.

Eventually the discussion became all about the dreaded
bubble. Holding our collective breath on selection day.
Elated to just make the tournament.

More recently, what players do we need to dump and what
should next year's team look like. No need to fret over the
tournament, just concern on how to turn the program around
and make it viable once more. And of course, the blame game.
How could this all happen to a once proud program.

 

[Scooch]

The untenable part to me is if we need guys better than that, we probably can't get them unless those guys are gone, and those guys leaving doesn't guarantee we get guys that are better.

That’s Red’s job. He’ll either get it done, or he won’t.

 

[SwagSocks]

Kind of sad how the program has evolved over the years.

This time of year the discussion was how high our
seeding should be and what region would be our best
fit. That was a generation ago. The good old days.

Eventually the discussion became all about the dreaded
bubble. Holding our collective breath on selection day.
Elated to just make the tournament.

More recently, what players do we need to dump and what
should next year's team look like. No need to fret over the
tournament, just concern on how to turn the program around
and make it viable once more. And of course, the blame game.
How could this all happen to a once proud program.

You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. - Harvey Dent/Jim Boeheim

 

[OttoinGrotto]

That’s Red’s job. He’ll either get it done, or he won’t.

You're not wrong.

It's a rough way to program build though when you rely on guys a lot, and then have them go right before what should be their most productive seasons.

 

[OrlandoCuse]

That’s Red’s job. He’ll either get it done, or he won’t.

My worry is that Red really doesn’t have an outside/non-Syracuse perspective on how to change and improve the program. Many things aren’t working right now with the program and it really takes an outside opinion to point out things that need to be changed. Red desperately needs to make a key staff hire to give him that outside perspective. GMac and Grif aren’t those guys. Real change needs to come from a new, fresh, outside perspective.

 

[TinyManInside]

Kind of sad how the program has evolved over the years.

This time of year the discussion was how high our
seeding should be and what region would be our best
fit. That was a generation ago. The good old days.

Eventually the discussion became all about the dreaded
bubble. Holding our collective breath on selection day.
Elated to just make the tournament.

More recently, what players do we need to dump and what
should next year's team look like. No need to fret over the
tournament, just concern on how to turn the program around
and make it viable once more. And of course, the blame game.
How could this all happen to a once proud program.

Fixed it for you.

 

[miamicuse]

The expectation is we are a top 25 program and should attract top recruits and transfers.

The game and culture has changed, the portal is open, NIL is here. We better adjust the expectation lower. We can't will the program back to top 25.

 

[orangepassion]

We have 4 roster spots filled by Centers, none of whom are doing a thing, as we're having a PF play C (though Mcleod is injured and I like him more than most on here). That's a killer. You can't have 3 Developmental Centers on the roster at once.

 

[Red2003]

Give it another year dudes. Red was always playing the long game with the youth. Just for recency lets talk Clemson who will yes make the tournament this year but will Brownell ever get them back again, who knows. He has 5 Seniors walking out the door, 4 of the of them that have been playing a half decade. He is not getting recruits. Is he going to be able to replace all those pieces in the portal no way.

There are 2 years worth of players leaving in a month, not the usual 1. These are the career college guys like Girard and Jesse that stayed for NIL and will be off to Europe or Asia for 3 years before who knows. The covid kids are done finally and they are leaving behind underclassmen that have not got nearly as many minutes as they usually would have. Most of the ACC has 1-2 underclassmen seeing real mins.

In one short offseason we will go from the youngest least experienced team to the oldest most experienced team in the ACC. This week alone we will see a UNC and Clemson team of 23.5 year olds and we have 6 guys that can't buy a beer.

It's on Autry for going too young and taking chances on injury prone guys but let's see if he learns.

When Autry stops getting in top HS recruits or stops getting top portal talent then I'll say let's get the pitchforks out but that hasn't happened.

 

[DilemaCuse]

We have 4 roster spots filled by Centers, none of whom are doing a thing, as we're having a PF play C (though Mcleod is injured and I like him more than most on here). That's a killer. You can't have 3 Developmental Centers on the roster at once.

They call that dead weight, it's not as bad in the JB days when it was walkons and chaz Owens but it makes no sense and needs to stop

 

[DilemaCuse]

Some good points in that post on the youth/experience. However 21/22 was an older team and that was a losing season. So I'm not sure if getting more experienced will necessary lead to wins and make the team better if the talent potential is low.

 

[23Zone]

Need a true PG, one that loves to create and pass - not a selfish slasher that can't shoot, hates to pass, makes boneheaded plays at the worst time, and has absolutely zero leadership.