Class of 2018 DE Randy Charlton (FL) Committed to FIU, Indiana, and now UCF

[RMH44]

Is it doubt or is it what you don't want to happen? Thats two different things. Why do you think its hard to add weight to a 6'2 or 6'3 frame? Its the blueprint everyone uses. You add weight to an athletic player and move him down a level. Its what you are supposed to do when you don't get 5 stars who are 6'3 300 pounds and move like a tailback lol

I'm really not sure what you're implying. It makes zero difference "what I want to happen". I only want what's best for the team.

The reality is that Jake Pickard and Josh Black are the two "heaviest" DE's on the team at 250. It's been mentioned here more than once that JP has attempted to gain size so he can make the move inside but hasn't had any luck. My point was...I doubt that any of the current DE's have the body type to add 50/plus pounds necessary to be effective inside.

 

[money3189]

I'm really not sure what you're implying. It makes zero difference "what I want to happen". I only want what's best for the team.

The reality is that Jake Pickard and Josh Black are the two "heaviest" DE's on the team at 250. It's been mentioned here more than once that JP has attempted to gain size so he can make the move inside but hasn't had any luck. My point was...I doubt that any of the current DE's have the body type to add 50/plus pounds necessary to be effective inside.

Im implying that you are making a preference. You might prefer to keep those guys on the edge but dont tell me it cant happen lol. It happens all the time. I didnt say anything about Pickard, neither did I single out any other player. Do you want those players to stay at DE? or you really think they cant be moved inside? Im not trying to be funny. Im trying to give you an educated answer.

 

[RMH44]

Im implying that you are making a preference. You might prefer to keep those guys on the edge but dont tell me it cant happen lol. It happens all the time. I didnt say anything about Pickard, neither did I single out any other player. Do you want those players to stay at DE? or you really think they cant be moved inside? Im not trying to be funny. Im trying to give you an educated answer.

Why would I "want" (not that what I want matters) any player to stay at a position when they could better help the team at a different position? Makes zero sense.

My point is that many of DE's look more like LB's that grew into the position. I was just curious if you thought that they had more room to grow.

 

[money3189]

Why would I "want" (not that what I want matters) any player to stay at a position when they could better help the team at a different position? Makes zero sense.

My point is that many of DE's look more like LB's that grew into the position. I was just curious if you thought that they had more room to grow.

Average size of a NFL DT is 6'2. We have 9 freshman/sophomore DE's on the team that are 6'2 or taller and we are probably adding two more DE's this cycle. Add it up. They are either going to slide people inside or have players sit the bench and take up scholarships. It's not a matter of what us message board guys think. If the coaches want to add weight to them and slide them in. Its gonna happen. Its what every staff do. Every team in the country have players that are moved down. Not sure what your aruing? Thats why it sounds like you are making a preference. Because you cant possible think you know what will happen and how each player's body will develop with the S & C staff.

 

[RMH44]

Average size of a NFL DT is 6'2. We have 9 freshman/sophomore DE's on the team that are 6'2 or taller and we are probably adding two more DE's this cycle. Add it up. They are either going to slide people inside or have players sit the bench and take up scholarships. It's not a matter of what us message board guys think. If the coaches want to add weight to them and slide them in. Its gonna happen. Its what every staff do. Every team in the country have players that are moved down. Not sure what your aruing? Thats why it sounds like you are making a preference. Because you cant possible think you know what will happen and how each player's body will develop with the S & C staff.

Arguing? Re-read my posts...I was never arguing or implying a preference. I was simply asking what you thought about the DE's on the roster.

 

[PhatOrange]

Not sure if anyone out of this crew is going to play on the interior DLine at 285/290+

If it happens it'll be down the road. Pickard and Black are already juniors next year, so it'll take some work.

Defensive Ends
55 Kendall Coleman DL 6-3 240 So. Indianapolis, Ind. / Cathedral
57 Kingsley Jonathan DL 6-3 245 Fr. Baltimore, Md. / St. Frances Academy
85 Josh Black DL 6-3 250 So. Loves Park, Ill. / Harlem
91 Zach Morton DL 6-4 220 Fr. Detroit, Mich. / Cass Technical
94 Alton Robinson DL 6-4 245 So. Converse, Texas / Judson
96 Justin Ellis DL 6-3 240 Fr. Roswell, Ga. / Roswell
97 Brandon Berry DL 6-4 232 R-So. Griffin, Ga. / Griffin
99 Jake Pickard DL 6-5 250 R-So. Short Hills, N.J. / Millburn
36 Tim Walton DL/LB 6-2 230 R-Fr. Detroit, Mich. / Cass Technical

Interior DLine
45 Kenneth Ruff DL 6-1 284 So. Lauderhill, Fla. / Dillard
51 Shaq Grosvenor DL 6-2 285 So. Linden, N.J. / West Orange
52 Kayton Samuels DL 6-0 319 R-Jr. Ellenwood, Ga. / Arabia Mountain
54 Curtis Harper DL 6-2 300 Fr. McKeesport, Pa. / McKeesport
95 Chris Slayton DL 6-4 315 R-Jr. University Park, Ill. / Crete Monee
98 McKinley Williams DL 6-4 292 So. Miramar, Fla. / Dillard

 

[money3189]

Arguing? Re-read my posts...I was never arguing or implying a preference. I was simply asking what you thought about the DE's on the roster.

In summary, I gave you a educated answer, you didnt agree. I thought you were making a preference. I was wrong. We might have been debating two seperate things.

 

[RF2044]

Not sure if anyone out of this crew is going to play on the interior DLine at 285/290+

If it happens it'll be down the road. Pickard and Black are already juniors next year, so it'll take some work.

Defensive Ends
55 Kendall Coleman DL 6-3 240 So. Indianapolis, Ind. / Cathedral
57 Kingsley Jonathan DL 6-3 245 Fr. Baltimore, Md. / St. Frances Academy
85 Josh Black DL 6-3 250 So. Loves Park, Ill. / Harlem
91 Zach Morton DL 6-4 220 Fr. Detroit, Mich. / Cass Technical
94 Alton Robinson DL 6-4 245 So. Converse, Texas / Judson
96 Justin Ellis DL 6-3 240 Fr. Roswell, Ga. / Roswell
97 Brandon Berry DL 6-4 232 R-So. Griffin, Ga. / Griffin
99 Jake Pickard DL 6-5 250 R-So. Short Hills, N.J. / Millburn
36 Tim Walton DL/LB 6-2 230 R-Fr. Detroit, Mich. / Cass Technical

Interior DLine
45 Kenneth Ruff DL 6-1 284 So. Lauderhill, Fla. / Dillard
51 Shaq Grosvenor DL 6-2 285 So. Linden, N.J. / West Orange
52 Kayton Samuels DL 6-0 319 R-Jr. Ellenwood, Ga. / Arabia Mountain
54 Curtis Harper DL 6-2 300 Fr. McKeesport, Pa. / McKeesport
95 Chris Slayton DL 6-4 315 R-Jr. University Park, Ill. / Crete Monee
98 McKinley Williams DL 6-4 292 So. Miramar, Fla. / Dillard

Interesting that we don't have any seniors at DT.

We're going to probably have to bring in 3 DT, with at least one of them being a JUCO who can play immediately and stuff the run.

I'd expect the staff to look to add two DEs [both HS / prep]. And the rest of the open scholarships go to best available guys who pop up between now and February.

Quick question: If Jonas is planning on coming in January, can he be applied to last year's #s, to free up another scholarship in this class? Would be shocked if we don't bring in the full 25 -- attrition always seems to work out.

 

[money3189]

Not sure if anyone out of this crew is going to play on the interior DLine at 285/290+

If it happens it'll be down the road. Pickard and Black are already juniors next year, so it'll take some work.

Defensive Ends
55 Kendall Coleman DL 6-3 240 So. Indianapolis, Ind. / Cathedral
57 Kingsley Jonathan DL 6-3 245 Fr. Baltimore, Md. / St. Frances Academy
85 Josh Black DL 6-3 250 So. Loves Park, Ill. / Harlem
91 Zach Morton DL 6-4 220 Fr. Detroit, Mich. / Cass Technical
94 Alton Robinson DL 6-4 245 So. Converse, Texas / Judson
96 Justin Ellis DL 6-3 240 Fr. Roswell, Ga. / Roswell
97 Brandon Berry DL 6-4 232 R-So. Griffin, Ga. / Griffin
99 Jake Pickard DL 6-5 250 R-So. Short Hills, N.J. / Millburn
36 Tim Walton DL/LB 6-2 230 R-Fr. Detroit, Mich. / Cass Technical

Interior DLine
45 Kenneth Ruff DL 6-1 284 So. Lauderhill, Fla. / Dillard
51 Shaq Grosvenor DL 6-2 285 So. Linden, N.J. / West Orange
52 Kayton Samuels DL 6-0 319 R-Jr. Ellenwood, Ga. / Arabia Mountain
54 Curtis Harper DL 6-2 300 Fr. McKeesport, Pa. / McKeesport
95 Chris Slayton DL 6-4 315 R-Jr. University Park, Ill. / Crete Monee
98 McKinley Williams DL 6-4 292 So. Miramar, Fla. / Dillard

Do you really think the staff is gonna keep all these guys at DE, when they are all in the same class? and we are possibly adding 1 or 2 more DE's. Its a log jam. IMO, they are going to cross train 1 or 2 DE's. Whether they stick there or not. All I'm saying is its better to add weight to a atheltic DE and dual train him at DT, rather than grab a DT that you might not be in love with. If we grab the DT's ( prehaps juco) this year that the staff likes then they will probably keep the DE's as they are. Morton and Kingsley will definitely have to redshirt just to keep the classes spreaded out.

 

[javadoc]

Do you really think the staff is gonna keep all these guys at DE, when they are all in the same class? and we are possibly adding 1 or 2 more DE's. Its a log jam. IMO, they are going to cross train 1 or 2 DE's. Whether they stick there or not. All I'm saying is its better to add weight to a atheltic DE and dual train him at DT, rather than grab a DT that you might not be in love with. If we grab the DT's ( prehaps juco) this year that the staff likes then they will probably keep the DE's as they are. Morton and Kingsley will definitely have to redshirt just to keep the classes spreaded out.

I think what is being asked here is which specific DE's can make this transition? Are you saying that any one of those guys can?

 

[PhatOrange]

Interesting that we don't have any seniors at DT.

We're going to probably have to bring in 3 DT, with at least one of them being a JUCO who can play immediately and stuff the run.

I'd expect the staff to look to add two DEs [both HS / prep]. And the rest of the open scholarships go to best available guys who pop up between now and February.

Quick question: If Jonas is planning on coming in January, can he be applied to last year's #s, to free up another scholarship in this class? Would be shocked if we don't bring in the full 25 -- attrition always seems to work out.

I fully expect a JUCO DT because the senior class seems thin and most are already committed. Beside JUCO it'll be interesting to see what, if any, HS kids emerge.

We're taking a DE in the class (maybe 2), I have no doubt.

Jonas, Sampson and whomever else enrolls early could be back dated but it depends on how many 'new' players enrolled this August or past year. In other words their are stipulations. I used to know this stuff by heart but it's foggy now. I think you can basically enroll 25 kids per calendar year.

*I can certainly see Slayton going pro after this year to so we'll have to watch that. It would hurt.

 

[PhatOrange]

I think what is being asked here is which specific DE's can make this transition? Are you saying that any one of those guys can?

That's certainly what I'm asking, which ones?.

I think of them all that I've seen, maybe Alton Robinson has the best body to make that transition, but man, you don't want to move your best DEnds.

 

[orangepassion]

Do you really think the staff is gonna keep all these guys at DE, when they are all in the same class? and we are possibly adding 1 or 2 more DE's. Its a log jam. IMO, they are going to cross train 1 or 2 DE's. Whether they stick there or not. All I'm saying is its better to add weight to a atheltic DE and dual train him at DT, rather than grab a DT that you might not be in love with. If we grab the DT's ( prehaps juco) this year that the staff likes then they will probably keep the DE's as they are. Morton and Kingsley will definitely have to redshirt just to keep the classes spreaded out.

I'm not so sure about Kingsley will be redshirting

 

[RF2044]

I'm not so sure about Kingsley will be redshirting

More likely Morton / Ellis. But I could see Ellis having to play, too, if the injury bug crops up. But ideally, those two redshirt.

 

[PhatOrange]

Do you really think the staff is gonna keep all these guys at DE, when they are all in the same class? and we are possibly adding 1 or 2 more DE's. Its a log jam. IMO, they are going to cross train 1 or 2 DE's. Whether they stick there or not. All I'm saying is its better to add weight to a atheltic DE and dual train him at DT, rather than grab a DT that you might not be in love with. If we grab the DT's ( prehaps juco) this year that the staff likes then they will probably keep the DE's as they are. Morton and Kingsley will definitely have to redshirt just to keep the classes spreaded out.

The sophomore class is heavy right now because we needed an immediate injection of depth. Alton was not planned in the numbers. Jake Pickard at this point is TBD. If he needs surgery and is out for the year then what becomes of his future? I frankly wouldn't be surprised to see him transfer to Middle Tennessee. We'll need to see what unfolds. Black might be your only candidate to move and he'll have to put on 30lbs of muscle and mass this winter. Not exactly that easy.

The fact that the sophomore class is heavy means you do need to bring in DEnds now to replace them in 2 years.

Sophomores:

55 Kendall Coleman DL 6-3 240 So. Indianapolis, Ind. / Cathedral
85 Josh Black DL 6-3 250 So. Loves Park, Ill. / Harlem
97 Brandon Berry DL 6-4 232 R-So. Griffin, Ga. / Griffin
94 Alton Robinson DL 6-4 245 So. Converse, Texas / Judson
99 Jake Pickard DL 6-5 250 R-So. Short Hills, N.J. / Millburn

Redshirt Freshman

36 Tim Walton DL/LB 6-2 230 R-Fr. Detroit, Mich. / Cass Technical

True Freshman

91 Zach Morton DL 6-4 220 Fr. Detroit, Mich. / Cass Technical
96 Justin Ellis DL 6-3 240 Fr. Roswell, Ga. / Roswell
57 Kingsley Jonathan DL 6-3 245 Fr. Baltimore, Md. / St. Frances Academy

 

[money3189]

I think what is being asked here is which specific DE's can make this transition? Are you saying that any one of those guys can?

well, can't share any specifics but I can tell you any fresh/soph 6'3 250 pound DT can be grown into a DT if they are familar with the scheme and responsibilities Whether they will be productive there is up to the player but everyone is not cut out to battle the big boys inside.

 

[RF2044]

The sophomore class is heavy right now because we needed an immediate injection of depth. Alton was not planned in the numbers. Jake Pickard at this point is TBD. If he needs surgery and is out for the year then what becomes of his future? I frankly wouldn't be surprised to see him transfer to Middle Tennessee. We'll need to see what unfolds. Black might be your only candidate to move and he'll have to put on 30lbs of muscle and mass this winter. Not exactly that easy.

The fact that the sophomore class is heavy means you do need to bring in DEnds now to replace them in 2 years.

Sophomores:

55 Kendall Coleman DL 6-3 240 So. Indianapolis, Ind. / Cathedral
85 Josh Black DL 6-3 250 So. Loves Park, Ill. / Harlem
97 Brandon Berry DL 6-4 232 R-So. Griffin, Ga. / Griffin
94 Alton Robinson DL 6-4 245 So. Converse, Texas / Judson
99 Jake Pickard DL 6-5 250 R-So. Short Hills, N.J. / Millburn

Redshirt Freshman

36 Tim Walton DL/LB 6-2 230 R-Fr. Detroit, Mich. / Cass Technical

True Freshman

91 Zach Morton DL 6-4 220 Fr. Detroit, Mich. / Cass Technical
96 Justin Ellis DL 6-3 240 Fr. Roswell, Ga. / Roswell
57 Kingsley Jonathan DL 6-3 245 Fr. Baltimore, Md. / St. Frances Academy

Nice breakdown. If Berry / Robinson are the real deal and can improve the pass rush, then I think we're going to be set at DE with this nucleus for the next couple of years. Especially if Jonathan / Walton play as frosh [with Walton a RF] and are able to provide adequate depth, behind the main four. Ideally, Morton and Ellis redshirt, which makes them frosh next year. If we bring in two HS defensive ends, then hopefully THEY can redshirt, which will enable them to learn the defensive system and spend a year in a collegiate S&C program to prepare them before they have to see the field.

And if that's the cycle we can get into, then the pipeline is stocked and we won't have to rush incoming frosh out there before they're ready just to plug holes. That doesn't mean that they wouldn't take a situational JUCO or 5th year transfer who can contribute. But the goal is to get to the point where the incumbents are contributing at a high level, which enables you to redshirt most of the incoming frosh.

Again, all of this is contingent upon Berry / Robinson emerging as key contributors, avoiding injuries this year, etc. that don't necessitate burning a kid like Ellis's opportunity to redshirt.

 

[money3189]

The sophomore class is heavy right now because we needed an immediate injection of depth. Alton was not planned in the numbers. Jake Pickard at this point is TBD. If he needs surgery and is out for the year then what becomes of his future? I frankly wouldn't be surprised to see him transfer to Middle Tennessee. We'll need to see what unfolds. Black might be your only candidate to move and he'll have to put on 30lbs of muscle and mass this winter. Not exactly that easy.

The fact that the sophomore class is heavy means you do need to bring in DEnds now to replace them in 2 years.

Sophomores:

55 Kendall Coleman DL 6-3 240 So. Indianapolis, Ind. / Cathedral
85 Josh Black DL 6-3 250 So. Loves Park, Ill. / Harlem
97 Brandon Berry DL 6-4 232 R-So. Griffin, Ga. / Griffin
94 Alton Robinson DL 6-4 245 So. Converse, Texas / Judson
99 Jake Pickard DL 6-5 250 R-So. Short Hills, N.J. / Millburn

Redshirt Freshman

36 Tim Walton DL/LB 6-2 230 R-Fr. Detroit, Mich. / Cass Technical

True Freshman

91 Zach Morton DL 6-4 220 Fr. Detroit, Mich. / Cass Technical
96 Justin Ellis DL 6-3 240 Fr. Roswell, Ga. / Roswell
57 Kingsley Jonathan DL 6-3 245 Fr. Baltimore, Md. / St. Frances Academy

Good points. I dont like the fact we will be losing five experienced DE's all in one year. Will we have enough under class DE's to rotate in while those seniors are on the field. We have to get other younger DE's some experience too so there's not a major drop off the following year.

 

[money3189]

I'm not so sure about Kingsley will be redshirting

me either, thats why I mention that. I think he plays this year. They all cant be on the field at one time if they are all healthy. Gonna be some battles for playing time. Thats a good thing.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Don't forget, we can also work the 5th year transfer waiver wire for interior depth.

 

[JLine]

Hell, since this isn't a Charlton thread then let me throw my name in the ring to help a few DE move to DT. I'm 6'2, 240. I have the perfect program to get them to 280 in a month. Can probably pull off 300 with working out, which isn't part of my tradition. Call me S & C staff, we'll talk.

 

[cusefan88]

people think I just make this stuff up.

You're a board legend IMO. And your posts carry more weight than others.

 

[Nahson]

I'm really not sure what you're implying. It makes zero difference "what I want to happen". I only want what's best for the team.

The reality is that Jake Pickard and Josh Black are the two "heaviest" DE's on the team at 250. It's been mentioned here more than once that JP has attempted to gain size so he can make the move inside but hasn't had any luck. My point was...I doubt that any of the current DE's have the body type to add 50/plus pounds necessary to be effective inside.

Meanwhile, I have a carb and my ass jingles for a week.

 

[SUFaninNJ]

No offense, but isn't this a Randy Charlton thread?

 

[orange79]

No offense, but isn't this a Randy Charlton thread?

Really good point. Thanks for doing my job for me while I was at work.

Randy Charlton, folks.