DL 2020 - Lots of Holes to Fill

[bigmike]

This makes me very happy. Very hopeful for this young man.

 

[SmilinBob]

SU has to be able to stop the run and the DT is a huge factor in that. I firmly believe that the DE's will be fine but if the run is not stopped, teams will RPO this D to death and run at will thus nullifying any type of effective pass rush and to amplify that...LB's get lost in the shuffle and safties will get caught cheating in and we've seen that far too often in the past X amount of years.
Black and Bear have to step up and Kingsley, Harper possibly plus Rondi have give some quality depth. I think it's crazy not having Elmore there full time. Have an OL/TE guy lineup to block back there on short yardage situations.

 

[money3189]

Lots of good thoughts in this thread. I share the same concerns. I'm now leaning on Richards sticking at LB. I'm hopping the staff dual train guys like Tuazama and Rondi. It would be nice if they can help us on the edge before eventually being moved inside. They are the bigger and more athletic bodies. Maybe Morton steps up, maybe Caleb is ready? Those are big ifs. Wouldnt mind them going after a grad or juco transfer DT and DE. This will help fill the gap between old and young D lineman.

 

[SoBristol]

Lots of good thoughts in this thread. I share the same concerns. . . . Wouldnt mind them going after a grad or juco transfer DT and DE. This will help fill the gap between old and young D lineman.

Agree. We can list all the names in a probable two deep, but the unit on paper is less impressive than what we had in 2018 with Slayton or in 2019 with Coleman and Robinson as bookend DEs. Where will our 2020 DL unit rank against the other ACC DL units?
The staff found Guthrie and Williams from juco ranks to fill gaps in the LB unit, and those two emerged as leaders in 2018 and 2019, respectively. We have that need for help at DT.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Again, as bnoro has said, SU can either get a good athlete who is undersized or a less good athlete who is 300 pounds. The staff has obviously prioritized athleticism over HS weight.

Well, a lot of these kids have 2 and 3 years in the system and have not played very much. I think they are missing some opportunities to develop future depth.

 

[reedny]

Lots of good thoughts in this thread. I share the same concerns. I'm now leaning on Richards sticking at LB. I'm hopping the staff dual train guys like Tuazama and Rondi. It would be nice if they can help us on the edge before eventually being moved inside. They are the bigger and more athletic bodies. Maybe Morton steps up, maybe Caleb is ready? Those are big ifs. Wouldnt mind them going after a grad or juco transfer DT and DE. This will help fill the gap between old and young D lineman.

I was thinking the same about TR, but you make an interesting point about a dual role. Obviously, we need speed at both LB and DE. His size is perfect for a LB and a little light for DE (although per TomCat he is listed as a DL). Maybe the new DC will float him - like the kid at Duke (Heyward?) that played half LB/half DE. That would be ideal for Richards and create a lot of blocking problems for opposing offenses.

 

[SoBristol]

Well, a lot of these kids have 2 and 3 years in the system and have not played very much. I think they are missing some opportunities to develop future depth.

I think the DL kids (first and second years) develop in S&C and practice. All the 2019 DL recruits red-shirted, which is what we expected. We don’t have many DL kids who have had 2 or 3 years in the system — Harper played, Morton was injured his first two years, Okechukwu was out with illness. Future depth depends on developing those five 2019 recruits.

 

[Herkimercus]

After a rough year on Defense giving up three (50+) blow-out losses/600+ yards and the D-C getting canned, it all starts with the line next year (yikes). Here's an early look at the DL spots opening up (final 2019 2-deep in bold, grads in red) and the candidates by class:

DEnd ..... DTackle... NG ...... DEnd

Robinson ...Ruff ...Black.....Coleman
Berry .....Williams... Elmore ...Johnathan

2017
T. Richards (?) (6-4/230; RS-So; made the WLB 2-deep behind Armstrong at the end of this year but was injured)
Harper (6'2"/300; RS-So.; played 11 games, all except LV, and recorded 13 tackles, 2 sacks)
Morton (6-4/251; RS-So. played in 4 games this year, Liberty, HC, BC and Duke, no recorded stats).

2018
Obechukwu (6-4/261; RS-Fr. played in 1 game in 2018 and did not play this year).

2019
Linton (6-5/215; Fr. played in 3 games, FSU, Duke and LV and had 2 tackles against LV)
Rondi (6-4/255; Fr. played in first two 2 games against Liberty and HC at DT)
Tauzama (6-5/250; Fr. played 1 game at DE and had 2 tackles against HC)
Dawson (6-5/237; Fr. did not play)
Munoz (6-3/255; Fr. did not play)
Goldbourne (6-3/196; Fr. did not play)

2020
L. Kinsler (DE, verbal)
Lowery (DE, verbal)
Lemieux (DE, verbal)

Elmore has been a lot of hype on O. A dinosaur position that doesn't fit with our scene. We need low center of gravity beef on the Dline at tackle and Elmore and help there with his size and feet. Again, we have played with a converted d end in black who plays around 280 and his d end frame, gets
Moved often. The T2 sceme was dependent on stout inside play and we didn't have the horses and that's on recruiting.

 

[reedny]

Elmore has been a lot of hype on O. A dinosaur position that doesn't fit with our scene. We need low center of gravity beef on the Dline at tackle and Elmore and help there with his size and feet. Again, we have played with a converted d end in black who plays around 280 and his d end frame, gets
Moved often. The T2 sceme was dependent on stout inside play and we didn't have the horses and that's on recruiting.

Black has not gotten it done and plays below his weight (270). Then there's Harper (300) who played 11 games, Williams (282) who's our biggest returning starter, and Darton (285) who's a 5'11 freshman. You mentioned recruiting - for sure this is an issue. When I look down our offer list, I see one DL - and even if we get him he's got a frame but would need 1-2 years. No question the staff needs to look at the transfer/JUCO market if they want to improve on last year's line play and take the run pressure off the LB's and safties.

 

[RF2044]

Black has not gotten it done and plays below his weight (270). Then there's Harper (300) who played 11 games, Williams (282) who's our biggest returning starter, and Darton (285) who's a 5'11 freshman. You mentioned recruiting - for sure this is an issue. When I look down our offer list, I see one DL - and even if we get him he's got a frame but would need 1-2 years. No question the staff needs to look at the transfer/JUCO market if they want to improve on last year's line play and take the run pressure off the LB's and safties.

It is going to be really interesting to see where four prospects from last year's class end up:

• Munoz
• Rondi
• Dawson
• Tuazma

I think we'll see three of these guys eventually land at DT. So while depth might not be quite as bad off as it might seem -- I agree 100% with your premise, Reed, about needing to bring in a ready-to-play DT if for no other reason than to stockpile depth for 2020, let alone to give those four players another year to "grow" into interior d-linemen.

I like the approach of getting kids with big frames in the hopes that they grow into athletic DTs with wheels, but it would also be nice to bolster with an Eric Crume type, who is already DT sized.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

It is going to be really interesting to see where four prospects from last year's class end up:

• Munoz
• Rondi
• Dawson
• Tuazma

I think we'll see three of these guys eventually land at DT. So while depth might not be quite as bad off as it might seem -- I agree 100% with your premise, Reed, about needing to bring in a ready-to-play DT if for no other reason than to stockpile depth for 2020, let alone to give those four players another year to "grow" into interior d-linemen.

I like the approach of getting kids with big frames in the hopes that they grow into athletic DTs with wheels, but it would also be nice to bolster with an Eric Crume type, who is already DT sized.

Agreed and those guys always seem to contribute. Be nice to bring in a couple DT's that we aren't praying can put on 40 pounds

 

[OrangeinBoston]

Agreed and those guys always seem to contribute. Be nice to bring in a couple DT's that we aren't praying can put on 40 pounds

This is what we need form JUCO or portal: Siaki Ika - 2019 - Football - LSU Tigers

 

[721Comstock]

It is going to be really interesting to see where four prospects from last year's class end up:

• Munoz
• Rondi
• Dawson
• Tuazma

I think we'll see three of these guys eventually land at DT. So while depth might not be quite as bad off as it might seem -- I agree 100% with your premise, Reed, about needing to bring in a ready-to-play DT if for no other reason than to stockpile depth for 2020, let alone to give those four players another year to "grow" into interior d-linemen.

I like the approach of getting kids with big frames in the hopes that they grow into athletic DTs with wheels, but it would also be nice to bolster with an Eric Crume type, who is already DT sized.

Or a Jay Bromley.

Of course - a certain # of posters would then b!tch that he's only a 2* recruit.

 

[reedny]

Or a Jay Bromley.

Of course - a certain # of posters would then b!tch that he's only a 2* recruit.

I said there were gems, but fair enough, brother ... you got me.

 

[FrancoPizza]

So are we going to land a JUCO NT or not? Mesidor won't be able to help next year.

 

[Marroniac]

Whoa, whoa now.

We didn't spend so much time making the whole "proper dedication to S&C so he can move inside" thing a board meme for you to now propose that a player move outside.

Get the Hell out of here with that improper dedication to S&C business.

You’re not seeing the 2020 vision here. This is next level.
What does one do after properly dedicating himself? MOVE BACK OUTSIDE.

Give 110%.

 

[Herkimercus]

I read your WF game take and agree with you - one of the reasons for this DL thread. We've been getting boat-raced for lots of reasons - but the 2 most important seem to be: 1) that our D-Linemen are not big or strong enough to hold their position; and 2) they can't keep opposing OLinemen off our LB's. These two problems allow opposing RBs/QB's to get in space and create mayhem in the secondary.

Nothing I've seen so far tells me that this situation is close to being addressed for next season. In fact, we may be worse at both DE and DT - less talent, less size and less experience. Specifically, while one DE - Johnathan/Linton - is believable, the other DE is a giant hole. Tauzama's day will come but he's played in 1 game. The answer can't be Richards, really? At 230? Sure he's a playmaker and he has a heat-seeking mindset. But with his speed and our lack of size and experience at LB I would think he would move up to start at Will. He's the kind of talent we need there.

Either way, it looks like we need not one, but two plug and play DE's and at least one plug-and-play DT. It's not fair to throw young guys in there who haven't played and expect anything different than last year.

Such a reasonable post and one that poses alot of important concerns. Thus, me thinking all along last year that we didn't add up to a 10 win team bc:
1.ED meant more to this team than most realized including the coaching staff. Yes, the brass of this team. They knew more than us and realized the impact ED had last year making everyone around him better.
2.enter TD. Looked good in some relief rolls last year. Year 2, year 3 for him and some tape on him and he wasn't impressive or able to lead us early. Yes, 60% oline/,40% TDs inability to be a qb and play after the first read.feeling the pocket, getting the down and distance, and feeling the situation. Geeez, yes, he has the arm and even athleticism. Question is, does he have the arm TALENT that makes throws under pressure instead of throwing them away or taking sacks for stats. I love TD and want him to be the next Jimmy g as that is the goal here.
3. The wrs were significantly overrated coming into 2019. We haven't come close to replacing Erv and ish from a few years back and didn't replace custis' production from last year. The Johnson and Johnson thing is a yawn, like Jackson, basically replaced custis' numbers, but riley was a disaster, and our young guys don't have it or weren't ready, I mean the year 2-3 guys.cfb is all about now and we need to be right there.
4. Add in the fact the D lacked: discipline, size at DT, poor lbs in coverage and run support. And lastly a secondary still trying to appease cordy with playing time, and other safeties with coverage issues and that includes Cisco, Corey, and #14 I believe. We have serious coverage issues and that includes Cisco. Is he good or opportunistic? It's a legit question, cisco gets toasted plenty.