Does Dickie V Know Something We Don't?

[rrlbees]

I don't worry. After all, the guy on SU's end running point is an "executive senior associate athletic director."

That is the dumbest damn title in the history of bureaucracy.

Hey bud. Haven't chatted in a awhile. Will have to give you a call when I'm back in town. Have some things to ask you and run by you.,


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[Kevind13]

You chose to though. Some of us donate thousands of dollars every year for the right to purchase tickets where we do. While it is a single game, it is the single biggest game at the Dome and those with good or great seats may be told their seats won't be as good. I'm guessing many of those on twitter and some here either don't have seasons, don't have the better seats and don't donate thousands.


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I agree with you. I was looking into buying season tickets this year for basketball as I purchased season tickets for football. I couldn't justify the price seeing as I wouldn't be able to attend most games during the work week. But I would probably be annoyed if I pay for something and end up with something different

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[MadNY3]

Hey bud. Haven't chatted in a awhile. Will have to give you a call when I'm back in town. Have some things to ask you and run by you.,


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Absolutely. I have been immersed in chaos and mayhem. Cool name of a bar, fascinating as it relates to business...

 

[cto]

Just read this thread in its entirety. For all the reasons listed by pfister, bees, tomcat, orangeDW, orangeXtreme and others, I think this is a terrible idea.

In addition to all the reasons stated for opposing it -- not the least among them being that EVERY SINGLE season ticket holder -- those who have supported the program financially and emotionally for decades -- will probably wind up with a worse seat ...consider the following:

1) Given past experience, we could probably sell 40,000-plus tickets for the current configuration... if the additional tickets were marketed as "obstructed view" or whatever, and you put a huge screen TV behind the bleachers. You could sell a ton more tickets... both in the stands and as standing room.

2) What would you do without the space behind the bleachers? Pre-game, thousands of people (families and kids) wander around back there... buying stuff and playing games. There's also an Orange Club reception area there. It is great ambience, and allows the crowd to arrive over a period of 90 minutes. Where would all these people go if that area is not there? They would have to go immediately to their seats, causing everyone to arrive at the same time.

3) People already complain incessantly about parking. You want to add 7000 more cars?

4) And... suppose there is a blizzard. It is Syracuse in winter, remember? Suppose said blizzard cuts attendance drastically. FSU in the 2007 NIT redux. Now that would be pretty on national TV. Blizzard outside .. and no one inside. After having gone to all the trouble and expense to expand the seating. Fun national story.

As several have said, we are Syracuse. We already have the all-time attendance record -- which we could increase any time we want. Duke, in reality, is just another conference game. And a first-time one, at that. Why do we want to make them special?

 

[shandeezy7]

Just read this thread in its entirety. For all the reasons listed by pfister, bees, tomcat, orangeDW, orangeXtreme and others, I think this is a terrible idea.

In addition to all the reasons stated for opposing it -- not the least among them being that EVERY SINGLE season ticket holder -- those who have supported the program financially and emotionally for decades -- will probably wind up with a worse seat ...consider the following:

1) Given past experience, we could probably sell 40,000-plus tickets for the current configuration... if the additional tickets were marketed as "obstructed view" or whatever, and you put a huge screen TV behind the bleachers. You could sell a ton more tickets... both in the stands and as standing room.

2) What would you do without the space behind the bleachers? Pre-game, thousands of people (families and kids) wander around back there... buying stuff and playing games. There's also an Orange Club reception area there. It is great ambience, and allows the crowd to arrive over a period of 90 minutes. Where would all these people go if that area is not there? They would have to go immediately to their seats, causing everyone to arrive at the same time.

3) People already complain incessantly about parking. You want to add 7000 more cars?

4) And... suppose there is a blizzard. It is Syracuse in winter, remember? Suppose said blizzard cuts attendance drastically. FSU in the 2007 NIT redux. Now that would be pretty on national TV. Blizzard outside .. and no one inside. After having gone to all the trouble and expense to expand the seating. Fun national story.

As several have said, we are Syracuse. We already have the all-time attendance record -- which we could increase any time we want. Duke, in reality, is just another conference game. And a first-time one, at that. Why do we want to make them special?

Love everything you do for the program and all the insight you provide here CTO, but 3 of your 4 points don't carry much weight at all I don't think.

2 and 3 are easily rebutted with the fact that the Dome is a football stadium. The behind the bleachers area is obviously not available during football season and people do just fine coming into the dome and going right to their seats or mingling in the concourse. Same thing goes for number 3. The Dome's capacity for football is just under 50,000. We've had crowds that big before. We've dealt with that many cars before. It's a non-issue/minor inconvenience.

And point 4 holds true for every game at the Dome in the winter. It's the risk you have with sporting events in our area. The same thing could happen at a Bills or Giants game in December. If something like that were to happen, what can you do about it?

As for your point about season ticket holders getting shafted, I'll go back to my earlier post and say how does anyone know that at this point? Nobody knows what the exact configuration would be and how season ticket holders would be compensated. It's all speculation at this point and no one can really say anything definitively about it one way or another.

 

[cto]

Love everything you do for the program and all the insight you provide here CTO, but 3 of your 4 points don't carry much weight at all I don't think.

2 and 3 are easily rebutted with the fact that the Dome is a football stadium. The behind the bleachers area is obviously not available during football season and people do just fine coming into the dome and going right to their seats or mingling in the concourse. Same thing goes for number 3. The Dome's capacity for football is just under 50,000. We've had crowds that big before. We've dealt with that many cars before. It's a non-issue/minor inconvenience.

And point 4 holds true for every game at the Dome in the winter. It's the risk you have with sporting events in our area. The same thing could happen at a Bills or Giants game in December. If something like that were to happen, what can you do about it?

As for your point about season ticket holders getting shafted, I'll go back to my earlier post and say how does anyone know that at this point? Nobody knows what the exact configuration would be and how season ticket holders would be compensated. It's all speculation at this point and no one can really say anything definitively about it one way or another.

Football is played during better weather. People arrive early, wander around the quad, listen to the band, tailgate, whatever. You can't do that when there is two feet of snow on the ground.

Likewise, parking and traffic is adversely affected by snow. Travel is worse, and parking spaces are more limited ... both on and off the street. And people don't want to walk as far... if there is sleet blowing into their face.

 

[OrangeDW]

Holy crap is this a thread of "first-world problems" if I've ever seen one.

They are featuring this IN SYRACUSE. The next closest thing in line for press in Syracuse will be the wine slushies at the state fair.

Just be happy that the attention is on us and our facilities.

It's not like our program is starving for attention or press.

 

[skurey]

If this does happen I really really hope both teams are good this year. Would be a nightmare if they turn out to be fringe top 25 teams.

 

[CorduroyG]

Football is played during better weather. People arrive early, wander around the quad, listen to the band, tailgate, whatever. You can't do that when there is two feet of snow on the ground.

Likewise, parking and traffic is adversely affected by snow. Travel is worse, and parking spaces are more limited ... both on and off the street. And people don't want to walk as far... if there is sleet blowing into their face.

and if its 35 degrees and sunny? everyone will have a grand ole time.

 

[retro44]

Court and seats stay where they are. Everybody sits lapsies, with a bottom/top switch at halftime. You heard it here first.

the image of bees and tomcat made me grab for a Xanax and a new bottle of jack

 

[Chip]

The other thing that's kind of annoying me about this is it being labeled as a "one time event". That's what Axe was calling it in his tweets.

Aren't we in the ACC now? Suddenly a home game with Duke is a one time event?

We probably have the Top 10 of all time on campus crowds ever recorded. There's nothing wrong with just continuing to do that I'm sure this will take over the existing record with our regular configuration. It's a good thing.

 

[SUbear]

Football is played during better weather. People arrive early, wander around the quad, listen to the band, tailgate, whatever. You can't do that when there is two feet of snow on the ground.

Likewise, parking and traffic is adversely affected by snow. Travel is worse, and parking spaces are more limited ... both on and off the street. And people don't want to walk as far... if there is sleet blowing into their face.

If they decide to change the court location. It would be more effective to simply rotate the court 90 degrees( to east west orientation rather than current north south)', move court about 10 yards to the east, and the movable bleachers 10 to 15 yards further from the east end of the court. This would open up the entire upper deck(east end) for long distance tickets with a decent view of the court, in addition most if not all of the sideline seats would then have a decent view of the court, and be saleable. Moving to mid dome is not necessary to increase seating greatly, and most season ticket holders would not be terribly impacted in their current locations, certainly much less disruptive than a move to mid dome would be. It might not accommodate 50000, but over 40000 maybe 45000 depending on variables of how it is ultimately done.

 

[dundundun]

and if its 35 degrees and sunny? everyone will have a grand ole time.

why would this game be played in late April?

 

[bballbeadle]

Oh, hell, I'll do what everyone else does.

 

[SUFan44]

I am going to go back to this - would you rather Syracuse basketball have a dynamic pricing structure? If so, everyone will be sorely disappointed with the results. And we would NOT get the numbers we currently get for big games - not even close.

The people that pay X number of dollars to get season tickets - I get it. I get the fact that you are invested into the program and feel that you should be rewarded with a tremendous seat. Guess what? I don't think Syracuse University would do this without thought behind it (this, I feel, is an assumption that could be erred on the side of being a business person. But I will consider it a given for such an argument).

A season ticket holder that has given five figures, six figures and seven figures to the program will NOT be given seats in the 300 level, or an obstructed view seat. That is a LUDICROUS assumption. Do you honestly and truly believe that there won't be court-level seats? Or even seats commensurate with your current location. C'mon people. They have the technological ability to shift the seat that you are currently sitting in into a comparable seat in the new configuration. That's VERY easy to do.

So many of the excuses that current donors and season ticket holders are coming up with are petty. My seat is going to be moved. My dedication to the program doesn't matter. I have some honest news for you - you could be a fan of UConn. With a dying athletic department, in a dying conference, with no life coming any time soon. You could be a fan of a lot of other programs that don't have a perennial Top 10 basketball team and don't have the capability to do something special.

Not one other program in the entire nation has this ability. The fact that we can do something like this, in the town that it is in, is remarkable. And something to embrace. Not something to hum and haw over and complain about.

Final thought: Whether you like it or not, it is going to happen. Whether it be this year, next year, 10 years from now, it is going to happen. It's the nature of sports marketing and college athletics. So either deal with it, or stop being a fan.

 

[thebigeast44]

If they do move the court, I agree that they should have announced it before taking payment for season tickets. A question though for season ticket holders - if you had known ahead of time that they were going to move the court for the Duke game, would that have made any difference on your decision to buy season tickets?

 

[Sufanatic02]

Could moving the court to the center of the dome be a test for a final four/championship setup? With the addition of hotels downtown the city should be getting close to the hotel room minimum. What better game besides Georgetown. Two strong fanbases and too ten teams. Would be pretty close to a FF/NC game.

 

[Bill Orange]

Could moving the court to the center of the dome be a test for a final four/championship setup? With the addition of hotels downtown the city should be getting close to the hotel room minimum. What better game besides Georgetown. Two strong fanbases and too ten teams. Would be pretty close to a FF/NC game.

Will. Never. Happen.

 

[Full_Rebar]

So many of the excuses that current donors and season ticket holders are coming up with are petty. My seat is going to be moved. My dedication to the program doesn't matter.

Final thought: Whether you like it or not, it is going to happen. Whether it be this year, next year, 10 years from now, it is going to happen. It's the nature of sports marketing and college athletics. So either deal with it, or stop being a fan.

I am not a donor, but those who are can tell you that changes have occurred over the last few years which make it reasonable for them to question if their dedication matters. From the changing of the donation structure/benefits to eliminating events like the football/mbb scrimmages (can't remember the names of these events), some of these folks have the right to question why their money doesn't seem to matter.

Just remember that the overall success of SU's teams has a lot to do with the people who give $1,000 on a yearly basis. Most business folks will tell you that you should be increasing, not decreasing, benefits for loyal "customers". I'm fine with trying new things (games at MetLife, moving the court), but SU needs to make sure that they don't alienate an important group in the process.

 

[pfister1]

Will. Never. Happen.

I hate to sound like I am too eager to denigrate the Syracuse community, but why in God's name would the basketball community want to travel to Syracuse in late March/early April for its grand event?? So what if it has an arena big enough to handle a championship and by counting the motor lodges on State Fair Blvd. it might have enough hotel rooms.

I agree with Bill Orange, it ain't never gonna happen.


And would someone make a credible argument for why turning the court would be a good or wise move?

A Duke vs. Syracuse game would already be the centerpiece of the basketball world for that weekend......assuming both teams do their part and have good seasons. The size of the crowd isn't going to change the excitement nationally for the matchup. How much more attention would turning the court really be expected to generate for what would undoubtedly be the marquee matchup for whatever weekend the matchup occurred?

The Dome already holds the on-campus attendance record and enough tickets could be made available to allow a Duke vs. Syracuse matchup to break that record in the usual configuration, if it that was truly deemed to be important.

So, its really about selling an extra 10-15k tickets for the one game?

 

[RandygoCuse]

I am not a donor, but those who are can tell you that changes have occurred over the last few years which make it reasonable for them to question if their dedication matters. From the changing of the donation structure/benefits to eliminating events like the football/mbb scrimmages (can't remember the names of these events), some of these folks have the right to question why their money doesn't seem to matter.

Just remember that the overall success of SU's teams has a lot to do with the people who give $1,000 on a yearly basis. Most business folks will tell you that you should be increasing, not decreasing, benefits for loyal "customers". I'm fine with trying new things (games at MetLife, moving the court), but SU needs to make sure that they don't alienate an important group in the process.

Well put. I like that the idea is being explored. I'm all for taking chances to see if something can be better. But if you are going to do that, I think you need to keep people informed.

 

[Brian Orange]

It's one freakin' game. Come on.

People are so adverse to change here. Then it (usually) works out and everyone is like "wow, that makes sense now". The ads in NYC come to mind.

At the VERY least we break an all-time record that will likely stand for many, many years so we likely won't move the court again. It will be the lead story on Sportscenter that night.

The only concern that is valid is that of the season ticket holders/big boosters who will be displaced. But like I said, it's for one game. You can suck it up for one game for the good of the program and getting incredible publicity.

 

[Brian Orange]

Here's a question for the people against moving the court...

If Gross came out and guaranteed they would never move the court again, would that change your stance?

 

[Bayside44]

Here's a question for the people against moving the court...

If Gross came out and guaranteed they would never move the court again, would that change your stance?

I think they oughta move it but that would be an empty promise unless TGD is immortal.

 

[Full_Rebar]

I am not against moving the court for a game. I am against moving the court for a conference game, and I am against collecting money from people for season tickets and then moving the court.

I would love to see SU move the court for a big-time non-conference game (Kentucky, Georgetown, or UConn come to mind) where you can do it in a way that doesn't piss on the people who have been loyal to the program.