Does JB actually believe this

Cuseball

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This line of thinking is lazy. Do all our assistant coaches make the same amount Money? Do some assistant coaches get paid for outside events.
They deal with it. So would players.
Yep. He gave a very thoughtful response. He talked about the cost of attendance stipend, talked about the new meal money rules and how great for the players that was and more than a few times mentioned how they need to do even more to get the players money. He also talked about the potential pitfalls and fairness. He said he didn’t have all the answers but others were working through it. It was a great discussion. But of course some people still want to piss on jb just because.
Yes his discussion was perfectly fine, thoughtful and touched on concerns that would need to be explored. Abbsolutely nothing wrong with what he said and no reason for anyone to get all worked up. Not one coach has offered a concrete solution.
 

Alsacs

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The real world is kids don’t have to go to college to play sports either.
The colleges get the benefit of the kids going to college WAY more than the kids going to college get as well.
P5 schools don't lose money on football and basketball.
TV money, sponsors, free media exposure. They get the benefit a lot more than the kids having to ability to make a little money while in college and maintain their eligibility.

If the SU football team went on strike and all quit tomorrow. The school would lose a lot of money. Those kids at every major sports program in the country have a lot more leverage than they ever use.
 

maxxyz

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So basically players that bring value would get paid. That is shocking. I would rather players that bring value get the money while the iron is hot than allowing the NCAA to own the players likeness and allow TV networks promote their games with those players without compensating them.
I think you are misunderstanding my point.

I think people should be paid. But I think this rush by politicians is at best them trying to create a talking point for their re-election, and at worst they are minions of the shoe companies. What concerns me is not having the time to evaluate & prepare for the unintended consequences that will come with the new legislation.

You seem to be arguing with a "damn the torpedoes" logic, which is what I disagree with. But you and I have no disagreement on the end result. People should be paid for their work, and big business should not be able to get rich off of stepping on the poor. I think I have been pretty consistent with this view for years on the super secret Off Topic board.

But I still say this only benefits 0.5% of all college athletes. ;)
 

JOC44

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The issue isn't that players would benefit off their likeness, it's that they'd get paid to go to particular school under the false premise of making money for their likeness.

Take a top recruit, who I'll randomly call "Zion."

"Hi Zion, it's Coach L. I'd love for you to come to my school. I can't offer you any money, but did you know that there's a car dealer in town who usually contracts with incoming freshmen to pay them $500K a year to make a couple of appearances at his dealership?"

The reality is the top players won't be paid for their likeness, they'll be paid fake "likeness" money to get them to sign with a particular school. If you think that's the way it should be, fine. But let's not pretend this is just about paying what the market would bear for commercial endorsements.
 

Horn88

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The issue isn't that players would benefit off their likeness, it's that they'd get paid to go to particular school under the false premise of making money for their likeness.

Take a top recruit, who I'll randomly call "Zion."

"Hi Zion, it's Coach L. I'd love for you to come to my school. I can't offer you any money, but did you know that there's a car dealer in town who usually contracts with incoming freshmen to pay them $500K a year to make a couple of appearances at his dealership?"

The reality is the top players won't be paid for their likeness, they'll be paid fake "likeness" money to get them to sign with a particular school. If you think that's the way it should be, fine. But let's not pretend this is just about paying what the market would bear for commercial endorsements.
In this example if the market is willing to pay "Zion" $500k/year to appear in a couple local commercials then by definition that is what the market is bearing for that player's image and likeness.

Markets are efficient and will solve itself pretty quickly.
 

rrlbees

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The colleges get the benefit of the kids going to college WAY more than the kids going to college get as well.
P5 schools don't lose money on football and basketball.
TV money, sponsors, free media exposure. They get the benefit a lot more than the kids having to ability to make a little money while in college and maintain their eligibility.

If the SU football team went on strike and all quit tomorrow. The school would lose a lot of money. Those kids at every major sports program in the country have a lot more leverage than they ever use.
Schools do run in the red. See Rutgers. Or SU for s short stretch not too long ago.
 

Horn88

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I think some of you have a beef with the nba actually. Let kids go straight to the league. They’d get paid if worth it.
What does that have to do with whether a college player should be able to profit off their image and likeness?

It shouldn't have to be an either or if the priority is what's best for the young student-athletes.
 

rrlbees

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What does that have to do with whether a college player should be able to profit off their image and likeness?

It shouldn't have to be an either or if the priority is what's best for the young student-athletes.
You’d have to go back and reread the whole thread.
 

jgeorge322

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The paying part of it is not and that is what is being debated.
just checked the thread and the impact of letting student athletes profit off their likeness is definitely the topic, as i stated.
 

Horn88

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You’d have to go back and reread the whole thread.
Pretty weak response, especially from a staff member. That's what people do I guess when they don't have a worthwhile answer.

I've read the thread and it's just more of the same of people grasping at straws for reasons that don't really hold up on why players can't get paid. Because their focus is on what's best for them as fans and the schools to maintain the control, not what's best for the student athlete.

First it was player's are barely worth their scholarship, then it was the players would make too much and now it's we can't let this happen because it will impact team chemistry? I mean come on...
 
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Cheriehoop

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‘Pretty weak response, especially from a staff member. That's what people do I guess when they don't have a worthwhile answer.’

or don’t have the time to do what you easily can and should do.
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Taxes would be due from players on endorsement, likeness money too. Hope they withhold enough to cover it if this goes through.
 

OttoinGrotto

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The issue isn't that players would benefit off their likeness, it's that they'd get paid to go to particular school under the false premise of making money for their likeness.

Take a top recruit, who I'll randomly call "Zion."

"Hi Zion, it's Coach L. I'd love for you to come to my school. I can't offer you any money, but did you know that there's a car dealer in town who usually contracts with incoming freshmen to pay them $500K a year to make a couple of appearances at his dealership?"

The reality is the top players won't be paid for their likeness, they'll be paid fake "likeness" money to get them to sign with a particular school. If you think that's the way it should be, fine. But let's not pretend this is just about paying what the market would bear for commercial endorsements.
That's actually not a problem.
 

Horn88

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‘Pretty weak response, especially from a staff member. That's what people do I guess when they don't have a worthwhile answer.’

or don’t have the time to do what you easily can and should do.
================================================
Taxes would be due from players on endorsement, likeness money too. Hope they withhold enough to cover it if this goes through.
If IRS compliance ever becomes an actual issue Calipari will cover it in his program to help get players ready for the next level, use it in a recruiting pitch and then every coach in America will follow suit immediately.

And like I said, if you read the part of my post that you cropped out of your reply, I did read the whole thread. I was trying to have a discussion. He was short and rude in his reply. You're sticking up for another staff member and it's whatever. However, I didn't really see anyone state why it had to be an either or on what getting paid in the NFL or NBA had to do with if you could get paid in college. They really have nothing to do with each other.
 
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Cusefan0307

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just checked the thread and the impact of letting student athletes profit off their likeness is definitely the topic, as i stated.
What do you think is happening now?
 

rrlbees

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Pretty weak response, especially from a staff member. That's what people do I guess when they don't have a worthwhile answer.

I've read the thread and it's just more of the same of people grasping at straws for reasons that don't really hold up on why players can't get paid. Because their focus is on what's best for them as fans and the schools to maintain the control, not what's best for the student athlete.

First it was player's are barely worth their scholarship, then it was the players would make too much and now it's we can't let this happen because it will impact team chemistry? I mean come on...
Well if you read the thread (or maybe another thread on the same topic) you would have already known my position. I didn’t feel like rehashing it again.
 

Cusefan0307

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Well if you read the thread (or maybe another thread on the same topic) you would have already known my position. I didn’t feel like rehashing it again.
I get your position and we aren’t going to agree, but do you actually think the NCAA is going penalize the cheaters identified in the FBI investigation?

I don’t and that’s one of the reasons I want the rules changed. Some schools are already playing by the rules you’re against.
 

rrlbees

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I get your position and we aren’t going to agree, but do you actually think the NCAA is going penalize the cheaters identified in the FBI investigation?

I don’t and that’s one of the reasons I want the rules changed. Some schools are already playing by the rules you’re against.
I never said I was against paying players. In fact I said I was for it. I said I was against making what is currently illegal (bags) even worse by making it ok for outside trash to pay who they want whatever amount they want. Again, jb discusses it perfectly and that’s where I stand too.
 

Cusefan0307

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I never said I was against paying players. In fact I said I was for it. I said I was against making what is currently illegal (bags) even worse by making it ok for outside trash to pay who they want whatever amount they want. Again, jb discusses it perfectly and that’s where I stand too.
That wasn't what I asked. I understand your position. I asked if you actually think the NCAA is going to penalize Kansas, Arizona etc...
 

rrlbees

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That wasn't what I asked. I understand your position. I asked if you actually think the NCAA is going to penalize Kansas, Arizona etc...
I have no idea. I’d say 50/50.
 

JOC44

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In this example if the market is willing to pay "Zion" $500k/year to appear in a couple local commercials then by definition that is what the market is bearing for that player's image and likeness.

Markets are efficient and will solve itself pretty quickly.
In my example, the market is not efficient. It is inefficient because the car dealer doesn't get anywhere near $500,000 worth of value to his business by having random player "Zion" show up at the dealership on a few Saturdays. He is paying $500,00 for the noneconomic reason that it makes him feel good that his local college basketball team is good and this money will help the school recruit.

There are plenty of people who feel college athletes should be able to market their athletic abilities and get paid for them. Those people would be thrilled that the kid is getting $500K for agreeing to go to a particular school. Whether you agree with that sentiment or not, they are at least being honest that this is about paying players to play for schools in the guise of allowing them to collect endorsement money.
 

HRE Otto IV

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You don’t think it could impact team chemistry? In pro sports everyone gets paid but stars get paid more. It comes with the job. In college you don’t get paid and it is not your job. So one player getting paid could cause friction.
 

Madbiker

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I mean any player who didn’t like that obviously wouldn’t have a market to get paid.

Craig Forth would be upset if a company wanted to use Carmelo Anthony in a commercial?

Chino Obokoh would be upset that Michael Gbinije would get money for a commercial.

JB’s entitled to his position but the current laws are way to restrictive on the kids that make the game survive.
The game would survive without coaches the players are the game.
Under a competitive bidding system for players it is highly unlikely Carmelo would have gone to Syracuse. Many big schools could have promised more money for ads etc.
 

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