Don McPherson points the finger of blame for 0-5 finish

[Crusty]

Something happened. A team just does not go in the tank that abrubtly without some major event. It is so strange because we had Chandler back from injury when we tanked. We lost PTG and I am sure others were banged up but it is not like Nassib went down. I certainly hope whatever it was is behind us.

 

[Czar]

I see.

So, lets put your analysis together.

An alleged hearsay statement by a player impresses you more than the actual performance of the team at Heinz Field during the final game of the year.

Wow.

I don't see how Nassib saying it makes it hearsay...

 

[OrangePA]

I don't see how Nassib saying it makes it hearsay...

I guess I never heard the "alleged" comment attributed to Ryan Nassib.

Do you have a link?

Still, the actual fact is the actual fact. The Orange played hard to bitter end against the Panthers and were one drive - and one Nassib INT - away from winning the game at Heinz Field.

I was there and so no quit in the Orange.

 

[orangenauburn]

I guess I never heard the "alleged" comment attributed to Ryan Nassib.

Do you have a link?

Still, the actual fact is the actual fact. The Orange played hard to bitter end against the Panthers and were one drive - and one Nassib INT - away from winning the game at Heinz Field.

I was there and so no quit in the Orange.

he said it in a syracuse.com article ... there was a lengthy discussion post on this board regarding it

 

[OrangePA]

he said it in a syracuse.com article ... there was a lengthy discussion post on this board regarding it

He specifically quoted Keon Lyn in a PS article?

 

[orangenauburn]

no - Ryan Nassib ... Nassib said there were divisions

 

[Crusty]

W Va game was one of those night s where everything went right, it happens, and it made these guys think they were better then they were. Hopefully everyone learned from the experience . If you remember we were not a ball of fire before that game.

WVA plays that stupid passive defense (3-3-5 stack I think it is called) and it was exactly the wrong thing to do against us.

 

[Crusty]

There's a huge leap from "not very good" to 1-6 in the Big East.

You don't go from a downright pasting of a Top 20 team to dropping 5 straight to mediocre-at-best competition without some issues that go beyond just not being very good.



I remember reading about Lyn (allegedly) telling someone that he hopes they lose so they don't have to go to a bowl game.

Lyn was suspended for the Pittsburgh game last year for what Marrone called ‘conduct detrimental to the team’, I guess that was what it was.

 

[OrangePA]

no - Ryan Nassib ... Nassib said there were divisions

Yeah, I remember Ryan saying something like that, but I don't remember him calling out a specific player.

 

[Czar]

Yeah, I remember Ryan saying something like that, but I don't remember him calling out a specific player.

No, Marrone did that. By suspending the kid.

 

[OrangePA]

No, Marrone did that. By suspending the kid.

Did Marrone state publicly what Lyn supposedly said?

 

[Moontan]

Did Marrone state publicly what Lyn supposedly said?

Of course not. Actions speak louder than words.

Between that and PT's suspension I'm sure there was tension in the locker room.

Were players disappointed with results at the end of last season? I sure hope so. Did one or more cross the line in handling that disappointment? Apparently so.

However, what I saw, is that those that played against Pitt definitely played to win. It's a shame that things didn't work out that game, nor the Yukon and RU games... ugh.

 

[OrangePA]

Of course not. Actions speak louder than words.

Between that and PT's suspension I'm sure there was tension in the locker room.

Were players disappointed with results at the end of last season? I sure hope so. Did one or more cross the line in handling that disappointment? Apparently so.

However, what I saw, is that those that played against Pitt definitely played to win. It's a shame that things didn't work out that game, nor the Yukon and RU games... ugh.

These are kids.

Sometimes they do and say stupid things.

It happens with every program.

Should have beaten Rutgers - probably should have beaten UConn - could have very easily beaten Pitt.

Change a few plays and the Orange is rated much higher in the pre-season picks this fall.

 

[Scooch]

These are kids.

Sometimes they do and say stupid things.

It happens with every program.

Should have beaten Rutgers - probably should have beaten UConn - could have very easily beaten Pitt.

Change a few plays and the Orange is rated much higher in the pre-season picks this fall.

Little quibble... these are young adults, not kids.

I have kids, it's hard to hold them too accountable for the stupid stuff they do, because they don't know better. Young adults know better, they just make stupid choices, and should be held accountable.

Not a huge deal, but the semantics of those words are important in these cases IMHO.p

 

[SWC75]

The quote by McPherson was in response to my question. Here is the full question and response for context:

Q: In 1986, following a bowl season, the Orange started out 0-4, beart a bad Missouri team and then got crushed by Penn State. From that point, SU won four of it's last five games and then went 11-0-1 in 1987. Last year, following a bowl season, the Orange started 5-2, blowing out West Virginia along the way, and then SU went 0-5. How does that happen? How do apparently bad teams get good and apparently good teams go bad?

A: I think what happens is chemistry. I think the first half of the season is coaches setting the tone; the second half of the season is the player setting the tone because they start to control the locker room. The starting unit spends more time together. they learn how to communicate better. When you look at the teams that get better during the year, it's because you have good personnel that communicates well.

Coach Mac said years ago that when you're a young coach, you think it's 80% coaching and 20% players. Then you get a little bit more mature and you think it's a 50-50 thing. Then, when you get older and you really know what you're doing, you realize it's 90% players and 10% coaching. And it's true. When you do your job well as a coach and the players buy into what you're talking about, they start to set the tone.

With the Syracuse team last year, there were some disruptions in the coaching staff and personnel. Sometimes you can make that one wrong move in one of those areas and you can lose the team. And I think that's what happened with SU. I don't know what it was internally but I believe last eyar's team stopped communicating with each other. it was very evident in the games I covered for SNY that you didn't see that positve non-verbal communciaiton happening. You saw a lot of hands in the air after players, which meant they weren't communicaitng during plays."

His reference to coaching changes would have to be for coaching changes before last season, not since. But he's basically putting the blame on the players for poor chemistry and not communciating.

 

[SWC75]

I guess I never heard the "alleged" comment attributed to Ryan Nassib.

Do you have a link?

Still, the actual fact is the actual fact. The Orange played hard to bitter end against the Panthers and were one drive - and one Nassib INT - away from winning the game at Heinz Field.

I was there and so no quit in the Orange.

I don't think then end of games was the problem. I think it was the begining. Twice I tuned in at Noon for Noon games and we were already down 0-7. Another time the other team scored within a minute. When you get punched in the face right off the bat, it can take time to recover and you can find yourself playing catch-up the whole game which takes a lot of energy and efficiency. Haivng to come from behind all the time can deprive you of the former and last year's team didn't have much of the latter.

 

[OrangePA]

I don't think then end of games was the problem. I think it was the begining. Twice I tuned in at Noon for Noon games and we were already down 0-7. Another time the other team scored within a minute. When you get punched in the face right off the bat, it can take time to recover and you can find yourself playing catch-up the whole game which takes a lot of energy and efficiency. Haivng to come from behind all the time can deprive you of the former and last year's team didn't have much of the latter.

Yes, the beginning of the Pitt game was a disaster. I think the Orange fumbled the opening KO? We were down by at least two scores almost from the outset.

I'm not sure I can attribute the beginning of the game to lack of effort though - it was just a series of unfortunate mistakes.

But, the most important fact is that despite getting punched in the face at the start, the team didn't quit - it did not get blown out but came back and had the ball at the end with a chance to win the game.

That's the point - the team didn't quit.

 

[SWC75]

Yes, the beginning of the Pitt game was a disaster. I think the Orange fumbled the opening KO? We were down by at least two scores almost from the outset.

I'm not sure I can attribute the beginning of the game to lack of effort though - it was just a series of unfortunate mistakes.

But, the most important fact is that despite getting punched in the face at the start, the team didn't quit - it did not get blown out but came back and had the ball at the end with a chance to win the game.

That's the point - the team didn't quit.

It's not aobut the team quiting. It's about confidence and focus. That's what I think was lacking.

 

[OrangePA]

It's not aobut the team quiting. It's about confidence and focus. That's what I think was lacking.

You may be right, but the discussion was about Marrone supposedly losing the team - that the team gave up toward the end of the season.

That was what I was addressing.

Confidence and focus are nebulous terms for me - hard to address on any more than an individual basis - at least for me.

 

[SWC75]

You may be right, but the discussion was about Marrone supposedly losing the team - that the team gave up toward the end of the season.

That was what I was addressing.

Confidence and focus are nebulous terms for me - hard to address on any more than an individual basis - at least for me.

To me "losing the team" mean the players, or some of them anyway, have lost faith in what the coaches are doing and/or in each other. You can still "play hard" but if you don't believe in what you are doing, you won't play well. I actually think the beginning of the game has more to do with that than the end.

I don't know what happened last year. Neither does Don McPherson. He actualy suggested that it was primarily on the players. I hope he's right. I also hope that with a higher percentage oif the team being Marrone recruits, (to whom he would have explained what they were getting into if the came to SU), that this will be less of a problem this year.