Duke and North Carolina’s transitions are why I hope we don’t hire an internal candidate as next HC

[phil77]

I want a change and to not hire from within only because I want a serious change in the style of play. I don't trust anyone on our bench to run anything but what JB has been teaching. Just think we need an entire fresh approach on the way we do things.

 

[kcsu]

Red Gmac Griff Devo

 

[Orangefizz]

Red Gmac Griff Devo

Red Hop GMac Griff

 

[SmilinBob]

Red Gmac Griff Devo

If Red is HC, I would like some experienced ex HC to be on the bench with him.

 

[Entropic]

Just curious how much recruiting you have to do to get guys to come play at Duke? Make a phone call and ask?

Hard to consider someone the best recruiter in CBB when it may be the easiest recruiting job in CBB. It's like recruiting to Alabama for football. Offer all blue chips and the take your pick when the majority say yes please.

 

[SUMJF]

It was a really weird point you made. We’d be lucky to have Scheyer and/or Davis to turn to. You realize “the guy at Duke” you keep referring to is widely regarded as the best recruiter in CBB?

I will now do what you did to me. Widely regarded as the best recruiter in CBB by whom?
Capel did a better job at Duke before he went to Pitt.

Plus Calipari is better than Scheyer no doubt as a recruiter.

 

[Cusefan0307]

There’s more to a basketball coach than recruiting. I can’t believe we are still having this conversation.

 

[Cuse181]

If you hire someone because you offered him the most money, rest assured that he will be gone if he is successful enough to get a better offer.
We had two strengths: beast of the East with its rivalries, and coaching consistency. We lost the first and now you want us to lose the second.
Consider the downside if a new outside hire is either unsuccessful or a short termer. Reality check - we are no longer a destination school. We are a stepping stone. The logical choice is Red.

Strongly disagree syracuse is a “stepping stone” I would argue there are 4 places at most you go after Syracuse: Duke, UNC, Kansas, or Kentucky. Anywhere else you’re essentially stepping sideways.

 

[teknoge3k]

As of current, North Carolina also has the #1 recruiting class coming in next year. Davis is just fine.

 

[Newhouser]

Duke is probably missing the 4 or 5 calls a game Coach K got. I too want to go outside the family as I think we need a new vision, but if it is in house and it's not Red there are going to be some questions that will need to be answered.

 

[SUMJF]

As of current, North Carolina also has the #1 recruiting class coming in next year. Davis is just fine.

North Carolina doesn’t even have top 10 class yet. They are close to getting a 5 star that will move them up. Kentucky clearly has the top 2023 recruiting classes with consensus top player and 2 other top 10 prospects in their class.

Duke has a higher 2023 class as of now than North Carolina.
Carolina got a 5 star 2024 kid who is a stud who could reclassify but their class isn’t close to the top class in 2023.

In fact Carolina lost it’s top 2023 commit to South Carolina before this season.

 

[Cusefan0307]

As of current, North Carolina also has the #1 recruiting class coming in next year. Davis is just fine.

He brought in a good class this year too and they are contributing almost nothing. This is not football. You need to be able to coach and develop too.

 

[Bayside44]

Strongly disagree syracuse is a “stepping stone” I would argue there are 4 places at most you go after Syracuse: Duke, UNC, Kansas, or Kentucky. Anywhere else you’re essentially stepping sideways.

We are a top 5 payday?

FWIW in this thread, by the time Scheyer got on the bench K was rolling out the ball in his one and done phase of life, which didn't go as well as when he had 3 and 4 year guys everywhere - but it was a bit gilded.

Obviously him and Hubert are steps down from K and Roy, anyone minus maybe Tony Bennett would be.

I like the idea of a Syracuse kid who's done time at various schools at various levels coming home and applying his experiences to the program.

 

[Cuse181]

If Red is HC, I would like some experienced ex HC to be on the bench with him.

Perhaps, Jim Boehiem?

/s

We are a top 5 payday?

FWIW in this thread, by the time Scheyer got on the bench K was rolling out the ball in his one and done phase of life, which didn't go as well as when he had 3 and 4 year guys everywhere - but it was a bit gilded.

Obviously him and Hubert are steps down from K and Roy, anyone minus maybe Tony Bennett would be.

I like the idea of a Syracuse kid who's done time at various schools at various levels coming home and applying his experiences to the program.

I’m not sure we are top 5, but I wouldn’t put us outside the top-15 come time to do a competitive search. That being said, the prestige of the ACC (in basketball) paired with the history of Syracuse, the captive fanbase, and the continued investment in facilities makes Syracuse a very attractive destination. That could change in 10 years with conference realignment continuing but at this point - Syracuse is well positioned to make an external move.

 

[73CAV]

Regardless of how Syracuse proceeds, it's worth recalling the coaching history of some of these legends. Dean Smith was an internal promotion when Frank McGuire was forced out, and Smith was hanged in effigy early in his reign for not producing. Lots of folks at Duke questioned the Krzyzewski hire in his first years. He inherited a team with some elite talent (Eugene Banks, Kenny Dennard, Vince Taylor), but still went 17-13 (6-8 in the conference) in his first year. He was worse in the following years: 10-17 (4-10) and 11-17 (3-11). I don't think you can accurately judge a coach during the transition. Sometimes the results are indicative, and other times they are not.

 

[Eric15]

At the end of the day, we can point to anecdotal examples, but there's no all-encompassing best practice. Sometimes internal hires work out, sometimes it's best to conduct a national search.

I personally would lean towards the latter and prefer we stop this madness that the entire SU coaching staff needs to be comprised of former SU basketball players. It's clearly not leading to success on the court over the past decade.

 

[AlaskaSU]

Oh, ok. Guess I better become a hockey fan then. It’s over.

Stay a fan but prepare to be disappointed in basketball as we will not return to being a perennial elite team. We will have our moments. Our consistency was unprecedented and is unlikely to be repeated

Our fundamentals have changed. Syracuse Georgetown was once the most watched in season game, prime time, national audience. UConn, Nova, Pitt were not far behind. Those days are gone forever.

Take comfort that the revenue is good and we are thus able to excel in a variety of sports. We are currently #5 in overall athletic performance.

 

[Cuse181]

Stay a fan but prepare to be disappointed in basketball as we will not return to being a perennial elite team. We will have our moments. Our consistency was unprecedented and is unlikely to be repeated

Our fundamentals have changed. Syracuse Georgetown was once the most watched in season game, prime time, national audience. UConn, Nova, Pitt were not far behind. Those days are gone forever.

Take comfort that the revenue is good and we are thus able to excel in a variety of sports. We are currently #5 in overall athletic performance.

New rivalries will form over time and conference foe success will beget further success. Pitt and Louisville’s fall after Jamie Dixon and Pitino respectively had as much to do with killing the rivalries as the move to the ACC and Syracuse’s decline did. Early Syracuse Duke games returned fantastic numbers but with coach K gone, it’s going to take time to build up that into some sort of rivalry. Transitions occur with every school eventually and despite the macro impact of realignment, basketball schools will still find a niche existence and Syracuse will likely continue to fall into the category.

 

[AlaskaSU]

Strongly disagree syracuse is a “stepping stone” I would argue there are 4 places at most you go after Syracuse: Duke, UNC, Kansas, or Kentucky. Anywhere else you’re essentially stepping sideways.

See what orange colored glasses can do for you. If recruits thought we were still relevant they would not spurn us in such large numbers.

 

[Cuse181]

See what orange colored glasses can do for you. If recruits thought we were still relevant they would not spurn us in such large numbers.

That’s interesting because here I’m being told the coach not talking to the players and playing an outdated system is impacting the recruiting. Nothing exists in a vacuum

 

[Cusefan0307]

See what orange colored glasses can do for you. If recruits thought we were still relevant they would not spurn us in such large numbers.

What has JB done to help recruiting?

 

[AlaskaSU]

New rivalries will form over time and conference foe success will beget further success. Pitt and Louisville’s fall after Jamie Dixon and Pitino respectively had as much to do with killing the rivalries as the move to the ACC and Syracuse’s decline did. Early Syracuse Duke games returned fantastic numbers but with coach K gone, it’s going to take time to build up that into some sort of rivalry. Transitions occur with every school eventually and despite the macro impact of realignment, basketball schools will still find a niche existence and Syracuse will likely continue to fall into the category.

The only National rivalry game in the ACC is Duke Carolina. When we play Duke it fires up our fans but no one else in the country cares, including Duke. We have no natural rivals in the ACC.

 

[Cusefan0307]

The only National rivalry game in the ACC is Duke Carolina. When we play Duke it fires up our fans but no one else in the country cares, including Duke. We have no natural rivals in the ACC.

#JBColoredglasses.

 

[AlaskaSU]

That’s interesting because here I’m being told the coach not talking to the players and playing an outdated system is impacting the recruiting. Nothing exists in a vacuum

How do you explain that the same coach that "does not talk to his players and who always plays an outdated system" used to be successful? Did he talk to his players more? Did he forget how to play zone?

 

[Cusefan95]

Scheyer is doing fine at Duke. He’s basically playing almost all freshman and none of them, except maybe Filipowski is at anywhere near the level of other freshman classes at Duke. Davis has won five in a row, so I wouldn’t right them off yet either. They are both recruiting at an elite level. Davis is recruiting better than Williams. What more do you want?

I’m hoping he is to Duke what Mike Davis is to Indiana - just good enough to last 6-7 years at the school while presiding over a steady decline that takes decades to recover from.

Would be awesome if it happens to UNC, too (Although Duke/UNC/Louisville/Syracuse all hitting historic lows simultaneously would probably devastate the ACC, so I acknowledge I should be careful what I’m wishing for here. Maybe just UNC OR Duke circling the drain is enough to be happy about).