Dungey as the #2

[TheCusian]

If he's that much better than Hunt, than start him and go all in. I don't dispute that Hunt has warts, that he isn't an NFL prospect, or that other players might have better long term potential. But I seriously doubt that a true frosh who didn't garner in-state offers from either of the two in state teams is ready to come in and lead us to a bowl THIS YEAR. And again, I love Dungey--I hope he ends up being the second coming here. I hope he's a four year starter for us--hence, why I'm advocating that we don't burn a redshirt year for some token snaps. I'm not refuting the coaching staff as you suggest above, assessing that Dungey is a darkhorse that could be a great player in our system. Disco. Can't wait to see that. And if he's better than Hunt now--which I find difficult to believe, not because I think Hunt is so great, but because so few true frosh QBs are adequately prepared to play their true freshman years--then play him now, and play him extensively.

He's not better. Yet. Lester said in an interview that Hunts been grading out the highest, so he's the starter.

I think they think his ceiling is way higher and live game reps could really push him fwd.

 

[TheCusian]

We also didn't think Morant would have shown up in the red zone and then disappeared for a season, so...:noidea:

1 kid from a different coaching regime does not make it a pattern. There's little to no correlation. And theirs always risks - In both directions.

 

[RF2044]

He's not better. Yet. Lester said in an interview that Hunts been grading out the highest, so he's the starter.

I think they think his ceiling is way higher and live game reps could really push him fwd.

No argument there. But again, long term potential isn't what's being discussed in this thread.

I have zero issue with any prognostications indicating that Dungey has better long term upside than Hunt, that he's more of an NFL prospect, etc.

Whether that translates into him giving us a better chance of winning this year is an entirely different matter.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

1 kid from a different coaching regime does not make it a pattern. There's little to no correlation. And theirs always risks - In both directions.

Well, I was going to say I don't know what to expect given that Shafer punts from the opponents side of the field, but I figured you might not like that example as much.

 

[Jake]

One final thought...there is a huge difference between red shirting and being on the two deep.

And it's a point towards development that I'm sure a couple of posters here that are coaches could attest to.

When you tell a kid he's red shirting, no matter how good a kid he is, they relax. Their effort and energy take a step back and they're not as focused.

When you tell a kid that he's one play from game action, their prep and attention to detail is much sharper.

Dungey is going to be part of every game prep meeting and walk through as if he's playing.

That is a huge difference than telling a kid he's going to sit this year and would only at in an apocalypse.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

One final thought...there is a huge difference between red shirting and being on the two deep.

And it's a point towards development that I'm sure a couple of posters here that are coaches could attest to.

When you tell a kid he's red shirting, no matter how good a kid he is, they relax. Their effort and energy take a step back and they're not as focused.

When you tell a kid that he's one play from game action, their prep and attention to detail is much sharper.

Dungey is going to be part of every game prep meeting and walk through as if he's playing.

That is a huge difference than telling a kid he's going to sit this year and would only at in an apocalypse.

I agree with all of this. I also propose that it is possible for your #2 QB to be redshirted if there isn't a need for them to play.

 

[007]

Whether that translates into him giving us a better chance of winning this year is an entirely different matter.

I'm on board with most of your points. With respect to the above statement, getting Dungey meaningful, early game experience gives us a better chance of winning this year in the event that Hunt goes down (it will also accelerating Dungey's development for next year). Lester said something to that effect recently, and then jokingly added needing to have 4 QBs ready. They don't want a repeat of last year and they are obviously willing to burn his redshirt to be better prepared. I also suspect that they are anxious to see what they have in Dungey.

 

[jgeorge322]

Its Also probably an indication to wilson that its time to move on. Fwiw i still have faith in aj

 

[CbusCuse]

The only thing that I can say, is there is nothing like in game experience. It's different commanding a huddle in a game than in practice. It's different reading a defense where you don't your what you're going up against. Its different when thousands of people are watching.

I agree on not wasting his shirt so he can take a knee, but if he is going to run through some plays and be out for a few series it is most definitely worth it. It's about a sense of comfortableness, especially at QB, that leads to success. Some of that is natural, but some of it is also learned. If that gives Dungey any sort of jump in 2016, that is why you do it.

I am completely with Otto and RF on this. Snaps for mop up duty do practically nothing to help you for 2016. If they think he is good and are very hopeful in his abilities he needs to redshirt and I don't care what the status is of the coaching staff. I know they need to win but playing Dungey in mop up does not help this year and likely doesn't affect next year. If Dungey is good you may very well be throwing away several wins 4 years from now.

Say Hunt plays well and we actually do blow out our first two opponents (This is not a guaranteed to happen by the way) for a little bit of play where he may get a few pass plays against really bad teams. We are not blowing out anyone else to where he will get meaningful snaps. They will not be subbing in a frosh who has never played for a few drives in a meaningful game if Hunt is playing fairly well. That would be dumb. And this isn't the same situation with Paulis and Nassib. They were different QB's with a different skill set. We brought in Nassib for some running plays, amazingly, and for his strong arm. Hunts game and Dungey's game are pretty similar. There is no change of pace to benefit from or making another team prepare for two different offenses. I like Hunts game other than his questionable accuracy. That would be the only possible thing he could add. We only need to see if that is the case if the season is not going well. If Hunt struggles and you want to see what Dungey has yes you play him. Plus you want to get him "meaningful" experience for next year. If Hunt gets injured yes you play Dungey.

You can't blow a redshirt year making "seperation" for a QB recruit we are bringing in next year who is currently out with a serious injury by the way. I hope Culpepper is the real deal but I am not anywhere near sold at this point. I like his measurables and character etc. He may very well end up being good but the kid has one year of QB experience but his highlights did not exactly a way. Culpepper will still show up here next year if Dungey redshirts and if he is that good he can win the job or at least share some time with Dungey and be a starter his Senior year.

I don't even see how this is a debate.

 

[K Otto XLIV]

I don't expect us to have many mop up situations. Looking at our ACC brethren last year the mop up situations were few.

BC 2 games 8 total passes
FSU 2 games 7 total passes
Miami 4 games 12 total passes
NC St 3 games 6 total passes
Pitt 3 games 18 total passes
VA Tech 2 games 9 total passes
Wake 2 games 8 total passes

Clemson, Louisville, and UVA played two QBs last year. Duke used their 2nd QB situationally. UNC wasn't easy to figure out. I didn't include GA Tech as thew never throw the ball anyway.

Using the above 7 teams as examples there were 2.6 mop up situations per team. In those games the QB threw the ball on average 3.8 times. If Dungey is only playing in 2-3 games and throwing the ball 3-4 in those games, it is not worth it. You can still have Dungey be the #2 QB and have Wilson as the mop up guy. That allows Dungey to develop in practice without wasting a year of eligibility on meaningless snaps.

 

[cuseincincy]

Must be Shafer wants a couple of years of separation between him and Culpepper.

He'll be a Soph (assuming that he plays), and CPep will redshirt.

Don't overthink it. I doubt any QB not on campus has anything at all with this decision.

 

[cuseincincy]

I haven't had time to read this whole thread so maybe someone else has had this thought. Just maybe the coaches realize that they have to start Hunt. Maybe they also have seen that Hunt is not any better throwing the ball than he was the last 2 years. Maybe they watch Dungey and think, "hey, this kid can really play QB._ Make the throws and correct decisions. Maybe they think with a little experience Dungey can take over this year if Hunt doesn't show any improvement. Maybe we finally have a QB on campus.

 

[JDubbin]

I agree with all of this. I also propose that it is possible for your #2 QB to be redshirted if there isn't a need for them to play.

The problem with that thought process is that he's not really the #2 then, unless you are expecting Hunt to play every minute of every game disregarding time and score? If Long or Austin get put in for the so called "mop up duty" then the #2 status on the depth chart has no meaning. If the coaches wanted, hoped or expected Dungey to redshirt then he simply wouldn't be the 2nd option at quarterback.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

The problem with that thought process is that he's not really the #2 then, unless you are expecting Hunt to play every minute of every game disregarding time and score? If Long or Austin get put in for the so called "mop up duty" then the #2 status on the depth chart has no meaning. If the coaches wanted, hoped or expected Dungey to redshirt then he simply wouldn't be the 2nd option at quarterback.

I can easily envision a scenario where they tell Dungey, look, if Hunt goes down, you're going in. If he stays upright though, we've got Wilson here to come in and hand off the football to kill clock. Be ready.

 

[TheCusian]

No argument there. But again, long term potential isn't what's being discussed in this thread. I have zero issue with any prognostications indicating that Dungey has better long term upside than Hunt, that he's more of an NFL prospect, etc. Whether that translates into him giving us a better chance of winning this year is an entirely different matter.

It's not about this year - it's about his development for next year being more important than the 2019 season.

 

[TheCusian]

I agree with all of this. I also propose that it is possible for your #2 QB to be redshirted if there isn't a need for them to play.

This is what Lester has said. If he gets through the first quarter of the season not playing - they will look to preserve his redshirt unless their is a season ending injury to Hunt.

 

[Don]

As Herm Edwards said "hello you play to win the game" if he is truly your second best qb and gives you yur best shot to win if something happens to Hunt or Hunt is not playing well then you have a guy who can come in and help you win the game. 2016 doesn't matter unless your Florida state or alabama and can pick and choose who you want to play qb or any position. We are playing big boy football now and winning is what matters period. If a freshman qb or dl or ol is your best backup or best player you put them in position to play. Nobody would be happy to see him just come in and take a knee but if that's the job of your 2nd string qb that's life.
I sooner think that there will be plays for him or what I actually think is that Hunt will show what everybody already knows in that he will miss wide open receivers and the staff will run him out there to see if they can get a qb to hit receivers in the passing game. Or maybe use him as a change of pace.

 

[hoopsupstate]

I don't think the staff is worrying about 3-4 years down the road. They are only concerned about now. Their best players have to play now.

 

[tipphill]

Hopefully Hunt plays well and Dungey only gets a few games of mop up duty.
Dungey getting on the field in any other situation would indicate a lost season.

i hope so as well, but mop up duty with him should include passing and running as well as handing the ball off

 

[CuseOnly]

Likewise, I disagree completely. Drew Allen was a fifth year guy who never starter before arriving here. Dungey is a first year guy who might start four years if given the opportunity. Not much of a comparison. You don't bungle a year of eligibility getting a guy a few token snaps, offsetting the value of that final year.

Would you rather have had Donovan McNabb as a true freshman instead of McNabb's fifth year?

Truth is, we don't know how good he is until he plays in a game. Coaches may like what they see in practice but that doesn't show anyone what he is really capable of in a live game situation. For all we know, you might be saving a year of eligibility for a 4 year bench rider when another 2-3 QB's that are possibly more talented get here.

Not saying that is what is going to happen but I really believe that he is the " QB of the future"...that is until another "QB of the future" gets here and beats him out. Which would also be fantastic and that we are upgrading the talent all around at QB.

 

[tipphill]

If Hunt gets injured again, the equation changes.

And if Hunt stinks and we are out of bowl eligibility early in the season, the equation also changes. But if the opposite is true, then I'd rather see Hunt play than worry about developmental PT.

if hunt stinks, i hope he is replaced by dungey BEFORE we are out of bowl eligibility.

 

[tipphill]

Dungey is gonna play and we aren't gonna waste his redshirt year just to hand off. Even if it's 60-0 he's gonna run the offense.

imho the only gimme game is rhode island----the rest are either a toss up or in the case of fla.st.,clemson, and lsu --which are losses

 

[CIL]

What if the staff feels Dungey is good enough that he doesn't need a 5th year???

There's a sense here that he is that good, and dare I say is better than Hunt.

 

[Macky44]

That's how I interpreted what you were both saying.

Side note: it's nice to finally get online today after an absurdly busy day and discover that my golden boy is, indeed, being groomed to take the reins at QB. Not much of a secret that I've been high on Eric Dungey for a long, long time.

Who hasnt been high on Dungy since seeing his high school tapes? Kid is a gamer and a serious athlete.

 

[007]

What if the staff feels Dungey is good enough that he doesn't need a 5th year???

There's a sense here that he is that good, and dare I say is better than Hunt.

To me, it speaks volumes about how good they think Dungey is right NOW if they are talking publicly about burning his redshirt. Let's hope they're right.