Dungy just threw Babers under the bus.

[SuFTW]

All I can think of us him standing on the sidelines obvious furious when we started out fast at Ohio (?) and then Dino put freshman Devito in for 4 straight drives where we didn't move the ball. I;m sure he has some bitter feelings towards Dino and knows he owes that big contract to him.

Eric never was a believer in the Devito hype.

 

[SuFTW]

They are not building them. They raised the money from donations.

Are you trying to split hairs?

 

[SWC75]

Because the players were older with more experience.

So teams always get better because of that? Coaching has nothing to do with it? If the 2016-18 teams got better despite Baber's coaching, why didn't the subsequent teams do so as well? Why didn't Shafer win with Marrone's players?

It's an argument designed to deprive a coach of credit so that you can rip him.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Eric never was a believer in the Devito hype.

Yeah, well, the New York Football Giants have invested more in the DeVito hype than the Dungey hype.

 

[Cusefan95]

Marrone was a ass't coach at a high level. Plus, I wouldn't hire him either. People forget, up until the last half dozen games of his last year here, people weren't all that thrilled with Doug.

He’d probably hit his ceiling here and bolted at exactly the right time. From the binders here to leveraging an eight win college season into an NFL head coaching job, Doug’s ability to market himself always far exceeded his actual coaching ability.

The only reason he’s remembered fondly here is the guy after him was terrible, and the guy after that has been terrible outside of one extreme outlier season. Nobody in Jacksonville gives a moments thought to his AFC championship game run (other than possibly to reminisce on how he blew that game and showed his true coaching colors); nobody in Buffalo misses him and some probably forgot he was ever there by this point. I look forward to the day fans here stop idolizing a guy who, by any objective measure - was a very mediocre coach.

 

[Cusefan95]

Yeah, well, the New York Football Giants have invested more in the DeVito hype than the Dungey hype.

That our current head coach couldn’t find a way to be successful with a QB who later made an NFL roster is a huge mark against him as a competent offensive mind. It’s ones of the main reasons I’m on the Fire Dino bandwagon now - there’s been a lot of excuses (but Tommy needed a better o-line!) but none of them stick.

I’ll buy system to a point - but coaches should be able to find and implement the system that allows the talent they have to be successful. Our staff didn’t.

 

[OrangeTarheel]

This is the third and last time I'm going to say this. When there is so much wrong with your team, you get beaten as badly as any historical beating in school history, not once, but three weeks in a row, and you get an open week, you use every minute you have to work on improving what is wrong. Dino sent his team home to get "home cooked meals" instead of working to get better and reviewing film, etc. He even claimed that this 4 days away from football was important. I've played and coached the game and I was absolutely stunned to hear him say something so stupid. He deserves all the criticism he's been given on this board and more for this.

What do others think?

Ive wondered about sending players home as well, is that typical for athletes to head home during a bye week?

I don’t coach football, never have, but I do manage people and it strikes me as odd to send players away from each other at a time when they need to be coming closer together. Under what circumstance would you send athletes home? When you think it won’t matter how much they practice, they’re just not going to improve? Or the players are already so good they can take a break?

Or is this overthinking it, that players just needed a physical break why not let them see their families?

 

[Offthedome]

Larry Sellers? The kid flunking social studies?

OMG, thank you for this! It's good to laugh in this dire time.

I'm dying picturing Walter standing in front of Dino and screaming that scene's famous line!

 

[OttoMets]

Scott Shafer is a more unstable Walter Sobchak.

 

[Bayside44]

You're wrong as I already stated in a previous post you ignored I guess but do you. I'm not saying Shafer was the answer as HC at Syracuse but I give him a lot more credit for his time as a coach here than I do Babers. Both weren't the right fit but we don't win bowl games during Marrone without him and we don't win 10 games in 2018 without his recruits.

Marrone would've had a good coach at DC.

 

[Offthedome]

This is the third and last time I'm going to say this. When there is so much wrong with your team, you get beaten as badly as any historical beating in school history, not once, but three weeks in a row, and you get an open week, you use every minute you have to work on improving what is wrong. Dino sent his team home to get "home cooked meals" instead of working to get better and reviewing film, etc. He even claimed that this 4 days away from football was important. I've played and coached the game and I was absolutely stunned to hear him say something so stupid. He deserves all the criticism he's been given on this board and more for this.

What do others think?

I said the same thing in another thread. He announced that plan in the FSU postgame presser, and my immediate thought was, "Are you kidding me!?!" Maybe, MAYBE if you have a full week and play on a Saturday after the bye. But the game is on Thursday!?!? Go home, and come back and be ready to play in 4 days (with one of those days being a travel day, not a practice day)??

It makes no sense. I've coached travel and high school girls softball, and even at that silly level I knew enough not to back off the prep and focus needed to succeed. You don't run them into the ground, but you know when to send a message, too.

I get that it's a long season, a grind, hard work. But, man, if you want to take a day off, do team activities that say, "We just got beat up for three games. Let's regroup and have one another's back off the field, then get back after it tomorrow."

Heck, just give them a day to sleep it off in the dorm, if you really want them away from the game for a day.

I feel like I'm ranting and rambling here. Sorry, folks. Frustration is in full effect!

 

[HRE Otto IV]

.

His MTSU defense with Sunbelt recruits that beat us you mean? Shafer's defenses were great at Syracuse. So he couldn't coach offense. Ok. Neither can Babers.

They were HR or KO. Shafer's D was very overrated here.

 

[FrancoPizza]

The facilities plans are good but you have to invest in coaching hires as well.

We will know more when they hire Dino's replacement... and the quality of the hired and assistants brought in.

If they go the cheap route on an unproven FCS up-and-comer with like staff coaches on smaller pay packets, we'll know the answer.

If they don’t have unlimited $ to throw at coaches then I’d rather they have invest more into NIL versus trying to fund a good coaching staff that is largely a crap shoot.

No easy answer here. Just saying a good coaching staff with limited NIL may not make much difference if they can’t recruit. Recruiting is all about the $. The days of giving a coach 4 years to right a ship are outdated with NIL/portal. Either we are all in or we’re not.

 

[OrangeDW]

You're wrong as I already stated in a previous post you ignored I guess but do you. I'm not saying Shafer was the answer as HC at Syracuse but I give him a lot more credit for his time as a coach here than I do Babers. Both weren't the right fit but we don't win bowl games during Marrone without him and we don't win 10 games in 2018 without his recruits.

1 class out of 4 were “Shafer recruits”.

Of course some of them were some of the better players - they were seniors.

It’s weird when people give Shafer credit for going 7-6 once - we got absolutely hammered several times. Yet people are in this thread saying even if we get to a bowl Dino should be fired - it would be the exact same season as 2013 though!

Regardless, Shafer’s teams weren’t good and he was an unhinged lunatic on the sidelines, to an embarrassing level. Dino just stares like David Puddy on an airplane. Maybe we’ll find the happy medium with the next guy?

 

[ForCuseSake]

Props to the Scott Shafer Defense League for still going strong 8 years later.

I don’t agree at all with your view that Shafer was screwed but I admire the passion and loyalty.

 

[Cheriehoop]

Yea too bad he couldn’t coach a lick. Even his defenses at MTSU are getting their teeth kicked in on a weekly basis. It was the right combination of some good recruits with Sean Lewis calling plays. I highly doubt the outcome would have been the same in 2018 if Shafer were the HC

Come on - Middle Tennessee has been to 4 bowls since 2017 winning 3 of them, the last beating San Diego St in the Hawaii bowl in 2022. Lots of hyperbole here. No championships but they have been competitive within their league. He was only here 3 years 8 seasons ago. It’s history.

 

[OrangeDW]

All I can think of us him standing on the sidelines obvious furious when we started out fast at Ohio (?) and then Dino put freshman Devito in for 4 straight drives where we didn't move the ball. I;m sure he has some bitter feelings towards Dino and knows he owes that big contract to him.

Look at it from Dino’s perspective:

Dungey has the best season of his life under you. You go 10-3 and finish #14 together, and are a couple plays away from being 12-1.

And he hates you anyway.

Most likely because you made some recruiting promises to land DeVito. That was your guy. You put him in at a weird time in the first game and even pulled Dungey for him in the UNC game - which turned out to be a great move.

But DeVito ended up largely sucking here, and so he hates you too.

Coaching at that level must be brutal, dealing with all these finger pointing self centered crybabies and their parents. Lol.

 

[UpstateSM]

This has turned to a joke but Dino has the best season I'll probably ever see Syracuse football have in my lifetime. If I'm still alive in 20 years my first thought about his tenure will be a positive one.

 

[kcsu]

If they don’t have unlimited $ to throw at coaches then I’d rather they have invest more into NIL versus trying to fund a good coaching staff that is largely a crap shoot.

No easy answer here. Just saying a good coaching staff with limited NIL may not make much difference if they can’t recruit. Recruiting is all about the $. The days of giving a coach 4 years to right a ship are outdated with NIL/portal. Either we are all in or we’re not.

We are above average on NIL below average on using it and below average on how Dino is coaching. We need a dynamic coach who can motivate the team fans and donor base. Dino has failed. Coastal, JMU, NDSU, SDSU, Wyoming, App state, would all beat Syracuse this year and they are not even close to us in resources.

 

[CousCuse]

We are above average on NIL below average on using it and below average on how Dino is coaching. We need a dynamic coach who can motivate the team fans and donor base. Dino has failed. Coastal, JMU, NDSU, SDSU, Wyoming, App state, would all beat Syracuse this year and they are not even close to us in resources.

I don't think a lot of people understand the dynamic of the NIL. The people who put money in the NIL are largely business people. They don't throw money at losing propositions or people that they don't feel can produce. If they did that, they wouldn't have the money to give to the NIL.

 

[FrancoPizza]

We are above average on NIL below average on using it

are you saying we have NIL money left over and we’re just not using it? Also- define above average. We need to be above average in the ACC and P5 to offset the inherent recruiting disadvantages. Being above average out of 117 Div1A would not be cutting it.

 

[SuFTW]

Yeah, well, the New York Football Giants have invested more in the DeVito hype than the Dungey hype.

I guess that means Devito was a better quarterback than Dungey at SU then, because that’s the point you are trying to make.

 

[SuFTW]

So teams always get better because of that? Coaching has nothing to do with it? If the 2016-18 teams got better despite Baber's coaching, why didn't the subsequent teams do so as well? Why didn't Shafer win with Marrone's players?

It's an argument designed to deprive a coach of credit so that you can rip him.

I never said always and that coaching had nothing to do with it. It is absolutely a legitimate factor.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I guess that means Devito was a better quarterback than Dungey at SU then, because that’s the point you are trying to make.

The point I was making is we all love Dungey but not everything he says is gospel.

 

[bigmike]

That our current head coach couldn’t find a way to be successful with a QB who later made an NFL roster is a huge mark against him as a competent offensive mind. It’s ones of the main reasons I’m on the Fire Dino bandwagon now - there’s been a lot of excuses (but Tommy needed a better o-line!) but none of them stick.

I’ll buy system to a point - but coaches should be able to find and implement the system that allows the talent they have to be successful. Our staff didn’t.

This is an excellent point. Coaching is about identifying, cultivating/developing and coaching talent. I think many on this board might say Dino and his various staff members have been pretty good at the identifying part - it’s the other two, in my view, that he has struggled with.