Early Indications Are the New Viking Stadium

[MSOrange]

and every game being televised

Good point. I think that has impacted both football and some of the less popular basketball games.

 

[xc84]

Part of it is simply demographics. The Syracuse metro area in 1990 had a population of around 750K. Today it's around 650K. That, combined with the fact that many large-scale blue collar employers are no longer around.

Central New York halts decline in population, according to latest Census statistics

Syracuse, NY -- After decades of steep population losses, Syracuse and Central New York appear to have halted the decline and turned a corner with some emerging pockets of growth, according to 2010 U.S. Census results released Thursday.

In a stunning surprise to government leaders -- who expected new losses -- Central New York’s population grew by 1.4 percent in the past decade to reach an all-time high of 742,603 in the four-county Syracuse area, the 2010 Census showed.

The population total for Onondaga, Cayuga, Oswego and Madison counties topped the previous record of 742,177 set in 1990, according to U.S. Census Bureau records dating to 1820.

 

[xc84]

The fact that we used to get near sellout crowds for Rutgers and Temple is just incomprehensible now.

Yes. It is. Fans are tired of losing.

 

[DCCuse]

Part of it is simply demographics. The Syracuse metro area in 1990 had a population of around 750K. Today it's around 650K. That, combined with the fact that many large-scale blue collar employers are no longer around.

No offense intended, but I'm sick of seeing this being used as an excuse. If the team was winning, the Dome would be filled on Fall Saturdays. It's that simple. People for the most part don't want to deal with the walk, waiting in lines, other elements of the game experience when they can sit on their asses at home in front of a big screen tv for cheaper. I know people who routinely pay $50-$100 going out on a Friday night, but don't go to a game even though they are football fans. They have the money, they just choose to spend the money elsewhere. Technology and perception of the SU football team over the last 10 years are more of a factor than demographics.

 

[Eric15]

Central New York halts decline in population, according to latest Census statistics

Syracuse, NY -- After decades of steep population losses, Syracuse and Central New York appear to have halted the decline and turned a corner with some emerging pockets of growth, according to 2010 U.S. Census results released Thursday.

In a stunning surprise to government leaders -- who expected new losses -- Central New York’s population grew by 1.4 percent in the past decade to reach an all-time high of 742,603 in the four-county Syracuse area, the 2010 Census showed.

The population total for Onondaga, Cayuga, Oswego and Madison counties topped the previous record of 742,177 set in 1990, according to U.S. Census Bureau records dating to 1820.

Not to get all nerdy now, but there are two ways of measuring the Syracuse area: the metropolitan statistical area (MSA) and the combined statistical area (CSA). I believe the CSA factors in Cayuga County with Auburn while the MSA doesn't.

But in short, the area lost a significant amount of people over the past 30 years, but is very slowly creeping back.

 

[Eric15]

No offense intended, but I'm sick of seeing this being used as an excuse. If the team was winning, the Dome would be filled on Fall Saturdays. It's that simple. People for the most part don't want to deal with the walk, waiting in lines, other elements of the game experience when they can sit on their asses at home in front of a big screen tv for cheaper. I know people who routinely pay $50-$100 going out on a Friday night, but don't go to a game even though they are football fans. They have the money, they just choose to spend the money elsewhere. Technology and perception of the SU football team over the last 10 years are more of a factor than demographics.

No offense taken. I'm not saying demographics is the only reason, but I think it's certainly part of the equation. Combined with obviously the product on the field, and the easy availability of games on TV.

 

[xc84]

But in short, the area lost a significant amount of people over the past 30 years, but is very slowly creeping back.

Not according to that article: "The population total for Onondaga, Cayuga, Oswego and Madison counties topped the previous record of 742,177 set in 1990, according to U.S. Census Bureau records dating to 1820."

 

[Cheriehoop]

and every game being televised

Yes "back in the day" games were blacked out , it was radio or attend the game. I know a number of people I used to work with living about 35 miles from Syracuse who had season's tickets who proudly brag they gave them up for better seats - their couch. Uggh

 

[Millhouse]

The fact that we used to get near sellout crowds for Rutgers and Temple is just incomprehensible now.

i'm skeptical. did they really draw 49 thousand vs temple in 93 after getting shut out two games in a row? i know that's what's reported but i'm not buying it

in 94, they had 45k for rutgers

in 95, they had 39.5k for ECU and 40 for temple

97 had 42 for tulane

98 had 42 for rutgers

99 had 44 for temple

2000 had 36.5 for rutgers

 

[Millhouse]

Yes "back in the day" games were blacked out , it was radio or attend the game. I know a number of people I used to work with living about 35 miles from Syracuse who had season's tickets who proudly brag they gave them up for better seats - their couch. Uggh

it's a long day, it really is. you work all week, you get two days off, people just don't want to waste a whole day without getting entertained. my saturday was way harder work than the rest of the week, you caught a glimpse of that

i think people will give it a shot again but only after it's verified that the offense is worth watching

 

[Eric15]

i'm skeptical. did they really draw 49 thousand vs temple in 93 after getting shut out two games in a row? i know that's what's reported but i'm not buying it

1993 was supposed to be the year that we made a run at a national title. We were preseason #6 which may be our highest preseason ranking ever (I'd have to check the polls in the late 50s/early 60s which would be the only other possible time we would have been higher to start the year). I'm guessing there were a ton of season ticket holders that year.

I was only 11 at the time, but I just get the sense that this was still an idealistic time for SU football fans, and Coach P was still riding a wave of positive fan energy from the Mac era. And then starting around the Troy Nunes era is when the average SU football fan became cynical and negative.

 

[Chip]

If they don't address the pricing structure short term, then none of this matters. Dome on TV looks like an empty gray cavern. When you get the occasional shot of the end zone, look there's all the people! It just looks ridiculous. Every other stadium, you can tell when they don't have a sellout, because the seats in the upper deck furthest from the middle of the field are empty.

$180 for a ticket to ONE GAME on the 35 yard line for one game?

Or $125 for a ticket to SIX GAMES (some years 7) in the corner or end zone.

Donation/Tax deduction aside, it's insane. Gross never did anything about it. Wildhack hasn't done anything about it. So I wonder, is it even in the AD's control? How could an AD look at this and think it's anything close to normal? The upper deck silver on the visiting side is GLARING.

 

[upperdeck]

I would be nice if the 500 yds leads to points someday.. past years it felt like we would never move the ball to score.. the last game felt like we were moving it every drive and not scoring. not sure which is less frustrating, but one at least provides hope.. we scored 28 vs UL and probably should have scored 35. we only scored 20 vs USF but seemed like almost every drive was close to breaking through and since we crossed the 50 like 75% of the time they really were.

Uconn will be the test, outdoors against a decent D. UV really moved the ball pretty easily large parts of the game last week, lets hope we can do the same.

 

[Millhouse]

If they don't address the pricing structure short term, then none of this matters. Dome on TV looks like an empty gray cavern. When you get the occasional shot of the end zone, look there's all the people! It just looks ridiculous. Every other stadium, you can tell when they don't have a sellout, because the seats in the upper deck furthest from the middle of the field are empty.

$180 for a ticket to ONE GAME on the 35 yard line for one game?

Or $125 for a ticket to SIX GAMES (some years 7) in the corner or end zone.

Donation/Tax deduction aside, it's insane. Gross never did anything about it. Wildhack hasn't done anything about it. So I wonder, is it even in the AD's control? How could an AD look at this and think it's anything close to normal? The upper deck silver on the visiting side is GLARING.

i've never seen anything like it, i don't know how it can go on for so long.

 

[upperdeck]

I would like to think the people on the fans committee are discussing this issue when they meet with the school

 

[Cusefan0307]

Not to get all nerdy now, but there are two ways of measuring the Syracuse area: the metropolitan statistical area (MSA) and the combined statistical area (CSA). I believe the CSA factors in Cayuga County with Auburn while the MSA doesn't.

But in short, the area lost a significant amount of people over the past 30 years, but is very slowly creeping back.

False. 463,000 people in Onondaga county in 1980. 468,000 today.

 

[Cheriehoop]

it's a long day, it really is. you work all week, you get two days off, people just don't want to waste a whole day without getting entertained. my saturday was way harder work than the rest of the week, you caught a glimpse of that

i think people will give it a shot again but only after it's verified that the offense is worth watching

I agree with your long day, 2 days off , one spent watching a game analysis.

However the people I worked with - cared more about the final outcome than offensive scheme and whether we lose 48 - 27 or 21 - 3 etc.
It was very simple to them : lose - you stink ; win a game you should - meh ; win big games - now you'll get their attention. Frustratingly uncomplicated to them.

 

[xc84]

I agree with your long day, 2 days off , one spent watching a game analysis.

However the people I worked with - cared more about the final outcome than offensive scheme and whether we lose 48 - 27 or 21 - 3 etc.
It was very simple to them : lose - you stink ; win a game you should - meh ; win big games - now you'll get their attention. Frustratingly uncomplicated to them.

I think that sums up the casual fan... which gets us from 30k to 45k

 

[TheCusian]

You have years and years of data. Good times, bad times, winning/losing, economic upticks, economic downturns. If you do your research right (and why wouldn't you for that kind of expense) the answer will be pretty black and white.

This conversation falls into the same category as whether or not a kid made the right choice in leaving for the NBA/NFL: We are short on info, so we're just emotionally guessing.

 

[721Comstock]

False. 463,000 people in Onondaga county in 1980. 468,000 today.

Yeah, and they're all 36 years older now.

There's also the internet, and HDTV, so now those folks can sit in the comfort of their homes, rather than in the sweatbox known as the Carrier Dome, and watch us get destroyed on TV or online instead.

Syracuse is practically the rust belt. Most of upstate/central/western NY is.

People show up for hoops because:
the team wins.
they are relevant nationally.
they are entertaining to watch.
it's an event.
it's not 100 degrees in the Dome during the winter.
(or if it is, they don't mind it so much, due to the above reasons)

 

[Newhouser]

is there any sport that isn't battling dwindling attendance? College football is having attendance issues. The NFL is easing it's blackout rules for a reason. MLB keeps stating attendance is on the rise but it's never been easier or cheaper to get tickets. The live sports experience is being trumped by technology, changing priorities and IMHO society's changing views on alcohol consumption. Bigger, better, and more successful brands than SU are building smaller.

 

[xc84]

Bigger, better, and more successful brands than SU are building smaller.

Who are they (football)?

 

[Bayside44]

Who are they (football)?

Baylor, Stanford. Miami at some point will (outlier).

Houston went on campus. Minny maybe by going back on campus.

 

[Ish88888]

Yes , the provun

If they don't address the pricing structure short term, then none of this matters. Dome on TV looks like an empty gray cavern. When you get the occasional shot of the end zone, look there's all the people! It just looks ridiculous. Every other stadium, you can tell when they don't have a sellout, because the seats in the upper deck furthest from the middle of the field are empty.

$180 for a ticket to ONE GAME on the 35 yard line for one game?

Or $125 for a ticket to SIX GAMES (some years 7) in the corner or end zone.

Donation/Tax deduction aside, it's insane. Gross never did anything about it. Wildhack hasn't done anything about it. So I wonder, is it even in the AD's control? How could an AD look at this and think it's anything close to normal? The upper deck silver on the visiting side is GLARING.

Yes, the pricing is rediculous. Our seasons at the 38 yd line are $600, $100/game. So the $130-140 tickets are either 3rd party snipers or season ticket holders trying to make a profit which is rediculous. I couldn't ask for $100 for a cuse football ticket with a straight face, even if we were a top 25 team. The problem is the donation paid for sitting between the 35 yard lines. Its approximately 60% of the ticket cost. With no perks like a sideline pass or a great rate on the dumb met life series. Thus, these seats seen on tv will continue to be the silver sea. Wildhack has to address this asap.

 

[TexanMark]

That's a Fuccillo HUGE variable there. Even if the football team went on that kind of run (like 1987-1998) they still may not get those attendance numbers. There was a larger and younger population back then.

Exactly and no evidence of a large scale in flux of fans driving in more than 50 miles.