Ed O'Bannon case could cause seismic NCAA change

[Orangeyes]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/college-football/news/20130401/pat-haden-ed-obannon-ncaa/

 

[CuseFaninVT]

Personally, and for no logical reason, I believe players should be compensated by third party vendors such as EA Sports if they are included in video games that make huge dollars. I am less inclined to believe they should get money for things like t-shirts sold at the college venue. Of for participation in the NCAA tourney. The NCAA doesn't charge prospective pro players marketing fees for telling their story that helps move them up in the public eye, so they shouldn't expect to be compensated for playing in the tourney.

 

[HakAttack]

Really good piece here: http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8914700/ed-obannon-vs-ncaa

I agree. These athletes are essentially providing a service for a company (the NCAA) and are compensated with an education. OK that's cool, but what if I'm a guy like Baye Moussa Keita who's not going to play in the NBA.

My issue with college athletics is that far too often, the NCAA has no plan in place to help athletes prepare for life after their time playing sports is done. Give them all the $$ they can get. I have no issue with that.

 

[Lawrinson14]

Personally, and for no logical reason, I believe players should be compensated by third party vendors such as EA Sports if they are included in video games that make huge dollars. I am less inclined to believe they should get money for things like t-shirts sold at the college venue. Of for participation in the NCAA tourney. The NCAA doesn't charge prospective pro players marketing fees for telling their story that helps move them up in the public eye, so they shouldn't expect to be compensated for playing in the tourney.

I agree 100% with this. Anything related to the college/conference/NCAA including tv deals, march madness, shirts, etc should not go to players. For these things, they get anywhere from $40,000-$120,000 worth of education for free.

However, some of the money made by 3rd party venders like video games should go to the players. These people, like EA sports, are are basically exploiting the players and their likenesses to make money for giant corporations and its shareholders.

 

[Alsacs]

All this will do is eliminate complete non-revenue sports like swimming, soccer, etc. Men's Basketball and Football generate profits in the form of TV and video game contracts, but Women's Basketball, Men's and Women's Hockey, Men's and Women's Lacrosse, Baseball, Softball generate "little" revenue in TV Contracts and these sports will be ones to watch.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

All this will do is eliminate complete non-revenue sports like swimming, soccer, etc. Men's Basketball and Football generate profits in the form of TV and video game contracts, but Women's Basketball, Men's and Women's Hockey, Men's and Women's Lacrosse, Baseball, Softball generate "little" revenue in TV Contracts and these sports will be ones to watch.

And like the article implies, Title IX will force schools to promote non-revenue women's sports at the expense of men's sports. I personally don't have a problem with coaches making less money as a result however.

 

[Alsacs]

And like the article implies, Title IX will force schools to promote non-revenue women's sports at the expense of men's sports. I personally don't have a problem with coaches making less money as a result however.

Well I honestly don't know how teams will comply with Title IX and keep ANY men's sports beyond Football and Basketball. You can't have 85 scholarships in Football and 12 in Basketball pay these athletes legitimate wages and then come up with 97 women's scholarship athletic sports and "pay them" when they won't be bringing in ANY revenue and will be costing double. The reason why Men's Basketball and Football players won't get paid is because if they do you will see the other sports complain about the fact they aren't getting paid ALL it will take is for ONE men's swimmer or ONE woman's golfer complaining about the fact they aren't getting paid and then the Gloria Allred's of the world would be all over college campuses filling class action lawsuits. I think the Men's Basketball and Football players should be paid from a pool of the video games sales that the NCAA profits from the NCAA Football franchise. That way the other sports athletes can't complain.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

Well I honestly don't know how teams will comply with Title IX and keep ANY men's sports beyond Football and Basketball. You can't have 85 scholarships in Football and 12 in Basketball pay these athletes legitimate wages and then come up with 97 women's scholarship athletic sports and "pay them" when they won't be bringing in ANY revenue and will be costing double. The reason why Men's Basketball and Football players won't get paid is because if they do you will see the other sports complain about the fact they aren't getting paid ALL it will take is for ONE men's swimmer or ONE woman's golfer complaining about the fact they aren't getting paid and then the Gloria Allred's of the world would be all over college campuses filling class action lawsuits. I think the Men's Basketball and Football players should be paid from a pool of the video games sales that the NCAA profits from the NCAA Football franchise. That way the other sports athletes can't complain.

Agreed. First cut should be to those football scholarships. That's just silly.

 

[mike32768]

For these things, they get anywhere from $40,000-$120,000 worth of education for free

I'd argue that the education most of them get is NOT worth $40K-$120K. But that's another story

 

[mscanlo]

I'd argue that the education most of them get is NOT worth $40K-$120K. But that's another story

that's their choice. they chose the school or they chose not to apply themselves.

 

[mike32768]

they chose the school or they chose not to apply themselves.

Not sure of your meaning...

Are you saying if Cuse lacked an elite basketball program and its scholarships, that the typical Orange players would have picked SU and its >$100K tuition costs for their degrees in Sports management or Child studies or whatever?

 

[mscanlo]

Not sure of your meaning...

Are you saying if Cuse lacked an elite basketball program and its scholarships, that the typical Orange players would have picked SU and its >$100K tuition costs for their degrees in Sports management or Child studies or whatever?

no, i am saying the ncaa athletes have the opportunity to maximize their degree but many chose an athletic program over academics (they pick a school with inferior academics to instead play a sport, or they pick a major that isn't maximizing their potential benefit)

 

[Orangezoo]

in my opinion this will just simply eliminate some of those products that feature college athletes. The obannon case shut off the creation of college basketball video games and football would likely follow suit. i agree that they should be compensated for some things but the royalty fees would force those goods to a price point where no one would buy them essentially just eliminating those products.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

in my opinion this will just simply eliminate some of those products that feature college athletes. The obannon case shut off the creation of college basketball video games and football would likely follow suit. i agree that they should be compensated for some things but the royalty fees would force those goods to a price point where no one would buy them essentially just eliminating those products.

I just can't believe that is true. Madden comes out with a new game every year. I bet those guys are getting paid, along with the NFL. If they can learn to share I'm sure the NCAA and the players can as well.

 

[Alsacs]

I just can't believe that is true. Madden comes out with a new game every year. I bet those guys are getting paid, along with the NFL. If they can learn to share I'm sure the NCAA and the players can as well.

The difference between NCAA Football and Madden are that the NFLPA negotiates the license fee for the players and they are all given a small check for their name and likeliness being in the game while the NCAA Football players don't have a union or representative negotiating for them thus instead of Ryan Nassib being the Syracuse its QB #12 from Pennsylvania. All the money from NCAA Football goes to the NCAA and EA Sports instead of the players whose likeliness and numbers are being used.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

The difference between NCAA Football and Madden are that the NFLPA negotiates the license fee for the players and they are all given a small check for their name and likeliness being in the game while the NCAA Football players don't have a union or representative negotiating for them thus instead of Ryan Nassib being the Syracuse its QB #12 from Pennsylvania. All the money from NCAA Football goes to the NCAA and EA Sports instead of the players whose likeliness and numbers are being used.

I understand that. Kind of why I made my post.

 

[Orangezoo]

I just can't believe that is true. Madden comes out with a new game every year. I bet those guys are getting paid, along with the NFL. If they can learn to share I'm sure the NCAA and the players can as well.

I could see this if there were only 28 teams but you are talking about 300 plus basketball and a 100 plus football programs. Thats a lot more checks than there are for professional sports. The union is one problem but the sheer number of athletes is a problem as well. Right now they market for around $60 per game sold. With all the mobile gaming and cheaper solutions out there once you push those games to 70-80 per pop only the hardcore are willing to buy it and you can't get the volume to cover the investment.

 

[timkay99]

I understand that. Kind of why I made my post.

How does the NCAA sell these rights though? If you recall, EA published a college baseball game years ago. Do they still own those rights so another company can't obtain them?

If that is the case, shouldn't those athletes be compensated (because a company owns their rights)?

 

[CuseFaninVT]

How does the NCAA sell these rights though? If you recall, EA published a college baseball game years ago. Do they still own those rights so another company can't obtain them?

If that is the case, shouldn't those athletes be compensated (because a company owns their rights)?

Not saying I know how to make the specifics work. That's for attorneys and the like. Just saying it feels like this is appropriate.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

I could see this if there were only 28 teams but you are talking about 300 plus basketball and a 100 plus football programs. Thats a lot more checks than there are for professional sports. The union is one problem but the sheer number of athletes is a problem as well. Right now they market for around $60 per game sold. With all the mobile gaming and cheaper solutions out there once you push those games to 70-80 per pop only the hardcore are willing to buy it and you can't get the volume to cover the investment.

I'm not a gamer so I'm not really certain how many different games they have that would come into play here. Seems unlikely that you would need to include any members of the University of Vermont since I highly doubt they have their images used in the games. Truly, I would imagine this really only applies to a very select number of teams - 30 or so would be my initial guess.

 

[timkay99]

Not saying I know how to make the specifics work. That's for attorneys and the like. Just saying it feels like this is appropriate.

But, my point is that EA is the only gaming company to create these games, so it is logical to think that the NCAA sold it as a bundle to EA (basically all collegiate athlete rights), so theoretically everyone gets a piece of the pot whether they are part of a game in active development or not.

I think if this comes to fruition, all previous agreements need to go out the window and you begin selling each sport as an individual. If these previous agreements were to stay in place, every athlete should get a piece of the pie.

 

[Orangezoo]

But, my point is that EA is the only gaming company to create these games, so it is logical to think that the NCAA sold it as a bundle to EA (basically all collegiate athlete rights), so theoretically everyone gets a piece of the pot whether they are part of a game in active development or not.

I think if this comes to fruition, all previous agreements need to go out the window and you begin selling each sport as an individual. If these previous agreements were to stay in place, every athlete should get a piece of the pie.

EA was the only one for football.. for hoops leading up to the lawsuit both 2ksports and ea were creating them.

 

[Orangezoo]

I'm not a gamer so I'm not really certain how many different games they have that would come into play here. Seems unlikely that you would need to include any members of the University of Vermont since I highly doubt they have their images used in the games. Truly, I would imagine this really only applies to a very select number of teams - 30 or so would be my initial guess.

It is such a squishy thing. No images of actual players are used, but there are certainly likenesses that have been ( headbands, accurate number and physical characteristics). From what I have read they were using the likeness ( number, height, weight, race etc) as the basis as opposed to using their actual image. This then means the Catamounts would be eligible for compensation under the case. With that said there really were only 3 games every year this applied to; NCAA Football, NCAA March Madness ( changed its name in 2010 to NCAA Basketball) and College Hoops 2k(insert year). I think the gaming feature played a smaller role than some of the other pieces but I really only read up on the gaming piece of the case.

 

[retro44]

Personally, and for no logical reason, I believe players should be compensated by third party vendors such as EA Sports if they are included in video games that make huge dollars. I am less inclined to believe they should get money for things like t-shirts sold at the college venue. Of for participation in the NCAA tourney. The NCAA doesn't charge prospective pro players marketing fees for telling their story that helps move them up in the public eye, so they shouldn't expect to be compensated for playing in the tourney.

who will establish the pay levels for each school as some are worth millions more than others? street agents on side deals,pro agents out in the open,schools or the ncaa

 

[Orangezoo]

who will establish the pay levels for each school as some are worth millions more than others? street agents on side deals,pro agents out in the open,schools or the ncaa

Thats the problem for sure. Gaming companies would be better suited to simply create fake rosters and let those who want to edit them do so after purchasing the game. The older games like 2k8 - are still updated with current rosters by a dedicated batch of gamers with names, attributes etc. Such a simple task to just let the players do it and share it.